Ongoing NHL thread - Part deux

[DragonfromTO]

I don't think Hudler will help get a trade done. He's UFA and that same article mentions he's looking for $7 mil. Assuming Stamkos is looking for $11 mil+/- it doesn't make sense that they'd give Hudler that kind of money, especially with the upcoming contracts Yzerman has to deal with (Kucherov this year, Palat, Johnson, Drouin and Hedman next year).

They would also obviously have to negotiate an extension with Stamkos prior to any deal.

I don't know how you make the decision to let Stamkos go because you're worried about re-signing Kucherov or Palat, but they're obviously comfortable with that.

 

[Bloody Brian Burke]

I don't know how you make the decision to let Stamkos go because you're worried about re-signing Kucherov or Palat, but they're obviously comfortable with that.

The whole "triplets" line is off to a slow start but the three of them combined might only cost a couple million more on extensions than Stamkos alone will and last season they outscored Stamkos 200-72 points-wise.

I dunno. I don't envy Yzerman right now because this is a tough as fuck choice to make.

 

[dash]

Stamkos is still only 25, right? I mean it is conceivable that he could be a top goal scorer and point producer in the league for at least the next 8 years. I'd hate to give up on Sam Bennett this early, but you do have a known commodity with Stamkos.

 

[tducey]

Calgary's not getting Stamkos. Cost way to much to get him.

 

[dash]

Calgary's not getting Stamkos. Cost way to much to get him.

I agree that this is the most likely scenario, the package will be way too much that Tampa will be asking for in return and this talk will die down in short order.

 

[Bloody Brian Burke]

I agree that this is the most likely scenario, the package will be way too much that Tampa will be asking for in return and this talk will die down in short order.

If Calgary keeps sucking, just let it happen. Use the season to try and figure out the goaltending (see what they have in Ortio while letting Hiller take his beatings), move Hudler and Jones for picks, see where Bennett fits, get a high draft spot and go from there. A bad season right now wouldn't be the worst thing to happen to the Flames.

Going off and trading a fuck ton of assets for a pending UFA would be such a fucking Burke thing to do, though, so maybe you're screwed.

 

[elocomotive]

This line is some kind of wonderful right now, and they already have a nickname in Washington five games into the season...

 

[DragonfromTO]

The whole "triplets" line is off to a slow start but the three of them combined might only cost a couple million more on extensions than Stamkos alone will and last season they outscored Stamkos 200-72 points-wise.

I dunno. I don't envy Yzerman right now because this is a tough as fuck choice to make.

Do you think that the line falls apart if you replace one of them? I don't. I don't think they're going to be as cheap as you do either.

Stamkos is an elite talent. Everyone that doesn't have a Stamkos type player is looking for one. I'm not sure that you can say the same about Palat or Kucherov. I'd rather let one (or even both) of them go and worry about finding someone else to sit in the back seat on that line than let Stamkos go and have to find someone else who can drive the car on his line.

 

[Bloody Brian Burke]

Do you think that the line falls apart if you replace one of them? I don't. I don't think they're going to be as cheap as you do either.

Stamkos is an elite talent. Everyone that doesn't have a Stamkos type player is looking for one. I'm not sure that you can say the same about Palat or Kucherov. I'd rather let one (or even both) of them go and worry about finding someone else to sit in the back seat on that line than let Stamkos go and have to find someone else who can drive the car on his line.

Even if they cost more than I'm assuming (keep in mind RFA and all that crap, not to mention the cap has probably peaked for the time being given the crapitude of the Canadian dollar) the benefit of keeping that line together might outweigh the benefit of paying more than 1/7 of your cap space to one player in Yzerman's mind. We need to see if they can replicate last season's success, but they got to the Cup last year despite Stamkos being only good, not great in the playoffs. I'm sure that left a mark on Yzerman and if he sees a deal that gives him a younger centre+ for Stamkos he might not be able to say no.

 

[DaBoltsNIsles]

Even if they cost more than I'm assuming (keep in mind RFA and all that crap, not to mention the cap has probably peaked for the time being given the crapitude of the Canadian dollar) the benefit of keeping that line together might outweigh the benefit of paying more than 1/7 of your cap space to one player in Yzerman's mind. We need to see if they can replicate last season's success, but they got to the Cup last year despite Stamkos being only good, not great in the playoffs. I'm sure that left a mark on Yzerman and if he sees a deal that gives him a younger centre+ for Stamkos he might not be able to say no.

What do you think they're worth? I could see Yzerman trading Stamkos. I would expect the team acquiring would want to get a contract done with Stamkos before the trade was announced though. Heck the Blue Jackets should have Yzerman on speed dial. They need star player like him. Besides they have plenty of young talent they could trade to get him. Say they package Murray, Jenner & Rychel or something similar. By no means should Tampa give Stamkos away.

 

[KennyBanyeah]

Do you think that the line falls apart if you replace one of them? I don't. I don't think they're going to be as cheap as you do either.

Stamkos is an elite talent. Everyone that doesn't have a Stamkos type player is looking for one. I'm not sure that you can say the same about Palat or Kucherov. I'd rather let one (or even both) of them go and worry about finding someone else to sit in the back seat on that line than let Stamkos go and have to find someone else who can drive the car on his line.

Just for fun I looked up some advanced stats for the Lightning from last season. All three of the triplets ranked ahead of Stamkos by just about any metric. Interestingly that included QoC. The PDO on the triplet line was eye-popping though in the 1040s across the board.

I obviously would wait for that to extend across multiple seasons (it is still the case this year but you know what I mean). I think Stamkos is a better player by far than any of those guys but Corsi and CorsiREL indicate other wise.

As for their value? I don't watch them game in game out but I kind of compare their to the way Ottawa's top line is playing right now (Stone-Turris-Hoffman). I don't think I'd trade that line for Stamkos, even if he was extended.

 

[dash]

As far as I'm concerned, there are five untouchables on the Flames:

Monahan
Gaudreau
Giordano
Brodie
Hamilton

If you can make a trade for Stamkos and keep those five guys out of the package (and keep the draft picks to 2 or less), then I would strongly consider making the trade. Obviously, you would need Stamkos agreeing to sign a long term deal as a precursor.

 

[Bloody Brian Burke]

What do you think they're worth? I could see Yzerman trading Stamkos. I would expect the team acquiring would want to get a contract done with Stamkos before the trade was announced though. Heck the Blue Jackets should have Yzerman on speed dial. They need star player like him. Besides they have plenty of young talent they could trade to get him. Say they package Murray, Jenner & Rychel or something similar. By no means should Tampa give Stamkos away.

If they stay at last season's pace through next year, it might take $20 mil. If one or two regress, floor would be $15 mil.

I agree that Stamkos shouldn't be donated, but he's also a pending UFA. If they're gonna get a fat package for him it'll have to be sooner rather than later.

And while that would have to be the kind of deal coming from Columbus, how well will they be served losing Murray no matter who the return is? Their defence is rank to begin with; remove Murray from the equation and they're entering Swiss cheese territory. Also, how interested would Stamkos be in signing an extension in Columbus? Not exactly a premium city, the team's a mess, Torts is the coach...don't know if that horse rides.

 

[DaBoltsNIsles]

As far as I'm concerned, there are five untouchables on the Flames:

Monahan
Gaudreau
Giordano
Brodie
Hamilton

If you can make a trade for Stamkos and keep those five guys out of the package (and keep the draft picks to 2 or less), then I would strongly consider making the trade. Obviously, you would need Stamkos agreeing to sign a long term deal as a precursor.

I wish you luck dash. A package around Monahan or Gaudreau would probably be demanded from Yzerman.

 

[Bloody Brian Burke]

As far as I'm concerned, there are five untouchables on the Flames:

Monahan
Gaudreau
Giordano
Brodie
Hamilton

If you can make a trade for Stamkos and keep those five guys out of the package (and keep the draft picks to 2 or less), then I would strongly consider making the trade. Obviously, you would need Stamkos agreeing to sign a long term deal as a precursor.

If those are the untouchables, the deal would probably have to be something like Bennett, Hudler, Kylington, Poirier and two firsts. Dont think I make that trade if I'm the Flames. Just take a run at him or Kopitar in the UFA market.

 

[DaBoltsNIsles]

If they stay at last season's pace through next year, it might take $20 mil. If one or two regress, floor would be $15 mil.

I agree that Stamkos shouldn't be donated, but he's also a pending UFA. If they're gonna get a fat package for him it'll have to be sooner rather than later.

And while that would have to be the kind of deal coming from Columbus, how well will they be served losing Murray no matter who the return is? Their defence is rank to begin with; remove Murray from the equation and they're entering Swiss cheese territory. Also, how interested would Stamkos be in signing an extension in Columbus? Not exactly a premium city, the team's a mess, Torts is the coach...don't know if that horse rides.

Obviously what they get in return for Stamkos would depend on the team acquiring him getting a new contract done first. If Stamkos won't agree to a new contract with the team trying to acquire him, that team should move on. Teams can get creative in a deal for Stamkos. Take the Isles for instance. They could package Okposo & Nielsen along with a young promising player like Nelson or Dal Colle. It all depends on what a team is willing to do. I don't expect the Isles to go after Stamkos. I was just using them as an example as to what a team could do. Any team acquiring Stamkos is going to have to give up at least one good roster player in their offer. Obviously the Leafs would rather wait until Stamkos hits free agency at the end of the season. However, that might not happen.

 

[DragonfromTO]

Just for fun I looked up some advanced stats for the Lightning from last season. All three of the triplets ranked ahead of Stamkos by just about any metric. Interestingly that included QoC. The PDO on the triplet line was eye-popping though in the 1040s across the board.

I obviously would wait for that to extend across multiple seasons (it is still the case this year but you know what I mean). I think Stamkos is a better player by far than any of those guys but Corsi and CorsiREL indicate other wise.

As for their value? I don't watch them game in game out but I kind of compare their to the way Ottawa's top line is playing right now (Stone-Turris-Hoffman). I don't think I'd trade that line for Stamkos, even if he was extended.

That's not the trade off though. Signing Stamkos won't cost Tampa all three, they could probably even make it work so it's only one of them.

 

[forty_three]

Does Stamkos block shots? Maybe we'd be willing to trade Johansen, Dubinsky, Jenner, Foligno and Bob to get him.

I hope Stevie wouldn't need a secound round pick as well. We don't have one of those anymore.

 

[Bloody Brian Burke]

Obviously what they get in return for Stamkos would depend on the team acquiring him getting a new contract done first. If Stamkos won't agree to a new contract with the team trying to acquire him, that team should move on. Teams can get creative in a deal for Stamkos. Take the Isles for instance. They could package Okposo & Nielsen along with a young promising player like Nelson or Dal Colle. It all depends on what a team is willing to do. I don't expect the Isles to go after Stamkos. I was just using them as an example as to what a team could do. Any team acquiring Stamkos is going to have to give up at least one good roster player in their offer. Obviously the Leafs would rather wait until Stamkos hits free agency at the end of the season. However, that might not happen.

You think Leafs have a chance in FA? I half believe he would just because his presence alone would eliminate a full year from the rebuild and let the kids adapt to his game, not to mention they could offer him as much money as it takes, but I also half believe if he does leave TB he wants to be on a contender and the Leafs even with Stamkos are still at least 2 years from that as of now.

I waited patiently as Getzlaf and Perry inched toward free agency only for those dicks to re-sign at the last minute. I have a feeling this might wind up the same lol.

 

[pixburgher66]

Remember this piece of work? The one who hours after boarding a guy said he "takes it with a grain of salt" and that he believed his dangerous and idiotic play "changed the whole game"? It's amazing that his suspension after such a hit did nothing to change his ways!