NBA Finals: Cleveland Cavs VS Golden State Warriors

[Black Adam]

To be fair to Gilbert, he is the owner ,not the GM so he's not the one putting the team together. That falls on David Griffin

well, if the GM is fucking up Gilbert DOES have the right to kick him to the curb...

just sayin' it doesn't seem like Gilbert's opposed to how things were put together...

 

[trojanfan12]

I just think if he had the option of handpicking their roster, they would have much better role players. I'll give you Kyrie, K-Love, James Jones, Mike Miller, Shawn Marion, and Mo Williams. After that I think it was the GM. As I stated before, I also do think he requested Waiters to be traded for a true Center. Didn't think he expected to get Shump and JR in that trade as well. They were just looked at as throw ins because both were really bad for a terrible knicks team

He handpicked the main guys. Roster fillers don't matter. Look at post #3647. Those comparisons are dead on. He wanted a younger version of the Heat. He knew the Heat had the right roster to beat OKC and the Spurs, but they got old. So, he wanted a younger version in Cleveland.

 

[bksballer89]

Love didn't make a decision. He was traded.

Agree

 

[bksballer89]

well, if the GM is fucking up Gilbert DOES have the right to kick him to the curb...

just sayin' it doesn't seem like Gilbert's opposed to how thing were put together...

I agree with this. Owner usually approves whatever moves the GM is making

 

[tlance]

He did. That's why he went back. The team he had in Miami beat both OKC and the Spurs. But they got old. The Cavs are built to beat OKC and the Spurs.

It's ridiculously obvious that he wanted a younger version of the Heat team he had in Miami.

He saw Kyrie as a younger Wade, Tristan as a younger Haslem. He orchestrated the trade for Love because he saw Love as a younger Bosh. He wanted JR Smith because he saw him as a younger Ray Allen and he wanted Shump as a younger Chalmers for his defense.

It wasn't necessarily a bad idea. Had he gotten OKC or the Spurs, it may well have worked. Unfortunately for him, GSW decided to become historically good.

You and Wiggy are literally the only ones who think Lebron didn't put together this roster.

Clearly, you know exactly what LeBron was thinking when he resigned.

Sure, he thought Cleveland gave him a chance to win or he would not have gone back. But, to say a team that failed to make the playoffs for 4 straight years before gave him his BEST possible chance to win is ignorant.

There were quite a few places he could have gone that had proven winners on the roster. He chose home instead.

 

[Mecca of the “B” Team]

I like Wiggy - I don't know why, but somehow he sounds like an adorable child that I would love to hug. I think people in here are a bit harsh on every one in here any way and at least he is consistent with his love for his team.

He can be obnoxious.

But, if you get him on a neutral topic, he can be enjoyable to debate with.

 

[Shaqdaddy11]

If you think Lebron trusted Gilbert to put together a team that could win, you're as delusional as Wiggy.

And he thinks I'M the bad poster

 

[bksballer89]

He handpicked the main guys. Roster fillers don't matter. Look at post #3647. Those comparisons are dead on. He wanted a younger version of the Heat. He knew the Heat had the right roster to beat OKC and the Spurs, but they got old. So, he wanted a younger version in Cleveland.

I see your point. Not sure if I read it here or somewhere else but I was reading that when Lebron went to the Cavs, he was trying to have a roster good enough to beat San Antonio and OKC. Nobody was setting up their roster to beat the Warriors because they came out of nowhere.

 

[trojanfan12]

I think he put a ungodly amount of pressure on management to make wholesale changes.

How did he do that? 2 year contracts with an opt-out after the first year.

Lebron is a passive aggressive manipulator.

Look back at his statement when he returned...remember how he mentioned his new teammates, yet conveniently left off Wiggins?

He called Love personally to recruit him.

Guys on the team are firing their representation and hire Lebron's cause they know he can pressure them.

Not sure.how that could be construed any other way.


Yahoo Sports reports that LeBron James has reached out to Minnesota Timberwolves forward Kevin Love to tell him he wants him to join theCavaliers.

View attachment 125768Adrian Wojnarowski

✔@WojVerticalNBA
LeBron James has reached to tell Kevin Love of his desire for them to play together with the Cavaliers, front office sources tell Yahoo.

4:41 PM - 17 Jul 2014


This follows word from Thursday afternoon that the Cavs are suddenly opento the possibility of trading Andrew Wiggins for Love, as it seems there's at least some momentum in that direction. The decision is a hard one, but if James is actively moving to help secure Love's interest and commitment, it could shift the leverage of the situation, particularly if Love said he would not commit long-term to any team except the Cavs.

 

[trojanfan12]

I see your point. Not sure if I read it here or somewhere else but I was reading that when Lebron went to the Cavs, he was trying to have a roster good enough to beat San Antonio and OKC. Nobody was setting up their roster to beat the Warriors because they came out of nowhere.

I posted it. It wasn't my original thought though. Cowherd said it yesterday morning on his show and it makes a ton of sense.

 

[Eugene Baker III]

FIRST PAGE OF THIS THREAD IS HILARIOUS

"Cavs Sweep!"

 

[Kold]

Who called this group his best supporting cast ever? Wiggy?

C'mon man. They rolled through weak competition in the East. Basing that analysis on the extremely small 10 game sample size is foolish at best. I guess being in the Finals makes them championship caliber, but this roster is not anywhere near as good as Kobe's Laker teams or Jordan's Bulls.

I am not making excuses for LeBron. All I am saying is that everybody places far too much emphasis on titles when discussing individual greatness. I don't know how many times I have to say that. Criticize LeBron for turning the ball over or not hustling back, or being a bad leader. I am good with all that.

Just don't say that his legacy is diminished because of another Finals loss. The Cavs never had a prayer against GS and many of us were saying this in January. Now all of a sudden he is expected to win? The Warriors are better.

For your first question, I'm not saying that these guys are the be all to end all, but the conversation was there about the supporting cast. And yeah, was here on these boards as well.

Moving on, even within the weak East, the Cavs got all of the love when they were shooting the lights out/breaking records from the 3 point line....but for me personally, it was never about the recent run, going all the way back to the beginning of the season(and throughout), it was pretty clear to me that the Cavs, GS, OKC, and SA were the teams that were championship caliber/title or bust teams. For me, it's hard to put a title or bust narrative on a team if I don't believe that they could win a title with the talent that they have.

As for this team vs one of Kobe's teams, I'll gladly be willing to debate this Cavs team vs what Kobe had in the 2008 Finals.
Starters- Kyrie, Jr, Lebron, Love, TT vs Fisher, Kobe, Radmanivic, L.O, Pau,
Bench- Shumpert, Dellavadova, Moz, Jefferson, Frye vs Vujacic, Farmar, Turiaf, Walton, Mbenga

I feel comfortable in saying that the Cavs this year, would have more than enough of a chance to battle that Laker team from 08. Also, to the being hard on Lebron point, the Lakers got through the tough West that year(beating the Spurs), then lost in the Finals(w/o Bynum/Ariza), and Kobe got thrown completely under the bus that year without any public reasoning/narrative for his team's loss. The public narrative was "well see, he can't get it done w/o Shaq". Also, that was the year when Odom was a no show, and the year when Pau got punked by KG, but once again the praise was(rightfully so) just given to Boston's defense.

As for Lebron's legacy, I'm not the one that's going to say that rings are the be all to end all, but when Lebron got the titles in back to back years, I heard a lot of "well Lebron got his titles in his 7th and 8th year just like Jordan". Also, when they were about to face the Spurs again, the debated RAGED on that Lebron was going to surpass Jordan at the rate that he was going, and that wasn't just talk here on Sportshoop, but a lot of the narrative got started back when Pippen said that Lebron was better than Jordan, and after the Heat beat the Pacers that year. I say all of that to say that, to say that if Finals WINS mean something, then Finals losses have to mean a little bit of something as well, and especially this year. Lebron said that they were "well equipped" to play the Warriors this year. He lamented the fact that these playoffs were different because they had Love and Irving. Losing is one thing, but if HE says that, and the Cavs continue to get BLOWN off the floor, than that's at least somewhat of a hit to his legacy, especially considering that he may be losing to a person that people have said has dethroned him as the best player in the world

 

[gordontrue]

Love didn't make a decision. He was traded.

He was months away from being an unrestricted free agent. He had a decision. No one was going to trade for him without getting convincing commitment from him.

 

[trojanfan12]

To be fair to Gilbert, he is the owner ,not the GM so he's not the one putting the team together. That falls on David Griffin

True, but it's Gilberts money, so I'm pretty sure he at least signs off on everything.

He's darn sure signing all of those checks.

 

[trojanfan12]

Clearly, you know exactly what LeBron was thinking when he resigned.

Sure, he thought Cleveland gave him a chance to win or he would not have gone back. But, to say a team that failed to make the playoffs for 4 straight years before gave him his BEST possible chance to win is ignorant.

There were quite a few places he could have gone that had proven winners on the roster. He chose home instead.

Read Mecca's post #3660 it's all there with links.

Then you can come back and admit you were wrong.

 

[Mecca of the “B” Team]

Clearly, you know exactly what LeBron was thinking when he resigned.

Sure, he thought Cleveland gave him a chance to win or he would not have gone back. But, to say a team that failed to make the playoffs for 4 straight years before gave him his BEST possible chance to win is ignorant.

There were quite a few places he could have gone that had proven winners on the roster. He chose home instead.

Do you think it's out of the realm of possibilities that he went "Home" because Riley would not bend to his will?

Riley was clear that the name on the front of the Jersey is more important than the one on the back.

In Gilbert's desperation to bring the prodigal son home, he ceded the keys to the castle.

 

[trojanfan12]

He was months away from being an unrestricted free agent. He had a decision. No one was going to trade for him without getting convincing commitment from him.

It doesn't matter. He wasn't unrestricted, so he got traded. If you recall, all of the speculation at the time was that he was going to go to the Lakers. Then he got traded, got a taste of a title run and re-signed.

 

[Black Adam]

True, but it's Gilberts money, so I'm pretty sure he at least signs off on everything.

He's darn sure signing all of those checks.

probably looks at Tristan's with TEARS in his eyes...

 

[gordontrue]

You guys are so sure of things that can't be known. I'm embarrassed for you.

 

[trojanfan12]

probably looks at Tristan's with TEARS in his eyes...

I can hear Tristan now, "How come there's always water spots on my checks?"