Off Season Thread

[cdumler7]

No creativity went into my SN. Basic City!!

And i would have been disappointed without a few cheapshots here and there. It was a good show on the RAIDERS part.. Fair. The owner of the BLOG i blog at has similar type gig going, and whenever they talk AFCW ball they are fair as well.. Oh im sure there's a few cheapshots in there as well. It's all part of the game..

And as for boom or bust players? I think all players entering a draft are boom or bust. There's no such thing as a certain type of player being boom or bust, but all players are boom or bust. It's all a gamble dude with every player, imo

When are you guys doing a who wins the AFCW segment??

I agree every player is boom or bust but some have more boom and bust potential than others...Such as Conley. There is more bust potential because of the legal issues surrounding him. It might not matter what he can do on the field if that whole situation goes sideways. So there is extra risk in drafting a player with that already on their record. Broncos had similar situations with Bradley Roby and Shane Ray when we drafted them. Thankfully they have been more boom than bust with them being able to put their past stupidity behind them and staying clean.

Then you have those players that test well in athletic shorts that NFL teams think they can turn into an NFL player. There is huge upside because the athletic ability is off the charts. The football mind just hasn't caught up with that. So you are putting a lot of trust in your coaching staff and the work habits of that player to maximize that supreme athletic ability. Your 2nd round pick is a great example of that. He is more athlete than football player. If his football mind was as good as his athleticism he would have been a top-5 pick. People in the scouting community though see a guy that just doesn't always show great instincts on the field. So again can you develop that into something more?

So while yes every player in the draft is a risk and can bust there are others though that you feel more comfortable investing in than others. Such as for me if I were a GM back in the Mack draft. I would have been more willing to trade up into the top-5 because I saw a guy that was highly productive and then the athleticism to be a great player in the NFL showed on the field and in the testing as well. So the risk is worth the trade up as I think this guy has a very high chance of success. I told you that back in that draft and was ticked when the Raiders took him. I said the same thing about Aaron Donald that he had both the talent on the field and the athletic traits to be a Super Star in the NFL. Luke Kuechley was another. You can see it in those type of players that the athleticism and mind for the game are both there to be successful and injury is the one big thing that could derail them.

As for who wins the AFC West...Not sure. We have the next about 10 weeks of the offseason planned out with going position groups on the Broncos and doing a deep dive into their ability. We are just on the off ball linebackers and doing the show tonight. So maybe after 10 weeks or so when we get to the season we will do one big wrap up of how we think not only the AFC West will play out but the NFL season. I'll just tell you now though unless some serious injuries happen Nick and I both probably have the Raiders doing pretty well. Not as well as last year at least for me but right in the playoff/Super Bowl hunt. I still can't get past Del Rio being the coach though and thinking they are true contenders with him at the helm.

 

[idahoraiderfan33]

I agree every player is boom or bust but some have more boom and bust potential than others...Such as Conley. There is more bust potential because of the legal issues surrounding him. It might not matter what he can do on the field if that whole situation goes sideways. So there is extra risk in drafting a player with that already on their record. Broncos had similar situations with Bradley Roby and Shane Ray when we drafted them. Thankfully they have been more boom than bust with them being able to put their past stupidity behind them and staying clean.

Then you have those players that test well in athletic shorts that NFL teams think they can turn into an NFL player. There is huge upside because the athletic ability is off the charts. The football mind just hasn't caught up with that. So you are putting a lot of trust in your coaching staff and the work habits of that player to maximize that supreme athletic ability. Your 2nd round pick is a great example of that. He is more athlete than football player. If his football mind was as good as his athleticism he would have been a top-5 pick. People in the scouting community though see a guy that just doesn't always show great instincts on the field. So again can you develop that into something more?

So while yes every player in the draft is a risk and can bust there are others though that you feel more comfortable investing in than others. Such as for me if I were a GM back in the Mack draft. I would have been more willing to trade up into the top-5 because I saw a guy that was highly productive and then the athleticism to be a great player in the NFL showed on the field and in the testing as well. So the risk is worth the trade up as I think this guy has a very high chance of success. I told you that back in that draft and was ticked when the Raiders took him. I said the same thing about Aaron Donald that he had both the talent on the field and the athletic traits to be a Super Star in the NFL. Luke Kuechley was another. You can see it in those type of players that the athleticism and mind for the game are both there to be successful and injury is the one big thing that could derail them.

As for who wins the AFC West...Not sure. We have the next about 10 weeks of the offseason planned out with going position groups on the Broncos and doing a deep dive into their ability. We are just on the off ball linebackers and doing the show tonight. So maybe after 10 weeks or so when we get to the season we will do one big wrap up of how we think not only the AFC West will play out but the NFL season. I'll just tell you now though unless some serious injuries happen Nick and I both probably have the Raiders doing pretty well. Not as well as last year at least for me but right in the playoff/Super Bowl hunt. I still can't get past Del Rio being the coach though and thinking they are true contenders with him at the helm.

Players either play ball or they don't , the risk is all the same.. Whether said players have off field drama or not the risk is all the same. Take a look at the number 1 overall getting hurt in OTAs at Browns camp. Say that injury would of been bad and he misses the year, no ball! So whether players have off field drama, injuries or just can't play for whatever reason, it's all one big gamble when you make that selection. No sure thing in sports.
Look, i understand what you saying and it makes sense. But the bottom line at least to me is, once you make that pick it's like pulling dice from your pocket and rolling them hoping you hit the number.. The dice look good, now you just need to hit the number..

And why can't you just go out on a limb and say who you think will win the AFCW? I mean everything is pretty much over now and rosters are full? Iknowfootball has a thread out already and picking Denver. I just don't see what the big deal is? Well, i guess you media now so you have to save it for the radio show? Which would be cool if so..

I think JDR is a really good coach cd. Heck an argument could be made that he's tops in the AFCW as of now.
JDR and Reid the only returning coaching staff in the AFCW!

 

[cdumler7]

Players either play ball or they don't , the risk is all the same.. Whether said players have off field drama or not the risk is all the same. Take a look at the number 1 overall getting hurt in OTAs at Browns camp. Say that injury would of been bad and he misses the year, no ball! So whether players have off field drama, injuries or just can't play for whatever reason, it's all one big gamble when you make that selection. No sure thing in sports.
Look, i understand what you saying and it makes sense. But the bottom line at least to me is, once you make that pick it's like pulling dice from your pocket and rolling them hoping you hit the number.. The dice look good, now you just need to hit the number..

And why can't you just go out on a limb and say who you think will win the AFCW? I mean everything is pretty much over now and rosters are full? Iknowfootball has a thread out already and picking Denver. I just don't see what the big deal is? Well, i guess you media now so you have to save it for the radio show? Which would be cool if so..

I think JDR is a really good coach cd. Heck an argument could be made that he's tops in the AFCW as of now.
JDR and Reid the only returning coaching staff in the AFCW!

Agree there is risk in every pick. There are just certain players at least for me that I feel much more comfortable that they will turn into a decent player than others because of no issues off the field, play on the field, and athletic ability shown. Such as to me Andrew Luck was an easy pick. Easy to see the talent and I have much more trust in him developing into a quality player than say when Johnny Manziel was coming out and people thought he might go #1 overall. That isn't a hindsight thing either. Easy to see Manziel liked to party, had been a spoiled brat most of his life, and a lot of his game would be tough to translate to the NFL. Where with Luck most of his work was done from the pocket in a pro style system. He was beloved by all his teammates and coaches for his work ethic and intelligence on the field.

So that is why to me a player such as for the Raiders this year with Conley there was an already added risk when drafting him with a legal/criminal case against him. No other Corners taken in the 1st round had that added red flag. Like I said he could be the most talented CB in this past draft and still not pan out because of that legal case against him. Now that doesn't mean that other CB's in this draft won't do stupid things now that they have been drafted but we already knew with Conley something was there. Throw in you now have to question his decision making of going and partying like that and inviting women to his room for sex. He has to know he is a target at this point and make better decisions. Now maybe all that blows over and he has a great career. Again though he just adds extra risk compared to other players that did not have that hanging over their heads during the draft. It is why so many teams passed on the OT from LSU a couple of years ago because of the added risk that he might have murdered somebody.

As for who I think will win the AFC West yes I am waiting a bit. It seems like every training camp we have big time injuries that can change a lot. Let's say Carr goes down first week of training camp. Well that changes the entire landscape of the AFC West. Let's say for the Broncos Von Miller goes down. I don't like the Broncos chances without him.

As for JDR we will just have to see. To me he has a ton to prove that he can be a difference maker. I've seen him coach talented teams before and see them underwhelm compared to expectations. Maybe he has learned and evolved as a coach. If not though I think he can be an anchor that derails the most talented Raiders team they have had in a long time.

 

[idahoraiderfan33]

Agree there is risk in every pick. There are just certain players at least for me that I feel much more comfortable that they will turn into a decent player than others because of no issues off the field, play on the field, and athletic ability shown. Such as to me Andrew Luck was an easy pick. Easy to see the talent and I have much more trust in him developing into a quality player than say when Johnny Manziel was coming out and people thought he might go #1 overall. That isn't a hindsight thing either. Easy to see Manziel liked to party, had been a spoiled brat most of his life, and a lot of his game would be tough to translate to the NFL. Where with Luck most of his work was done from the pocket in a pro style system. He was beloved by all his teammates and coaches for his work ethic and intelligence on the field.

So that is why to me a player such as for the Raiders this year with Conley there was an already added risk when drafting him with a legal/criminal case against him. No other Corners taken in the 1st round had that added red flag. Like I said he could be the most talented CB in this past draft and still not pan out because of that legal case against him. Now that doesn't mean that other CB's in this draft won't do stupid things now that they have been drafted but we already knew with Conley something was there. Throw in you now have to question his decision making of going and partying like that and inviting women to his room for sex. He has to know he is a target at this point and make better decisions. Now maybe all that blows over and he has a great career. Again though he just adds extra risk compared to other players that did not have that hanging over their heads during the draft. It is why so many teams passed on the OT from LSU a couple of years ago because of the added risk that he might have murdered somebody.

As for who I think will win the AFC West yes I am waiting a bit. It seems like every training camp we have big time injuries that can change a lot. Let's say Carr goes down first week of training camp. Well that changes the entire landscape of the AFC West. Let's say for the Broncos Von Miller goes down. I don't like the Broncos chances without him.

As for JDR we will just have to see. To me he has a ton to prove that he can be a difference maker. I've seen him coach talented teams before and see them underwhelm compared to expectations. Maybe he has learned and evolved as a coach. If not though I think he can be an anchor that derails the most talented Raiders team they have had in a long time.

That Conley case is a he said she said type case. I doubt anything comes from it, or Reggie would of not drafted him.. And as for his talent? It's off the charts dude.. Boom or bust means a players talent, not their off field issues. I believe they call that character issues. To me the two don't mean the same thing.. Boom or Bust = Talent concerns.. While off filed drama = Character issues. Both can end a career, but they both don't mean the same thing. IMO Conley is going to be a VERY good football player.

Yeah, well lets hope nobody gets hurt this year, so the BEST team wins!

JDR has swagger and no fear. Dude has really changed the way it's done in Oak. He's pretty good. You guys have a completely new coaching staff same with the Bolts. We know what JDR will bring, but what will that NEW coaching for you guys bring??

 

[idahoraiderfan33]

So word has it Carr got locked up for a record breaking deal, at 25M Per! No details as of yet of the whole deal though. Carr will be the highest paid player in football for like a month or so!!
Nice work Reggie!! We keeping our STAR players!!

 

[cdumler7]

That Conley case is a he said she said type case. I doubt anything comes from it, or Reggie would of not drafted him.. And as for his talent? It's off the charts dude.. Boom or bust means a players talent, not their off field issues. I believe they call that character issues. To me the two don't mean the same thing.. Boom or Bust = Talent concerns.. While off filed drama = Character issues. Both can end a career, but they both don't mean the same thing. IMO Conley is going to be a VERY good football player.

Yeah, well lets hope nobody gets hurt this year, so the BEST team wins!

JDR has swagger and no fear. Dude has really changed the way it's done in Oak. He's pretty good. You guys have a completely new coaching staff same with the Bolts. We know what JDR will bring, but what will that NEW coaching for you guys bring??

Well I guess for me I have worked some with the scouting community. They put all of it into the equation. They don't separate the talent from the off the field issues. They all go together in deciding the type of player you are getting. It is why guys with off the field issues fall because it is all part of the equation. So yes it adds to their boom or bust ability.

And yes they do not mean the same thing but again they are all still part of the equation when you are getting ready to invest so much into them. So there is some major risk when you draft a player that has the off the field issues. And even if it is a he said/she said type case it still shows a not great decision by Conley to be in that situation in the first place. I would say the same thing about Aqib Talib. He makes stupid decisions and has come very close to costing himself his NFL career. I am worried as can be that over the next 30+ days while they are on break he is going to do something stupid. So have to see if this is a pattern with Conley or just a 1 time stupid decision that he learns from.

As for JDR I just know Bronco players/coaches/FO people were not big fans of him while in Denver. He wore out his welcome quickly with his my way or the highway attitude and unwillingness to change. He had the thought that his scheme was perfect even when teams figured it out. Like I said maybe he learned from that and is a better coach for it but we will just have to see. Big year for him and the Raiders to prove they belong in the talk of the top teams in the NFL.

As for the Broncos coaches I don't know how it will play out. I do trust our offensive staff to do some good things. They have 4 guys on that staff alone with OC/HC experience. My guess is no other team in the league can say that. Defensively really the only big change is that of Wade going to LA and our Secondary Coach taking over for him. Same scheme/players for the most part so don't expect a whole lot of difference other than having to see how our new players added to the DL can step up in the run game. Head Coach wise is the big question mark. Players have all talked very highly of Vance Joseph but there will be some growing pains along the way as he learns how to handle being top dog.

 

[idahoraiderfan33]

Well I guess for me I have worked some with the scouting community. They put all of it into the equation. They don't separate the talent from the off the field issues. They all go together in deciding the type of player you are getting. It is why guys with off the field issues fall because it is all part of the equation. So yes it adds to their boom or bust ability.

And yes they do not mean the same thing but again they are all still part of the equation when you are getting ready to invest so much into them. So there is some major risk when you draft a player that has the off the field issues. And even if it is a he said/she said type case it still shows a not great decision by Conley to be in that situation in the first place. I would say the same thing about Aqib Talib. He makes stupid decisions and has come very close to costing himself his NFL career. I am worried as can be that over the next 30+ days while they are on break he is going to do something stupid. So have to see if this is a pattern with Conley or just a 1 time stupid decision that he learns from.

As for JDR I just know Bronco players/coaches/FO people were not big fans of him while in Denver. He wore out his welcome quickly with his my way or the highway attitude and unwillingness to change. He had the thought that his scheme was perfect even when teams figured it out. Like I said maybe he learned from that and is a better coach for it but we will just have to see. Big year for him and the Raiders to prove they belong in the talk of the top teams in the NFL.

As for the Broncos coaches I don't know how it will play out. I do trust our offensive staff to do some good things. They have 4 guys on that staff alone with OC/HC experience. My guess is no other team in the league can say that. Defensively really the only big change is that of Wade going to LA and our Secondary Coach taking over for him. Same scheme/players for the most part so don't expect a whole lot of difference other than having to see how our new players added to the DL can step up in the run game. Head Coach wise is the big question mark. Players have all talked very highly of Vance Joseph but there will be some growing pains along the way as he learns how to handle being top dog.

Agree to disagree on the tittle on that one. But agree that both end careers. There is two ways of not playing in the NFL? One, boom or bust on talent. Two is off the field issues.. 2 different meanings.
As for Conley? Dude has never really had problems at OSU. Great character and loved by his teammates and coaches. He don't have off field issues, but just that ONE issue. And from everything i read and seen it looks like a money ploy from the other party. Let's see what comes of that here real soon.

And as for Talib? There's no boom or bust there. Dude is a great player, he's just a crappy person. If he gets busted it's cuz he chooses too..

Just cuz JDR didn't workout for you guys, don't mean the guy can't coach cd. And JDR did a good job with you guys as well as with the Jags IMO. With the Jags he had them winning remember that? He just didn't have a QB to continue that winning. It's amazing what great QB play does for HC's eh cd?

It seems like that new coaching staff for you guys is like a transition coaching staff to a bigger name coach in the future? Sort of like DA was for us. I could be totally wrong on that, but that's what it seems like.. I guess QB play will dictate that for you guys.. Lynch or Siemen who starts?

 

[cdumler7]

Agree to disagree on the tittle on that one. But agree that both end careers. There is two ways of not playing in the NFL? One, boom or bust on talent. Two is off the field issues.. 2 different meanings.
As for Conley? Dude has never really had problems at OSU. Great character and loved by his teammates and coaches. He don't have off field issues, but just that ONE issue. And from everything i read and seen it looks like a money ploy from the other party. Let's see what comes of that here real soon.

And as for Talib? There's no boom or bust there. Dude is a great player, he's just a crappy person. If he gets busted it's cuz he chooses too..

Just cuz JDR didn't workout for you guys, don't mean the guy can't coach cd. And JDR did a good job with you guys as well as with the Jags IMO. With the Jags he had them winning remember that? He just didn't have a QB to continue that winning. It's amazing what great QB play does for HC's eh cd?

It seems like that new coaching staff for you guys is like a transition coaching staff to a bigger name coach in the future? Sort of like DA was for us. I could be totally wrong on that, but that's what it seems like.. I guess QB play will dictate that for you guys.. Lynch or Siemen who starts?

Well not sure I would say the Jags were winning considering he went 68-71 during his time with them. And he only had 3 winning seasons in 9 seasons. And only made the playoffs twice during that stretch while losing in the 1st game of the playoffs. Hasn't won a playoff game still with losing this past year with the Raiders.

As for his time with the Broncos I would say seeing what Wade did with the same talent should prove that Del Rio did not do a good job with the Broncos. He had enough talent to be a top-5 Defense of all time and he couldn't even get us to be a top-5 defense in the NFL. We were 16th in points allowed in 2014 before he left for Oakland. In comes Wade and boom top-5 defense of all time. So no I don't think he did well with the Broncos. He just had a ton of talent that made him look better than his coaching.

And as for our HC. I don't think he is just a transition coach. At least not in the eyes of Elway. Elway has wanted Vance Joseph for a very long time. Before he hired his best friend in Kubiak Vance Joseph was the guy they wanted to hire. There was a reason 5 of the 6 teams had interviews set up with Vance Joseph at the start of everything and the Broncos just didn't let him leave the building before getting him on board.

And the QB battle I have been team Lynch for a long time. The season before he was drafted by the Broncos I was telling Bronco fans the team should do whatever it takes to get this kid. He is the one pick that the Broncos made that I just let out a very loud scream of just pure joy. Scared my wife to death when it happened.

 

[idahoraiderfan33]

Derek Carr is now the highest paid player in the league! 5 Yr/ 125
Franchise QBs don't come cheap! Good job Reggie by locking up our franchise!!

cd, any comment on the breaking news of the day?

 

[cdumler7]

Derek Carr is now the highest paid player in the league! 5 Yr/ 125
Franchise QBs don't come cheap! Good job Reggie by locking up our franchise!!

cd, any comment on the breaking news of the day?

At this point not sure the Raiders had another choice. Good to get Carr locked up now and be able to change their focus to what it will take to get Mack locked up. I like Carr as a QB. Does some great things. I do wonder once this team spends all this big money on him, Mack, and Cooper and the pressure is on him to be the main guy how he does. They won't be able to keep this OL together with all the high paid talent like they have now so good chance he is taking more hits.

Again I do like Carr though but this is why I say their best chance at a Super Bowl is the next 2 seasons while other guys are still cheap and they have the talent around Carr to be a dynamic offense.

 

[idahoraiderfan33]

Well not sure I would say the Jags were winning considering he went 68-71 during his time with them. And he only had 3 winning seasons in 9 seasons. And only made the playoffs twice during that stretch while losing in the 1st game of the playoffs. Hasn't won a playoff game still with losing this past year with the Raiders.

As for his time with the Broncos I would say seeing what Wade did with the same talent should prove that Del Rio did not do a good job with the Broncos. He had enough talent to be a top-5 Defense of all time and he couldn't even get us to be a top-5 defense in the NFL. We were 16th in points allowed in 2014 before he left for Oakland. In comes Wade and boom top-5 defense of all time. So no I don't think he did well with the Broncos. He just had a ton of talent that made him look better than his coaching.

And as for our HC. I don't think he is just a transition coach. At least not in the eyes of Elway. Elway has wanted Vance Joseph for a very long time. Before he hired his best friend in Kubiak Vance Joseph was the guy they wanted to hire. There was a reason 5 of the 6 teams had interviews set up with Vance Joseph at the start of everything and the Broncos just didn't let him leave the building before getting him on board.

And the QB battle I have been team Lynch for a long time. The season before he was drafted by the Broncos I was telling Bronco fans the team should do whatever it takes to get this kid. He is the one pick that the Broncos made that I just let out a very loud scream of just pure joy. Scared my wife to death when it happened.

Well JDR has never really had a QB cd till now. You can't win in this league without great QB play as you know. Now, unless you have a once every 15 years type defense, you NEED a QB to win. Coaches look sheety without great QBs and look like great coaches with them. And that list is LONG!!

He did good with the Broncos and even won some games when the HC was sick, remember?
Again, how did Phillips look last year? Not very good right?? Everything came together for you guys in that SB run. It was a loaded and i mean loaded team. Billyisacheat got fired from the Browns then goes to the Pats, they draft Brady and now he's the best coach in the league! That's how it works cd. Great QB = Great coach..

I will give you credit on Lynch cd. I remember you pimping him pretty hard all that offseason..
If he plays good the Broncos will be a tough out!! You guys still have a good team..

 

[cdumler7]

Well JDR has never really had a QB cd till now. You can't win in this league without great QB play as you know. Now, unless you have a once every 15 years type defense, you NEED a QB to win. Coaches look sheety without great QBs and look like great coaches with them. And that list is LONG!!

He did good with the Broncos and even won some games when the HC was sick, remember?
Again, how did Phillips look last year? Not very good right?? Everything came together for you guys in that SB run. It was a loaded and i mean loaded team. Billyisacheat got fired from the Browns then goes to the Pats, they draft Brady and now he's the best coach in the league! That's how it works cd. Great QB = Great coach..

I will give you credit on Lynch cd. I remember you pimping him pretty hard all that offseason..
If he plays good the Broncos will be a tough out!! You guys still have a good team..

Well actually last year's defense still was rated as the top defense in football by DVOA and a top-30 defense of the last 30 years. So while there was some drop off (remember talent did leave in Trevathan and Malik Jackson) the team still had a great defense. Again with pretty much the same talent as what Wade had in 2015 the Broncos finished 16th that year in defense. They go from 16th to top-5 all-time with the same players. That is a coaching issue not a talent issue.

And I'm not saying that Del Rio is a terrible coach. I'm just saying I don't think he is the type that he is a big reason the team can get over the top like that of a Bill Belichick.

And speaking of the Bill Belichick in Cleveland years. When he took over the team was 3-13 the year before. Every year that he coached the team got a little bit better until his final season when he was fired. So while yes he had a losing record he also started with a bottom of the barrel team. Everyone in the league even back then was already talking about how great of a coach he was. I've never heard that about Del Rio. Doesn't mean he can't prove me wrong I just know from inside stories I have of his time in Denver that he drove players nuts with his game plans and how simple minded they were and how much he refused to listen to people around him. He thought he was the smartest person in the room and did not need help.

 

[idahoraiderfan33]

At this point not sure the Raiders had another choice. Good to get Carr locked up now and be able to change their focus to what it will take to get Mack locked up. I like Carr as a QB. Does some great things. I do wonder once this team spends all this big money on him, Mack, and Cooper and the pressure is on him to be the main guy how he does. They won't be able to keep this OL together with all the high paid talent like they have now so good chance he is taking more hits.

Again I do like Carr though but this is why I say their best chance at a Super Bowl is the next 2 seasons while other guys are still cheap and they have the talent around Carr to be a dynamic offense.

That two year window is a myth cd, no such thing. Look at the Pats? That window is still open 12 years later.
Now im sure we will lose players here and there just like every other team. The key is good drafting cd.
We have a DEEP OL with a lot of young players we could plug right in.. Vadal, Feliciano, Kirkland, Omolie
All young drafted players that seen playing time last year and did good.. Drafting is the key to the whole thing when you lockup star players..

 

[cdumler7]

That two year window is a myth cd, no such thing. Look at the Pats? That window is still open 12 years later.
Now im sure we will lose players here and there just like every other team. The key is good drafting cd.
We have a DEEP OL with a lot of young players we could plug right in.. Vadal, Feliciano, Kirkland, Omolie
All young drafted players that seen playing time last year and did good.. Drafting is the key to the whole thing when you lockup star players..

Agreed the draft is what is needed when you lock up star players. What I'm saying is right now with some of those star players on cheap contracts it has allowed you to afford to spend more in FA. Maybe you can't get a guy like Osomele in the future because of money being wrapped up elsewhere.

As for the Pats you realize they are an anomaly in the NFL right? That isn't the usual. Everybody is trying to copy them but nobody can. Broncos over the past 7 years are the closest team to them. Part of what does help is that Tom Brady continues to take cheap team friendly deals. He has never been the highest paid QB in the NFL. Such as for this upcoming season...He has a cap hit of $14 million. If he wanted he could demand a contract of $26 million right now. So that is an extra $12 million they can spend elsewhere to lock up players. They have also built up enough respect around the league that players go to New England to win championships so they are willing to take some cheaper deals. Broncos had that when they had Peyton Manning of guys wanting to come to Denver to play with Peyton so they took less. So again they can add talent for cheaper than what other teams can. Oakland hasn't reached that point yet. Maybe if they can have success over the next few years that will be the case but people are not kicking down the doors just yet to play in Oakland unless they are getting paid more to go there.

So again that is why I say they have a big 2-year window. Doesn't mean they can't win one after that it just means team building wise it is much easier right now than it will be in 2-years.

 

[idahoraiderfan33]

Well actually last year's defense still was rated as the top defense in football by DVOA and a top-30 defense of the last 30 years. So while there was some drop off (remember talent did leave in Trevathan and Malik Jackson) the team still had a great defense. Again with pretty much the same talent as what Wade had in 2015 the Broncos finished 16th that year in defense. They go from 16th to top-5 all-time with the same players. That is a coaching issue not a talent issue.

And I'm not saying that Del Rio is a terrible coach. I'm just saying I don't think he is the type that he is a big reason the team can get over the top like that of a Bill Belichick.

And speaking of the Bill Belichick in Cleveland years. When he took over the team was 3-13 the year before. Every year that he coached the team got a little bit better until his final season when he was fired. So while yes he had a losing record he also started with a bottom of the barrel team. Everyone in the league even back then was already talking about how great of a coach he was. I've never heard that about Del Rio. Doesn't mean he can't prove me wrong I just know from inside stories I have of his time in Denver that he drove players nuts with his game plans and how simple minded they were and how much he refused to listen to people around him. He thought he was the smartest person in the room and did not need help.

You guys had a good defense last year just not dominant like the SB one. For what ever reason that was. Losing players, coaching, and the offense leaving the defense on the field to much. It was a combination of all those things. The point here was bad QB play was the main reason for the Broncos season last year. A coach is only as good as his QB play cd. See you guys last year.. And this is where JDR, Billyisacheat, etc, etc come into play.
JDR started with a rebuilding young team and took them to the next step his following year, why? We all know why don't we? When you have a solid coach and you pair him with great QB you get what the Pats, and many other teams have had.. It's the way it works.. Heck, Belichick is a defensive HC and that team wins cuz of the offense and Brady for the most part.. It's how it works in sports. Star players with solid coaching = WINS

 

[idahoraiderfan33]

Agreed the draft is what is needed when you lock up star players. What I'm saying is right now with some of those star players on cheap contracts it has allowed you to afford to spend more in FA. Maybe you can't get a guy like Osomele in the future because of money being wrapped up elsewhere.

As for the Pats you realize they are an anomaly in the NFL right? That isn't the usual. Everybody is trying to copy them but nobody can. Broncos over the past 7 years are the closest team to them. Part of what does help is that Tom Brady continues to take cheap team friendly deals. He has never been the highest paid QB in the NFL. Such as for this upcoming season...He has a cap hit of $14 million. If he wanted he could demand a contract of $26 million right now. So that is an extra $12 million they can spend elsewhere to lock up players. They have also built up enough respect around the league that players go to New England to win championships so they are willing to take some cheaper deals. Broncos had that when they had Peyton Manning of guys wanting to come to Denver to play with Peyton so they took less. So again they can add talent for cheaper than what other teams can. Oakland hasn't reached that point yet. Maybe if they can have success over the next few years that will be the case but people are not kicking down the doors just yet to play in Oakland unless they are getting paid more to go there.

So again that is why I say they have a big 2-year window. Doesn't mean they can't win one after that it just means team building wise it is much easier right now than it will be in 2-years.[/QUOT

 

[cdumler7]

You guys had a good defense last year just not dominant like the SB one. For what ever reason that was. Losing players, coaching, and the offense leaving the defense on the field to much. It was a combination of all those things. The point here was bad QB play was the main reason for the Broncos season last year. A coach is only as good as his QB play cd. See you guys last year.. And this is where JDR, Billyisacheat, etc, etc come into play.
JDR started with a rebuilding young team and took them to the next step his following year, why? We all know why don't we? When you have a solid coach and you pair him with great QB you get what the Pats, and many other teams have had.. It's the way it works.. Heck, Belichick is a defensive HC and that team wins cuz of the offense and Brady for the most part.. It's how it works in sports. Star players with solid coaching = WINS

You do realize though with the Belichick teams that they have had a top-10 defense most years right? Actually that is one of the big things when looking at Brady is that I think every single season they have won a Super Bowl he had a top-10 defense connected to the team. So while a star QB and a great coach can get a team to the playoffs there has to be more than that to win a Super Bowl even for all time greats like Belichick and Brady.

And yes a team needs a QB to do something for them most years unless they have an all-time defense. I think of the top-5 defenses of the past 30 years 3 of the 5 were able to win the Super Bowl so that is what it takes and even that sometimes isn't enough.

As for JDR this is in part why Bronco fans get so ticked at the mention of his name. That 2014 season the Broncos had a top-5 offense and the talent on that defense to easily be a top-3 unit in the NFL. 2014 should have been another chance at the Super Bowl and a really good one at that and instead the team just fell apart with the defense being a big reason why. The talent on the team wasn't the issue. The coaching was and was a big reason Elway just fired pretty much 90% of the staff. The next staff comes in and wins a Super Bowl with pretty much again the same talent. Unfortunately what happens with most Super Bowl victories is that you have guys poached off your team and well 2016 the team just never fully got it together. Doesn't help when your Head Coach gets put in the hospital and is told he cannot keep putting in the hours like he did before that game. Team was doing really well before that happened. Big turning point on the season.

 

[idahoraiderfan33]

Carr, Mack, etc are all first time contracts so of course they want good pay. The good news is the cap goes up as well. Again, good drafting is the key to the whole thing. The RAIDERS won't be in the FA frenzy anymore but they will get players here and there in FA. It's not always about getting the TOP FAs anymore for the RAIDERS but players that can make an impact on the team. Look at this class of FA we just got? Patterson, Cook, Newhouse, etc
Not the huge name but players that will make an impact on the team. Cheap deals for huge impacts! That's how this team will roll for now on..

 

[idahoraiderfan33]

You do realize though with the Belichick teams that they have had a top-10 defense most years right? Actually that is one of the big things when looking at Brady is that I think every single season they have won a Super Bowl he had a top-10 defense connected to the team. So while a star QB and a great coach can get a team to the playoffs there has to be more than that to win a Super Bowl even for all time greats like Belichick and Brady.

And yes a team needs a QB to do something for them most years unless they have an all-time defense. I think of the top-5 defenses of the past 30 years 3 of the 5 were able to win the Super Bowl so that is what it takes and even that sometimes isn't enough.

As for JDR this is in part why Bronco fans get so ticked at the mention of his name. That 2014 season the Broncos had a top-5 offense and the talent on that defense to easily be a top-3 unit in the NFL. 2014 should have been another chance at the Super Bowl and a really good one at that and instead the team just fell apart with the defense being a big reason why. The talent on the team wasn't the issue. The coaching was and was a big reason Elway just fired pretty much 90% of the staff. The next staff comes in and wins a Super Bowl with pretty much again the same talent. Unfortunately what happens with most Super Bowl victories is that you have guys poached off your team and well 2016 the team just never fully got it together. Doesn't help when your Head Coach gets put in the hospital and is told he cannot keep putting in the hours like he did before that game. Team was doing really well before that happened. Big turning point on the season.

That defense is overrated for the simple reason of preying on a soft schedule all year long, and as well as having a powerful offense cd. They light that defense up in the SB cd. It was Brady that brings them back and wins the SB. They win SBs with offense not defense. Oh the defense makes plays here and there, but make no mistake it's the offense that wins those games.. And they have a defensive minded coach, hmmm

Other than Dilfer and Johnson most teams in recent SBs had top notch QBs along with good defense..

I remember that team you guys had, and it was Manning choking in the big games that did them in.
You just can't put all the blame on the coaching staff cd. It took an all time defense to win that SB with Manning playing mistake free football to win.

Again look at last year, pretty much the same team without Manning and a few defensive players and look what happened? Coaches take a lot of blame but you can't put all the blame on them.

 

[idahoraiderfan33]

For the record im not saying said coaches stink or anything like that. What i am saying though?
Solid coaching along with great QB play = HOF type coach in the eyes of the media.. That's how it works in sports..