Ortiz and the HOF

[BF4L]

This is the overall issue. Everyone was on something back then. So what do you do? Not allow any of them into HOF? Erase some records?

It is cheating so I would not be against that but how and when do you draw the line? When did it really start? Take a guy who I consider to be one of the best ever Cal Ripken JR. Are you telling me that nothing ever passed his breakfast table that kept him on the field. Ken Griffey JR?

That list can go on and on. I dont buy that anyone was clean in that era.

 

[da55bums]

He's an Angels and Dodgers fan. What do you expect? That's absolutely no different than a Red Sox and Yankees fan.

Hey! hold on, I am a Dodgers fan...thats just not nice....


How many Padres are in the HOF?.....

 

[navamind]

It shouldn't be held against them. But ignoring postseason performance is dumb. Especially in the case of guys like Smoltz and Jeter, who played about a season's worth of games in the postseason. Smoltz has 209 postseason IP. Jeter has over 700 plate appearances.

And it's not true at all that postseason performance doesn't effect HOF voting. Just look at Jack Morris.

 

[StanMarsh51]

Hey! hold on, I am a Dodgers fan...thats just not nice....


How many Padres are in the HOF?.....

I'm pretty sure he's talking about being BOTH a Dodgers and Angels fan..

 

[Davis_Mike]

I would have to say no. There are better players with better stats that are not in HoF. And to add to that, Edgar also isn't in there. Then you have his PED issue & the PED issue in general. He will never get in.

 

[Brahmsian]

There's always some controversy in HOF matters.

If Ortiz gets in I would cheer for him, if he doesn't I'd sympathize. He was at least decent with the glove before
his injuries started to mount up, and he's coped well with those injuries. How much that should count for
is debatable, but it's definitely not a minus.

 

[ImSmartherThanYou]

There's always some controversy in HOF matters.

If Ortiz gets in I would cheer for him, if he doesn't I'd sympathize. He was at least decent with the glove before
his injuries started to mount up, and he's coped well with those injuries. How much that should count for
is debatable, but it's definitely not a minus.

Um... what??? Are you confusing him with Edgar Martinez?

Ortiz never had any glove. He was always a DH. And he was never good with the glove. And no injuries ever mounted up.

 

[Brahmsian]

Um... what??? Are you confusing him with Edgar Martinez?

Ortiz never had any glove. He was always a DH. And he was never good with the glove. And no injuries ever mounted up.

Maybe you haven't heard about the injuries, since Ortiz doesn't complain about them when the press is nearby,but he has had many. Mostly lower leg ones.

Speed never was his his strong suit, but what little he ever had is almost gone.

 

[LogicMan]

Rizzuto got in (yes, I know, the veterans voted him in). This means, just about 95% of all players who ever played the game have a chance.

I imagine in 25 years, thats how Ortiz will get in. Among his peers he is feared more than any other player of this generation come clutch time. They will be sitting around drinking going.hmmm....I know Jeter hit lots of singles, but did he ever carry a team? hmmm, that guy David did.

 

[soxfan1468927]

Um... what??? Are you confusing him with Edgar Martinez?

Ortiz never had any glove. He was always a DH. And he was never good with the glove. And no injuries ever mounted up.

Maybe he means decent with a batting glove

 

[StanMarsh51]

Rizzuto got in (yes, I know, the veterans voted him in). This means, just about 95% of all players who ever played the game have a chance.

I imagine in 25 years, thats how Ortiz will get in. Among his peers he is feared more than any other player of this generation come clutch time. They will be sitting around drinking going.hmmm....I know Jeter hit lots of singles, but did he ever carry a team? hmmm, that guy David did.

Rizzuto was a lot better than you're giving him credit for, although I wouldn't say he's HOF worthy....he had a 40.6 career WAR, which is quite good (and that's with him missing 3 years due to WW2)...remember, shortstops weren't hitting like Nomar or A-Rod or Jeter back in that era. By comparison, Ortiz' career isn't much higher at 44.2.

The notion that he was some scrub player and 95% of players have a chance because he got in is a major stretch.

 

[navamind]

Rizzuto was a lot better than you're giving him credit for, although I wouldn't say he's HOF worthy....he had a 40.6 career WAR, which is quite good (and that's with him missing 3 years due to WW2)...remember, shortstops weren't hitting like Nomar or A-Rod or Jeter back in that era. By comparison, Ortiz' career isn't much higher at 44.2.

The notion that he was some scrub player and 95% of players have a chance because he got in is a major stretch.

Keep in mind Rizzuto's 40.6 WAR came in 6718 PA, which is a pretty short career. In comparison, Nomar had 44.2 in 6116 PA (though almost all of that WAR came in a 7 year span (97-03).

There are far more egregious selections than Rizzuto.

 

[Wazmankg]

Maybe you haven't heard about the injuries, since Ortiz doesn't complain about them when the press is nearby,but he has had many. Mostly lower leg ones.

Speed never was his his strong suit, but what little he ever had is almost gone.

So if the press doesn't know about these injuries how do you ? Are you two special buds or something ?

 

[Bulldog]

He's an Angels and Dodgers fan. What do you expect? That's absolutely no different than a Red Sox and Yankees fan.

At least I'm smart enough not to be a Padres fan!

 

[Bulldog]

And it's not true at all that postseason performance doesn't effect HOF voting. Just look at Jack Morris.

____________________________________________

Why should it work for them? So players with similar regular seasonal stats should be penalized because they never had the opportunity to play in post season play. Look at all the guys in the HOF who have poor post season stats. Does that mean they shouldn't be in the HOF?

 

[StanMarsh51]

____________________________________________

Why should it work for them? So players with similar regular seasonal stats should be penalized because they never had the opportunity to play in post season play. Look at all the guys in the HOF who have poor post season stats. Does that mean they shouldn't be in the HOF?

The way it tends to work is that players who don't have much success in the playoffs generally aren't penalized much, if at all for it, but when a guy has a stellar postseason career, it can give a boost. Fair or not, that's the way it seems.

Postseason is a large reason why a guy like Smoltz appears to be a HOF lock, whereas his regular season career isn't far off from a guy like Kevin Brown.

 

[Liberal Icon]

I would like to see the writers twist themselves into a pretzel when it comes to voting for Ortiz into the Hall considering their sanctimonious take on PED with their recent voting on some of the games biggest stars caught or some even suspected of taking steroids versus millions of fans and their fawning over Ortiz that goes beyond baseball. How many baseball players take 3rd place in write-in for mayoral race? This would be interesting.

 

[Brahmsian]

So if the press doesn't know about these injuries how do you ? Are you two special buds or something ?

TV announcers say more about them than the general press, and they're in the locker room before and after every game.

Plus just watching limp or walk gingerly when the ball's not in play tells me he's not the healthiest player
on the team.

 

[HammerDown]