Series Thread: NBA Finals: Toronto Raptors vs Golden State Warriors

[msgkings322]

missing it buying socks at KMart

KMart sucks!

 

[dtgold88]

I agree it's a silly thing to get worked up about (same with Chief Wahoo) but we're not the groups involved.

If some team called the Hammerin' Heebs had some leering big nosed guy in a black hat with payot as their logo, maybe you wouldn't mind but I bet some in your family would.

So I'm flexible on that stuff

No doubt some might. will say I used to play basketball in a park in Phoenix back in late 80s. A number of Native Americans wore hats with The Chief on it.

Sadly, not much we can do these days without offending someone.

 

[msgkings322]

No doubt some might. will say I used to play basketball in a park in Phoenix back in late 80s. A number of Native Americans wore hats with The Chief on it.

Sadly, not much we can do these days without offending someone.

People are definitely more sensitive for sure, but that's how culture changes. There's a lot of words that used to be ok to use that simply aren't now: Oriental, *****, etc. Used to be ok to have big caricatured black people or Native Americans on logos, now it's not. So what?

 

[TurnUpTheHeat]

No, they won't win tonight.

Oh. Did you send a memo so they can just cancel the game vs risk more injuries?

 

[dtgold88]

People are definitely more sensitive for sure, but that's how culture changes. There's a lot of words that used to be ok to use that simply aren't now: Oriental, *****, etc. Used to be ok to have big caricatured black people or Native Americans on logos, now it's not. So what?

Seinfeld gave me joke telling immunity so I say instead of looking into London NFL can grant a Jerusalem Jews team next decade.

Should we put this on the helmet or just on other sold merchandise? Assuming it's not you, right?

I'd be partial to this one...

I'm going to hell.

 

[dtgold88]

Oh. Did you send a memo so they can just cancel the game vs risk more injuries?

And can we get tips for daily fantasy lineups?

 

[msgkings322]

Seinfeld gave me joke telling immunity so I say instead of looking into London NFL can grant a Jerusalem Jews team next decade.

Should we put this on the helmet or just on other sold merchandise? Assuming it's not you, right?

I'd be partial to this one...

I'm going to hell.

You're safe, Jews don't really believe in Hell

 

[CitySushi]

Seems like the bold above is something that works against Kerr. If not for injury, who knows when/if Green gets his shot?

As for Klay and Curry improving under Kerr? That tends to happen as guys get more experience. Pretty sure Lebron never made an AS appearance and improved and made them under Mike Brown. Became arguably the best player in the entire league. I'd say Kyrie improved under Ty Lue. Doubt anyone wants to give him the credit, even though he played the same position.

Lebron was an allstar in his second year in the league under Paul Silas. Lebron averaged 27/7/7 in his second year in the league. LOL. Lebron was 20.

Kyrie Irving was an allstar in his second year under Byron Scott. Byron freaking Scott. Kyrie Irving was 20.

Hell even Kevin Love was an allstar in his 3rd year at the age of 22.

Klay Thompson didn't make an allstar team until his 4th year, and he was 24. First year was being coached by Kerr.
Steph Curry didn't make an allstar team until his 5th year, when he was 25. First year was with Jackson. First year two years under Kerr he was a back to back MVP.
Draymond Green didn't make an allstar team until his 4th year and he was 25. That was actually his 2nd year under Kerr. He didn't make it his first year being coached by Kerr.

But keep pushing the narrative that Kerr inherited an allstar cast.

 

[dtgold88]

You're safe, Jews don't really believe in Hell

so I'm told...but if we're wrong I'm screwed. Not a fan of the heat, and I doubt they have AC down there.

 

[dtgold88]

Lebron was an allstar in his second year in the league under Paul Silas. Lebron averaged 27/7/7 in his second year in the league. LOL. Lebron was 20.

Kyrie Irving was an allstar in his second year under Byron Scott. Byron freaking Scott. Kyrie Irving was 20.

Hell even Kevin Love was an allstar in his 3rd year at the age of 22.

Klay Thompson didn't make an allstar team until his 4th year, and he was 24. First year was being coached by Kerr.
Steph Curry didn't make an allstar team until his 5th year, when he was 25. First year was with Jackson. First year two years under Kerr he was a back to back MVP.
Draymond Green didn't make an allstar team until his 4th year and he was 25. That was actually his 2nd year under Kerr. He didn't make it his first year being coached by Kerr.

But keep pushing the narrative that Kerr inherited an allstar cast.

Noticed you ignored the point (made by you even) that if Lee does not get hurt, who knows when Green gets a chance. Wasn't Curry often hurt in previous seasons?

Kemba walker made AS appearance in Year 7. Sure, was under Clifford long before this year, but does this mean Clifford got smarter that season?

Are we crediting Rambis for getting Love into the AS game in his second season? DLo made it for the first time this year in year 4 for him.

 

[CitySushi]

Noticed you ignored the point (made by you even) that if Lee does not get hurt, who knows when Green gets a chance. Wasn't Curry often hurt in previous seasons?

Kemba walker made AS appearance in Year 7. Sure, was under Clifford long before this year, but does this mean Clifford got smarter that season?

Are we crediting Rambis for getting Love into the AS game in his second season? DLo made it for the first time this year in year 4 for him.

I didn't ignore it. It actually furthers my point that Kerr didn't inherit a roster full of all-stars like you've been claiming. Of course no one knew Draymond would be this good...not even Kerr. So I really don't know what your point is there. If anything it's just strengthening my position. LOL. You keep taking L's but you don't even know it.

Player growth is always helpful, but maximizing the player's efficiency and cultivating an offense designed to his strengths certainly help. But what a great coach does is put the players in the best position to succeed by playing to their strengths. Creating an offense/defense that maximizes the players potential.

Before Kerr, how many teams did you see employ a full out switching defense? Probably none because it wasn't feasible given the abilities of the players. Kerr saw Draymond's and Klay's strengths as a defender and was able to create a switching defense that caused teams problems for the first few years in the league. Now guess what, everyone wants a big who can switch out on the perimeter. That started with Draymond.

Kerr also saw how much shooting the Warriors had with Steph and Klay and realized they weren't being utilized properly. He created more of a motion offense to get them in more space for open looks, while also utilizing the play making strength of guys like Iguodala, Livingston, Bogut and Draymond. He created an offense in 2015 where our center and power forwards were the focal points of initiating an offense and the guards were the off ball play makers.

And lastly, all you're doing is using hindsight to try and prove your point. If next year Luke Walton coaches the Kings to a 3rd seed in the playoffs and De'Aaron Fox, Buddy Hield and Marvin Bagley all make the all-star team, are you going to then claim Walton inherited a roster full of all-stars and had no impact?

 

[dtgold88]

I didn't ignore it. It actually furthers my point that Kerr didn't inherit a roster full of all-stars like you've been claiming. Of course no one knew Draymond would be this good...not even Kerr. So I really don't know what your point is there. If anything it's just strengthening my position. LOL. You keep taking L's but you don't even know it.

Player growth is always helpful, but maximizing the player's efficiency and cultivating an offense designed to his strengths certainly help. But what a great coach does is put the players in the best position to succeed by playing to their strengths. Creating an offense/defense that maximizes the players potential.

Before Kerr, how many teams did you see employ a full out switching defense? Probably none because it wasn't feasible given the abilities of the players. Kerr saw Draymond's and Klay's strengths as a defender and was able to create a switching defense that caused teams problems for the first few years in the league. Now guess what, everyone wants a big who can switch out on the perimeter. That started with Draymond.

Kerr also saw how much shooting the Warriors had with Steph and Klay and realized they weren't being utilized properly. He created more of a motion offense to get them in more space for open looks, while also utilizing the play making strength of guys like Iguodala, Livingston, Bogut and Draymond. He created an offense in 2015 where our center and power forwards were the focal points of initiating an offense and the guards were the off ball play makers.

And lastly, all you're doing is using hindsight to try and prove your point. If next year Luke Walton coaches the Kings to a 3rd seed in the playoffs and De'Aaron Fox, Buddy Hield and Marvin Bagley all make the all-star team, are you going to then claim Walton inherited a roster full of all-stars and had no impact?

Please find one quote where I said Kerr had "no impact"? Have even said he's solid. But, yes, I believe many coaches are like him. Give him talent and he'll win, don't and he wont.

Wonder if he comes up with something if he doesn't have arguably the 2 best shooters in the game then adds a top 3 player in the league.

Did he forget how smart he was in 2016?

all this said, I'll give him the credit he deserves if they win this series without Durant and maybe Klay and no home court. Though no Durant I still believe GS is more talented.

 

[CitySushi]

Please find one quote where I said Kerr had "no impact"? Have even said he's solid. But, yes, I believe many coaches are like him. Give him talent and he'll win, don't and he wont.

Wonder if he comes up with something if he doesn't have arguably the 2 best shooters in the game then adds a top 3 player in the league.

Did he forget how smart he was in 2016?

all this said, I'll give him all the credit in the world if they win this series without Durant and maybe Klay and no home court.

He was clearly and objectively outcoached by Lue in that series. No question. Perfection isn't a necessary requirement for the job.

Also funny how you like to play the woulda/coulda/shoulda game all the time. What if this...what if that. Well why don't you actually just tackle the tangible thing in front of you which has a proven track record.

See the thing about your "give him talent and he'll win, don't and he won't" comment is that applicable to literally EVERY COACH IN NBA HISTORY. You think Carlisle wins a title without one of the greatest PF's of all time in Dirk and one of the greatest Point Guards in Kidd? You think Riley wins any titles without Magic, Wade or Shaq? You think Pop wins any titles without Duncan, Robinson, Ginobili, Parker? Rudy T without Hakeem and Drexler?

I give up.

 

[TurnUpTheHeat]

so I'm told...but if we're wrong I'm screwed. Not a fan of the heat, and I doubt they have AC down there.

We do unless the Spurs turn it off.

 

[Wamu]

KMart sucks!

Damn right. For the # 1 overall pick Kenyon Martin didn't live up to expectations.

 

[CitySushi]

Damn right. For the # 1 overall pick Kenyon Martin didn't live up to expectations.

That was probably the worst draft class in NBA history. Michael Redd was probably the best player in that draft and he was the 43rd pick and only made one all-star game and an all-nba team the same year.

 

[Wamu]

I didn't ignore it. It actually furthers my point that Kerr didn't inherit a roster full of all-stars like you've been claiming. Of course no one knew Draymond would be this good...not even Kerr. So I really don't know what your point is there. If anything it's just strengthening my position. LOL. You keep taking L's but you don't even know it.

Player growth is always helpful, but maximizing the player's efficiency and cultivating an offense designed to his strengths certainly help. But what a great coach does is put the players in the best position to succeed by playing to their strengths. Creating an offense/defense that maximizes the players potential.

Before Kerr, how many teams did you see employ a full out switching defense? Probably none because it wasn't feasible given the abilities of the players. Kerr saw Draymond's and Klay's strengths as a defender and was able to create a switching defense that caused teams problems for the first few years in the league. Now guess what, everyone wants a big who can switch out on the perimeter. That started with Draymond.

Kerr also saw how much shooting the Warriors had with Steph and Klay and realized they weren't being utilized properly. He created more of a motion offense to get them in more space for open looks, while also utilizing the play making strength of guys like Iguodala, Livingston, Bogut and Draymond. He created an offense in 2015 where our center and power forwards were the focal points of initiating an offense and the guards were the off ball play makers.

And lastly, all you're doing is using hindsight to try and prove your point. If next year Luke Walton coaches the Kings to a 3rd seed in the playoffs and De'Aaron Fox, Buddy Hield and Marvin Bagley all make the all-star team, are you going to then claim Walton inherited a roster full of all-stars and had no impact?

I think I know what's going on here. Here's my take on Kerr. And you're right, he didn't over a roster full of AS's. It's tough to properly judge him as HC because of the great team he has. But before I go on I wanna say I think he's a damn good HC. A coach doesn't go to 5 straights Finals if he doesn't know what he's doing.

He obviously hasn't had a roster lacking talent. Or taken over a perennial cellar dweller. But that's a bit of nitpicking. As far as I'm concerned ranking current coaches he's gotta be # 2 right? With Pop being # 1. <---shocker huh?

 

[Wamu]

That was probably the worst draft class in NBA history. Michael Redd was probably the best player in that draft and he was the 43rd pick and only made one all-star game and an all-nba team the same year.

I had to look @ the 2000 draft class. You're right. Holy crap is that awful. Mark Madsen (# 29 pick) was a helluva dancer though.

 

[CitySushi]

I think I know what's going on here. Here's my take on Kerr. And you're right, he didn't over a roster full of AS's. It's tough to properly judge him as HC because of the great team he has. But before I go on I wanna say I think he's a damn good HC. A coach doesn't go to 5 straights Finals if he doesn't know what he's doing.

He obviously hasn't had a roster lacking talent. Or taken over a perennial cellar dweller. But that's a bit of nitpicking. As far as I'm concerned ranking current coaches he's gotta be # 2 right? With Pop being # 1. <---shocker huh?

100% Pop is #1. Without question.

Kerr has definitely been blessed with talent. Absolute fact. But diminishing what he's been able to accomplish as him being completely replaceable by another coach is ridiculously understating what actual, tangible, changes he's made with the team. I've been one of the more critical ones around here of Kerr. You can go back and look at how many times I've bitched about rotations, in game adjustments, and just questionable moves. But overall I give him his due because he designed the overall car and made sure each player was a working part to make it an unstoppable machine.

Part of being a coach is understanding your players and putting them in positions to succeed. There have been plenty of talented teams in the past that haven't gotten it done because they haven't been put in the best positions to succeed. From a talent perspective, the 76ers had way more than any other team in the East. They didn't make it to the conference finals. The Nuggets had way more talent overall than the Blazers, but they didn't make it either. The Clippers had CP3, JJ Redick, Jamal Crawford, Blake Griffin, DeAndre Jordan, etc. and never made it past the 2nd round. Lots of examples in NBA history of teams underachieving based on talent.

 

[Wamu]

100% Pop is #1. Without question.

Kerr has definitely been blessed with talent. Absolute fact. But diminishing what he's been able to accomplish as him being completely replaceable by another coach is ridiculously understating what actual, tangible, changes he's made with the team. I've been one of the more critical ones around here of Kerr. You can go back and look at how many times I've bitched about rotations, in game adjustments, and just questionable moves. But overall I give him his due because he designed the overall car and made sure each player was a working part to make it an unstoppable machine.

Part of being a coach is understanding your players and putting them in positions to succeed. There have been plenty of talented teams in the past that haven't gotten it done because they haven't been put in the best positions to succeed. From a talent perspective, the 76ers had way more than any other team in the East. They didn't make it to the conference finals. The Nuggets had way more talent overall than the Blazers, but they didn't make it either. The Clippers had CP3, JJ Redick, Jamal Crawford, Blake Griffin, DeAndre Jordan, etc. and never made it past the 2nd round. Lots of examples in NBA history of teams underachieving based on talent.

Call me crazy but I think the real secret to Kerr's success is Mike Brown. Since he became an assistant the Warriors are 2-0 in the Final & eyeing a 3-peat. But that glory hog Kerr is taking all the credit.