NCAA Infraction discussion

[nddulac]

No offense, but you know/understand very little about these things.

I'm not offended. Unfortunately, you have gotten a lot of facts incorrect in your attempt to show me how little I understand. I'm not offended because I my expectations of your reasoning skills are rather low. But lets examine your claims a little bit.

Infractions are not what leads to such things. Lack of institutional control is what does. Remember Ohio St and Prior? Did Ohio St forfeit games because of that? No, they even delays the punishment until after the Bowl games so he could play. But when Ohio St/Tressel was found to have covered things up, they got nailed for lack of institutional control and then it hit.

First, no one has ever been slapped with "lack of institutional control" without first committing infractions. Second, Ohio State was not slapped with "Lack of Institutional control" (although I believe they should have been.) Further, with the NCAA penalties would (and did, with the exception of Terrelle Pryor who jumped to the NFL) be held out for games in the subsequent year. The biggest penalty handed down in that case was a "Show Cause" penalty on Jim Tressel. That means that if Ohio State (or anyone else) wanted to hire him to work in an NCAA sanctioned sport or department, the hiring institution would have to "show cause" as to why they should get a waiver to be allowed to hire him.

USC got the same thing - lack of institutional control.

USC chose to go the route of telling the NCAA to go screw themselves, by forcing the NCAA to prove the allegations against the program. Further, USC was employing fewer resources (one person in the compliance office) than most mid-majors (my only experience was San Jose State, who had several people working on compliance) despite the fact that mid-majors have considerably fewer resources to go around.

Incidentally, USC has a second comeuppance in the pipeline that will be very interesting to watch unfold, given the severity of the sanctions levied under the Reggie Bush case. While the Reggie bush case was being pursued, Joe McKnight was found to be driving an SUV that was registered to Scott Schenter, the employer of Joe McKnight's girlfriend. USC investigated the situation, found that Schenter had bought the SUV for McKnight's girlfriend, and that no infractions had occurred. It has since come to light that Scott Schenter bought and insured another car for Joe McNight, which McNight totaled. Schenter also bought plane tickets for McKnight. These are things the USC investigation clearly failed to uncover. Also, this happened while the eyes of the entire college athletics universe were affixed to USC because of the Reggie Bush/OJ Mayo investigations. But that is a story that remains to play out.

Alabama got the same thing back over Albert Means, they nailed us hard as well. Back in the 90's with Antonio Langham we got nailed decently hard for that because Gene Stallings/Alabama refused to cooperate with the NCAA.

So unless there is some evidence out there that shows Alabama had a lack of institutional control in the matter, not going to happen. And since the people who did the investigation for/at Yahoo refuse to turnover any evidence to the NCAA, that's not going to be any easier.

The evidence has already shown that the infractions were orchestrated by a former Alabama player, invoved players at two other schools, and were sufficient to disqualify one player at Tennessee for most of last season. Keep in mind the NCAA's reluctance to disqualify Cam Newton, but their decisive move on Maurice Couch seems to indicate that the believe the allegations have significant legs.

Sorry, you'll have to find a moral victory in something else.

Okay.

 

[nddulac]

That booster was his girlfriend.LOL. Funny. All eight Notre Dame players she was giving money , trips, and gifts said she was their girlfriend. One had her baby and it wasn't Derrick dude.

Not only are you confused about the story, I'm not certain you are entirely up on biology either.

 

[4down20]

Alabama runs it's player payroll through the NCAA.

 

[HuskerOC]

I'm confused.


What exactly are we to discuss?

 

[potzer25]

The mythical Yahoo expose on Alabama infractions?

 

[4down20]

The mythical Yahoo expose on Alabama infractions?

Yes, he claims that Alabama will forfeit the win against Notre Dame.

 

[HuskerOC]

Yes, he claims that Alabama will forfeit the win against Notre Dame.

Easy question.

Do you think players, or certain players, are being paid to play for Alabama? More importantly. do you think they received cash to commit to Alabama?

I don't need an "everybody does it" response, I just want your honest opinion.

 

[4down20]

Just a few notes since I don't know why this needed it's own thread.

Ohio St got hit with "failure to monitor", which is basically a lighter version of lack of institutional control. You can split hairs on it if you want, but the point is that severe punishment comes from things after violations and rarely the violations themselves.

I think we all know what a show cause is.

Don't know why you are going into USC in depth about lack of institutional control since you maintained Alabama and DJ Fluker was the same because of Reggie Bush and I was the one who brought up it was the other stuff that got them in trouble. Alabama takes these matters seriously and wouldn't even dream of trying to cover stuff up for a player. Saban suspended Andre Smith like 1 day before the Sugar Bowl in 2008, a 1st round NFL draft pick.

And as far as "former Alabama player", he was not on the team when it happened and was acting on behalf of a sports agent. Alabama banned him from all things Alabama in response, which is again about "institutional control", and the people who did the Yahoo investigation refused to turn over any evidence they obtained to the NCAA.

In the event a player is ineligible, they usually only have to do something to make restitution. For example the whole Marcel Darius trip to Miami - he was forced to pay for the plane ticket and serve a punishment before he could play. And that is likely the deal with the Tennessee player as well, although I am not familiar with it. As he still wants to play, it's up to the NCAA and he has to cooperate.

Still, you've made quite a leap to get to a game forfeit as Alabama didn't have lack of institutional control, and did not play someone they knew was ineligible(or should have known was).

I'm not even sure if this is still an open case anymore.

 

[4down20]

Easy question.

Do you think players, or certain players, are being paid to play for Alabama? More importantly. do you think they received cash to commit to Alabama?

I don't need an "everybody does it" response, I just want your honest opinion.

No, there is absolutely no need for it. People need to wake up and realize it's not 1980 anymore. If they just bought players with money, they wouldn't spend all these huge amounts for fancy locker rooms, spas, food bars and all the other crap they do these days. Schools have gotten wise and put their money in better places.

Furthermore, kids are able to get financial aid and other things that amount to $17,000 per year. And that is not counting the student loans that are available to them as well. You guys throw a fit because a kid gets a new car, and other people talk about needing to pay the kids, but the reality is soo much different.

Football Players Receive $17,000 Annually in Cash, all within NCAA Rules « HolyTurf

Even what is being talked about here with DJ Fluker isn't along the lines you are talking about here. It happened in his last year and was about what agent he would sign with after college football. And he was getting that money not for himself, but for his family who was in need. His family lost their home in Katrina and was living out a car and had terrible luck.

 

[HuskerOC]

No, there is absolutely no need for it. People need to wake up and realize it's not 1980 anymore. If they just bought players with money, they wouldn't spend all these huge amounts for fancy locker rooms, spas, food bars and all the other crap they do these days. Schools have gotten wise and put their money in better places.

Furthermore, kids are able to get financial aid and other things that amount to $17,000 per year. And that is not counting the student loans that are available to them as well. You guys throw a fit because a kid gets a new car, and other people talk about needing to pay the kids, but the reality is soo much different.

Football Players Receive $17,000 Annually in Cash, all within NCAA Rules « HolyTurf

Even what is being talked about here with DJ Fluker isn't along the lines you are talking about here. It happened in his last year and was about what agent he would sign with after college football. And he was getting that money not for himself, but for his family who was in need. His family lost their home in Katrina and was living out a car and had terrible luck.

Yep every single student/player can get $17K in their pocket every year.

No it isn't 1980, so teams have more secure and better ways to get kids money as opposed to bags of cash, cars, or homes for Mom.

Teams have also learned that if you don't say shit (like the Mob), they have to prove you cheated.

However, unlike the Mob and the police, the NCAA has no power of subpoena or grand jury testimony.

The NCAA has to take you at your word.

Amazing how some of the most sanctioned programs in the history of college football in the 70s, 80s, and 90s are no longer being sanctioned. And their conference is now on a historical run for the ages.

Yep. Nothing going on here.....

 

[4down20]

Yep every single student/player can get $17K in their pocket every year.

No it isn't 1980, so teams have more secure and better ways to get kids money as opposed to bags of cash, cars, or homes for Mom.

Teams have also learned that if you don't say shit (like the Mob), they have to prove you cheated.

However, unlike the Mob and the police, the NCAA has no power of subpoena or grand jury testimony.

The NCAA has to take you at your word.

Amazing how some of the most sanctioned programs in the history of college football in the 70s, 80s, and 90s are no longer being sanctioned. And their conference is now on a historical run for the ages.

Yep. Nothing going on here.....

Oh look, it's a long post that is really nothing but crying about the SEC.

Because your team is obviously the best team in the country, and anyone who is doing better than your team is obviously cheating.

PS: They can get more than 17k because of all the student loans available these days that were not available in the past.

 

[HuskerOC]

Oh look, it's a long post that is really nothing but crying about the SEC.

Because your team is obviously the best team in the country, and anyone who is doing better than your team is obviously cheating.

PS: They can get more than 17k because of all the student loans available these days that were not available in the past.

Good to know that you don't have an inkling of an intelligent response.

 

[4down20]

Good to know that you don't have an inkling of an intelligent response.

Fine, Alabama and the SEC cheats and there isn't a damn thing you can do about it. Your team is apparently too stupid to get with the times.

We own this bitch, so you'll just have to be happy with your consolation prize 9 wins.

Do you even ESPN?

 

[HuskerOC]

Fine, Alabama and the SEC cheats and there isn't a damn thing you can do about it. Your team is apparently too stupid to get with the times.

We own this bitch, so you'll just have to be happy with your consolation prize 9 wins.

Do you even ESPN?

You're right, there isn't a damn thing I can do about it.

You damn Dixies smartened up and decided not to call out each other. Your Fuck the NCAA attitude is fantastic and you bonded together with the "nothing to see here" attitude.

We don't pay kids. We try to do it the All World American way.

Heart, effort, great grades, and really really damn good kids is our story.

But Fuck, you don't care about that shit. Winning and Natty's are all that matter.

 

[4down20]

You're right, there isn't a damn thing I can do about it.

You damn Dixies smartened up and decided not to call out each other. Your Fuck the NCAA attitude is fantastic and you bonded together with the "nothing to see here" attitude.

We don't pay kids. We try to do it the All World American way.

Heart, effort, great grades, and really really damn good kids is our story.

But Fuck, you don't care about that shit. Winning and Natty's are all that matter.

We're winning, you're crying.

I'm fine with that.

 

[4down20]

PS: The only thing you are doing the "All World American Way" is crying about the success of others and blaming them for your own failures.

 

[HuskerOC]

And all you have left are GIFs.


Time, after time, after time.


That is all you have.


By the way, when was the last time you got laid?

 

[The Crimson King]

Yep every single student/player can get $17K in their pocket every year.

No it isn't 1980, so teams have more secure and better ways to get kids money as opposed to bags of cash, cars, or homes for Mom.

Teams have also learned that if you don't say shit (like the Mob), they have to prove you cheated.

However, unlike the Mob and the police, the NCAA has no power of subpoena or grand jury testimony.

The NCAA has to take you at your word.

Amazing how some of the most sanctioned programs in the history of college football in the 70s, 80s, and 90s are no longer being sanctioned. And their conference is now on a historical run for the ages.

Yep. Nothing going on here.....

I only got about $11K per year...........now they're keeping my tax returns

 

[TheRobotDevil]

I only got about $11K per year...........now they're keeping my tax returns

You can get around that by paying $5 a month tck

 

[rolltide14_0]

So I guess Nebraska does no wrong? They just clean as a babies freshly wiped ass?

 

[The Crimson King]

You can get around that by paying $5 a month tck

I don't see how....the interest on my loans is over $300/month. They even garnished my wages $40/week for about 8 months

 

[TheRobotDevil]

I don't see how....the interest on my loans is over $300/month. They even garnished my wages $40/week for about 8 months

I'll get the information to you when she wakes up you're SEC no sanctions

 

[The Crimson King]

I'll get the information to you when she wakes up you're SEC no sanctions

Sweet

 

[TigerBait1971]

You're right, there isn't a damn thing I can do about it.

You damn Dixies smartened up and decided not to call out each other. Your Fuck the NCAA attitude is fantastic and you bonded together with the "nothing to see here" attitude.

We don't pay kids. We try to do it the All World American way.

Heart, effort, great grades, and really really damn good kids is our story.

But Fuck, you don't care about that shit. Winning and Natty's are all that matter.

All World American Way?

LOL!

 

[bocomo007]

this thread stinks of butthurt

 

[Bandwagonbo2]

this thread stinks of butthurt

This^^^

Also smells of a heaping pile of bullshit as well.

We don't pay kids. We try to do it the All World American way.

This line had me almost fall out of my chair laughing.