Ongoing NHL thread - Part deux

[Bloody Brian Burke]

So it sounds to me like Kane "wasn't healthy enough to get in on that" either then?

I find it a little odd that you do the "right" thing by not writing Kessel off because of a single subpar season but then want to bring up a single playoff series (where he was almost certainly playing hurt) against Malkin. The guy who is 2nd among active players in playoff points per game.

73 of his 111 playoff points, or 66% came from 2007-2010. He's a huge part of that team, so a big part of the fact they didn't play as many games in the second half of his career so far does fall on him. Not all, but a big slice.

And Kane's injury was of the freak variety. From 2010-11 to 2013-14, Kane missed 23 of 376 games, or 6%. Malkin missed 167 games in that same span, or 44%. He's clearly got a durability issue that to this point Patrick Kane hasn't had. I'll take the durable, consistent performer over the guy you can't rely on almost half the time to even be able to skate thank you very much.

 

[DragonfromTO]

73 of his 111 playoff points, or 66% came from 2007-2010. He's a huge part of that team, so a big part of the fact they didn't play as many games in the second half of his career so far does fall on him. Not all, but a big slice.

And Kane's injury was of the freak variety. From 2010-11 to 2013-14, Kane missed 23 of 376 games, or 6%. Malkin missed 167 games in that same span, or 44%. He's clearly got a durability issue that to this point Patrick Kane hasn't had. I'll take the durable, consistent performer over the guy you can't rely on almost half the time to even be able to skate thank you very much.

And despite all that, how many seasons has Kane outscored him?

 

[tducey]

St.Louis out again, much like Pittsburgh got to think the Blues will make some changes this offseason.

 

[DragonfromTO]

73 of his 111 playoff points, or 66% came from 2007-2010. He's a huge part of that team, so a big part of the fact they didn't play as many games in the second half of his career so far does fall on him. Not all, but a big slice.

And Kane's injury was of the freak variety. From 2010-11 to 2013-14, Kane missed 23 of 376 games, or 6%. Malkin missed 167 games in that same span, or 44%. He's clearly got a durability issue that to this point Patrick Kane hasn't had. I'll take the durable, consistent performer over the guy you can't rely on almost half the time to even be able to skate thank you very much.

Since 2011 i've got him 4th in postseason points per game.

 

[Bloody Brian Burke]

And despite all that, how many seasons has Kane outscored him?

I know one category he's outscored him in:

 

[DragonfromTO]

I know one category he's outscored him in:

Dave Bolland, also better than Malkin!

Come on man, I know you were kind of joking but give me a break with this bullshit

 

[Bloody Brian Burke]

Since 2011 i've got him 4th in postseason points per game.

Not bad for a second liner facing second d pairings in the weak conference.

 

[Bloody Brian Burke]

Dave Bolland, also better than Malkin!

Come on man, I know you were kind of joking but give me a break with this bullshit

I didn't post a picture of Dave fucking Bolland, I posted a picture of the fucking Conn Smythe winner. But bullshit. Gotcha.

 

[dare2be]

Malkin and a 2nd for McDavid.

Both would be happier. McDavid is used to the area playing for Erie, and well, Edmonton is more like Russia.

 

[dash]

Malkin and a 2nd for McDavid.

Both would be happier. McDavid is used to the area playing for Erie, and well, Edmonton is more like Russia.

Why you heff to be mad, it's only true.

 

[Bloody Brian Burke]

Malkin and a 2nd for McDavid.

Both would be happier. McDavid is used to the area playing for Erie, and well, Edmonton is more like Russia.

Malkin also wouldn't have to worry about playoff scoring in Edmonton, either.

 

[DragonfromTO]

I didn't post a picture of Dave fucking Bolland, I posted a picture of the fucking Conn Smythe winner. But bullshit. Gotcha.

One Conn Smythe trophy, exactly the same number as... Evgeni Malkin.

 

[Bloody Brian Burke]

One Conn Smythe trophy, exactly the same number as... Evgeni Malkin.

Remember when Tim Thomas won the Conn Smythe? Way back in 2011? Feels like a pretty long time ago, right?

Malkin's was 2 years before that.

Anyway, I only brought up the Conn Smythe because you brought up Dave Bolland for some weird reason. Kane's been instrumental in two Cups, including one only two years ago, and also was instrumental in his team reaching the conference finals just last season, only losing in OT of the 7th game. He and his team are also in the second round.

And if Malkin's excuse for his lack of production in these playoffs is injury, I wonder how much better Kane would be right now had he not returned from a broken clavicle a month early to play in the playoffs

 

[DragonfromTO]

Not bad for a second liner facing second d pairings in the weak conference.

Unlike the OHL people actually track quality of competition for the NHL though. And Kane and Malkin's opposition rates pretty evenly this year, Malkin's a little tougher.

I'm also curious, isn't Kane's line the "second" line in Chicago as well? Toews' line faced much tougher competition

 

[DragonfromTO]

Remember when Tim Thomas won the Conn Smythe? Way back in 2011? Feels like a pretty long time ago, right?

Malkin's was 2 years before that.

Anyway, I only brought up the Conn Smythe because you brought up Dave Bolland for some weird reason. Kane's been instrumental in two Cups, including one only two years ago, and also was instrumental in his team reaching the conference finals just last season, only losing in OT of the 7th game. He and his team are also in the second round.

And if Malkin's excuse for his lack of production in these playoffs is injury, I wonder how much better Kane would be right now had he not returned from a broken clavicle a month early to play in the playoffs

If Malkin's playoff success is so so long ago, how does he have a better point per game average since 2011 (the split that you specifically mentioned before) than Kane?

 

[DragonfromTO]

Remember when Tim Thomas won the Conn Smythe? Way back in 2011? Feels like a pretty long time ago, right?

Malkin's was 2 years before that.

Anyway, I only brought up the Conn Smythe because you brought up Dave Bolland for some weird reason. Kane's been instrumental in two Cups, including one only two years ago, and also was instrumental in his team reaching the conference finals just last season, only losing in OT of the 7th game. He and his team are also in the second round.

And if Malkin's excuse for his lack of production in these playoffs is injury, I wonder how much better Kane would be right now had he not returned from a broken clavicle a month early to play in the playoffs

Hasn't we already established that the Blackhawks have built a better team around him than the Penguins have? Isn't that pretty much the explanation for the playoff success that you're seemingly giving Kane individual credit for?

 

[Bloody Brian Burke]

Unlike the OHL people actually track quality of competition for the NHL though. And Kane and Malkin's opposition rates pretty evenly this year, Malkin's a little tougher.

I'm also curious, isn't Kane's line the "second" line in Chicago as well? Toews' line faced much tougher competition

Well, if we want to really get into this we can always debate the usefulness of quality of competition statistics over the course of a season.

 

[Bloody Brian Burke]

If Malkin's playoff success is so so long ago, how does he have a better point per game average since 2011 (the split that you specifically mentioned before) than Kane?

All that downtime during the regular season being injured keeps him fresh for the playoffs?

 

[Bloody Brian Burke]

Hasn't we already established that the Blackhawks have built a better team around him than the Penguins have? Isn't that pretty much the explanation for the playoff success that you're seemingly giving Kane individual credit for?

I'm not saying Kane won the Cup for his team. Not once did I even give that impression, other than showing he's won two Cups and been either the top or second-best scorer on his team in those runs. I said in the post you quoted "He and his team" or some form of that twice.

And yes, the Hawks have built a better team around their big two. Like I said, I only brought up the Conn Smythe because you brought up Bolland.

 

[DragonfromTO]

Well, if we want to really get into this we can always debate the usefulness of quality of competition statistics over the course of a season.

Ok, so let's throw statistics completely out the window. Are you saying that Kane faced the toughest units and Toews faced the #2s? Cause they don't play on the same line.