Official Name Debate Thread

[Caliskinsfan]

Redhawks is a good name, not sure what it is, but its good.

Washington Redhawks - Brand Proposal on Behance

 

[gkekoa]

Red Warriors...keep the indian

 

[Stymietee]

Why are there "name change" threads anyway?? Despite all protests the name WILL be changed period. D. Snyder if nothing else is a smart businessman. He will come to realize the untapped market for this change is immense. Imagine how much money he'll stand to make if he makes the change in merchandise and such. Let's not hope that it is a sorry puke name like Bravehearts, as I've heard being bandied about. A strong name Like Warhawks will do just nicely. It fits the city politically, there would only have to be a few subtle changes to the song (removing braves and inserting team for example) and using the retro "Arrow helmets" as the primary one. Maybe if he is truly smart change the helmet color to a bright gold and arrow to an up-graded design.

 

[Brock2005]

We should rename the team the Warriors and just keep everything else the same. If it offends even a few Native Americans, it should be changed. I don't see why it's such a big deal.

 

[gkekoa]

Why are there "name change" threads anyway?? Despite all protests the name WILL be changed period. D. Snyder if nothing else is a smart businessman. He will come to realize the untapped market for this change is immense. Imagine how much money he'll stand to make if he makes the change in merchandise and such. Let's not hope that it is a sorry puke name like Bravehearts, as I've heard being bandied about. A strong name Like Warhawks will do just nicely. It fits the city politically, there would only have to be a few subtle changes to the song (removing braves and inserting team for example) and using the retro "Arrow helmets" as the primary one. Maybe if he is truly smart change the helmet color to a bright gold and arrow to an up-graded design.

How much of his fanbase will be lost if he changes the name without a fight?

How many people do you think would become a fan of this team if he changed the name? I'm going with ZERO.

You can't go from Redskins to Warhawks. People will find it offensive that we went from saying Redskin to Warhawk because they feel we are saying Indians are savages.

 

[gkekoa]

We should rename the team the Warriors and just keep everything else the same. If it offends even a few Native Americans, it should be changed. I don't see why it's such a big deal.

So if something offends "a few" people we need to change that word? Even if the word isn't offensive and only ignorance makes people believe it is?

Well I'm offended by the word "native American." I am offended because it makes me feel like they believe they have a claim to this land that I don't have.

I'm offended by the term "African American" unless you come from Africa. Be an American...end of story.

I'm offended by any term that comes before American. As a matter of fact, even if people did come from another place and are now citizens of the US, nothing should come before American.

 

[skinsdad62]

We should rename the team the Warriors and just keep everything else the same. If it offends even a few Native Americans, it should be changed. I don't see why it's such a big deal.

i do . why should a small group of people get to tell everyone else what is acceptable ? most native americans arent bothered by the name at all they know the real history of the term and not the big lie advocated by the press and the PC police to sell newspapers

for 80 years very little was said about the name but then mike wise and the washington post stir up BS and lies to sell newspapers

sorry but i am sick and tired of the PC police dictating to me what is and isnt acceptable so they can feel good about themselves

if people want to lay down and take it like spineless jellyfish then so be it . i am not .

there is nothing wrong with the redskins team name . i can be offended by every team name in sports does that mean i have the right to force a change ?

the vikings werent meant to disparage white people . does that mean i get to say they do just for PC purposes ?. the mascot portrays whites as rapers and pillagers in my PC eye does that mean they need a name change because I AM offended ? what about the raiders , bucs or pirates ? same thing or what about the saints ? it offends the athiests so do we change that too ? or maybe baptist feel smeared or penticostals or methodist ?

tell me when does the BS end ?

its a football team name

 

[skinsdad62]

Why are there "name change" threads anyway?? Despite all protests the name WILL be changed period. D. Snyder if nothing else is a smart businessman. He will come to realize the untapped market for this change is immense. Imagine how much money he'll stand to make if he makes the change in merchandise and such. Let's not hope that it is a sorry puke name like Bravehearts, as I've heard being bandied about. A strong name Like Warhawks will do just nicely. It fits the city politically, there would only have to be a few subtle changes to the song (removing braves and inserting team for example) and using the retro "Arrow helmets" as the primary one. Maybe if he is truly smart change the helmet color to a bright gold and arrow to an up-graded design.

hogwash , you believe that the 3rd highest franchise worth team has a cash flow problem ? and what untapped market ? 3-4 native americans who wouldnt know a football if they tripped over it ?

come on stop falling for the PC BS trap

 

[Brock2005]

gkekoa, The crap you spew is so consistently ridiculous, I'm offended by the fact that you're dumb as a brick.

At least Dad presents a decent argument...

From Webster’s Definition of REDSKIN
Usually offensive
: AMERICAN INDIAN
Noun 1. Redskin - (slang) offensive term for Native Americans
Injun, red man
derogation, disparagement, depreciation - a communication that belittles somebody or something
jargon, lingo, patois, argot, vernacular, slang, cant - a characteristic language of a particular group (as among thieves); "they don't speak our lingo"
American Indian, Indian, Red Indian - a member of the race of people living in America when Europeans arrived

....I don't see the argument that its not offensive. Just because noone said anything before doesnt mean it wasn't offensive. It just means they didn't feel empowered enough to speak up. Also, If the group of people offended were so small, why is the uproar becoming so big? It really doesn't bother me personally, but I think we need to change the name and put it behind us.

 

[gkekoa]

gkekoa, The crap you spew is so consistently ridiculous, I'm offended by the fact that you're dumb as a brick.

At least Dad presents a decent argument...

From Webster’s Definition of REDSKIN
Usually offensive
: AMERICAN INDIAN
Noun 1. Redskin - (slang) offensive term for Native Americans
Injun, red man
derogation, disparagement, depreciation - a communication that belittles somebody or something
jargon, lingo, patois, argot, vernacular, slang, cant - a characteristic language of a particular group (as among thieves); "they don't speak our lingo"
American Indian, Indian, Red Indian - a member of the race of people living in America when Europeans arrived

....I don't see the argument that its not offensive. Just because noone said anything before doesnt mean it wasn't offensive. It just means they didn't feel empowered enough to speak up. Also, If the group of people offended were so small, why is the uproar becoming so big? It really doesn't bother me personally, but I think we need to change the name and put it behind us.

Wow...you used a dictionary that has been influenced by society rather than history. Check this out. This is a paper by Ives Goddard, Senior Linguist of the Smithsonian Institute (a pretty good source). http://anthropology.si.edu/goddard/redskin.pdf

If you don't like that source try these two on for size:

Meskwaki Chief Black Thunder

Omaha Chief Big Elk

If you want the jist of what was founded...the origins of the word REDSKIN come from Native American language.


If you want to spit out uneducated insults, I could easily call you a self-righteous, uneducated POS that would rather spit out hyperbole than fact...AKA a typical liberal

 

[skinsdad62]

gkekoa, The crap you spew is so consistently ridiculous, I'm offended by the fact that you're dumb as a brick.

At least Dad presents a decent argument...

From Webster’s Definition of REDSKIN
Usually offensive
: AMERICAN INDIAN
Noun 1. Redskin - (slang) offensive term for Native Americans
Injun, red man
derogation, disparagement, depreciation - a communication that belittles somebody or something
jargon, lingo, patois, argot, vernacular, slang, cant - a characteristic language of a particular group (as among thieves); "they don't speak our lingo"
American Indian, Indian, Red Indian - a member of the race of people living in America when Europeans arrived

....I don't see the argument that its not offensive. Just because noone said anything before doesnt mean it wasn't offensive. It just means they didn't feel empowered enough to speak up. Also, If the group of people offended were so small, why is the uproar becoming so big? It really doesn't bother me personally, but I think we need to change the name and put it behind us.

i would be very very wary of the websters dictionary and the political view point the editors come from

look Brock everyone and their brother KNOWS marshall was a racist

i cant imagine he would name the team after something he hates who would ?

the fact that a football team in AZ that is 93% american indian and has the redskins nickname for thier football team to me seems odd . they dont consider it racist at all

 

[Mitziman]

Native Americans as they are called today, have always referred to white people as "pale face", "yellow hide/skin" or "white man" to name just a few. Are you offended? I'm not. And, don't even get me started about what Native Americans called our African American brethren!

The name that is most offensive to me, is the one the Onieda Nation likes to call me as I walk into one of their casino's...here comes another "PALE FACE" SUCKER!

It's all about $$, and nothing else. HTTR for life!

 

[Stymietee]

hogwash , you believe that the 3rd highest franchise worth team has a cash flow problem ? and what untapped market ? 3-4 native americans who wouldnt know a football if they tripped over it ?

come on stop falling for the PC BS trap

First NOBODY said or implied that this franchise has a cash flow problem. As far as the untapped market....it's called reselling a brand. The market would be flooded with new merchandise bearing the new name and the teams value would practically double overnight because of it's many fans seeking to purchase the new products. Finally, I have eight brothers and two sisters who would all defend our right not to be offended by the likes of you. We are all football fans and AA/Seminole.

 

[Stymietee]

So if something offends "a few" people we need to change that word? Even if the word isn't offensive and only ignorance makes people believe it is?

Well I'm offended by the word "native American." I am offended because it makes me feel like they believe they have a claim to this land that I don't have.

I'm offended by the term "African American" unless you come from Africa. Be an American...end of story.

I'm offended by any term that comes before American. As a matter of fact, even if people did come from another place and are now citizens of the US, nothing should come before American.

So you're offended by the term "Native American" huh?? And why?? because it makes you feel a certain way!!! Think about that, really, really, think about that........especially when you consider what you've written about yourself and anything that comes before "American"

Here's some of what also offends you........Irish Americans............St. Patrick's Day
Italian Americans.........Columbus Day
German Americans........Oktoberfest
Chinese Americans........Chinese New Year
French Americans..........Mardi-Gras
Native Americans..........Thanksgiving
African Americans......... MLK holiday (inclusive)

Surely you'll find your own lineage belonging to one of the these or other groups who proudly add their connected heritage to the disambiguous term "American." Sorry you offend yourself.

 

[Stymietee]

How much of his fanbase will be lost if he changes the name without a fight?

How many people do you think would become a fan of this team if he changed the name? I'm going with ZERO.

You can't go from Redskins to Warhawks. People will find it offensive that we went from saying Redskin to Warhawk because they feel we are saying Indians are savages.

NONE will abandon their home/favorite team if he changes the name. The few who will are not true fans in either case and are not worthy of calling themselves fans if the wind blows (metaphor) in a different direction. BTW: a Warhawk by definition is "One who believes in war."

Please stop giving the impression that you have the ability or authority to speak for anyone other than yourself. ( You can't go from Redskins to Warhawks. People will find it offensive that we went from saying Redskin to Warhawk because they feel we are saying Indians are savages)

 

[antrodemus]

NONE will abandon their home/favorite team if he changes the name. The few who will are not true fans in either case and are not worthy of calling themselves fans if the wind blows (metaphor) in a different direction.

I disagree with this. In my eyes a name change makes it a new/different team and the official end of the Redskins. I wouldn't be able to associate them with the team I grew up watching. It would be like the Browns becoming the Ravens without relocating.

 

[LucklessPadresFan]

How about the Washington Scouts...you could still have an Indian logo.

 

[skinsdad62]

How about the Washington Scouts...you could still have an Indian logo.

change that padre name too buddy LOL

 

[skinsdad62]

First NOBODY said or implied that this franchise has a cash flow problem. As far as the untapped market....it's called reselling a brand. The market would be flooded with new merchandise bearing the new name and the teams value would practically double overnight because of it's many fans seeking to purchase the new products. Finally, I have eight brothers and two sisters who would all defend our right not to be offended by the likes of you. We are all football fans and AA/Seminole.

that market has been tapped , they wear redskins gear i didnt say you implied anything , i said we dont have a cash flow problem hence your point was moot

i have myself defended the rights of you and many many others . i disagree with the name change crowd . they are wrong on the history front , they are a minority in their own community on this issue and it is simply a money shake down by race hustlers

no redskins fan cheering for their favorite team goes into a game thinking "boy we sure slurred those native americans today "

there are numerous sources given in this thread stating the origin of the term redskin and it has been ignored

get back to me when i see the same intensity you give the redskins name change BS to the vikings , saints raiders bucs pirates . all offend some one and all are foolish to even consider a name change .

and believe me i can mangle every sports name in america to offend some one

 

[gkekoa]

First NOBODY said or implied that this franchise has a cash flow problem. As far as the untapped market....it's called reselling a brand. The market would be flooded with new merchandise bearing the new name and the teams value would practically double overnight because of it's many fans seeking to purchase the new products. Finally, I have eight brothers and two sisters who would all defend our right not to be offended by the likes of you. We are all football fans and AA/Seminole.

People are not going to run out and try to get new products, any more than they would just buy a new Redskins jersey.

You do not have any right to be "unoffended."