Minnesota #1? Why not?!

[PnkPanther]

You should, but why would you as you may then be forced to defend something I posted, and you would never defend a fellow Gopher fan if it threatened your status among this crowd here, lol. You have to maintain your reputation as being unbiased by bashing your own team and a fellow gopher fan, even when he's right about something. Go on, sell your soul just to keep some fake online respect from loser fans of other programs. You are too mentally weak to stand up for an unpopular idea or thought or opinion, I understand.

oh, I'll defend the gophers and have even chimed in when I disagreed with larger points

But defending you? You're on your own with this lunacy

I'm well aware of gophers history. I'm proud of it. But it's HISTORY

 

[fredsdeadfriend]

Says the guy who uses peach basket non dribbling basketball to talk about his school's prowess in hoops.

AND SIX Naismith Basketball Hall of Famers and the 11th or 12th most players put into the NBA!!!

And the Western Conference Championship Trophy being named after a former Gopher, and the NBA being created basically by a huge Gopher fan/reporter and former Gophers being prominent in the FIRST NBA DYNASTY.

 

[Stakesarehigh]

I was talking back in the day, late 50s through the late 90s, you moron. I explained how UMn football fell from it's status as a helmet school and perennial contender for the national title. Duh. Try being aware of what it is you are trying to criticize before criticizing it and proving you are a moron.

Over those 40 years or so Minnesota is 40 games below .500

That's their good old days?

 

[Stakesarehigh]

AND SIX Naismith Basketball Hall of Famers and the 11th or 12th most players put into the NBA!!!

And the Western Conference Championship Trophy being named after a former Gopher, and the NBA being created basically by a huge Gopher fan/reporter and former Gophers being prominent in the FIRST NBA DYNASTY.

How many BIG titles in the last 50 years

 

[Stakesarehigh]

Just because we haven't been to the rose bowl since 1962 doesn't mean we're not one of the greatest schools to ever step on the field

Historically Minnesota def has a place.

 

[fredsdeadfriend]

oh, I'll defend the gophers and have even chimed in when I disagreed with larger points

But defending you? You're on your own with this lunacy

I'm well aware of gophers history. I'm proud of it. But it's HISTORY

Yes, and understanding history helps people in the present avoid making the mistakes made in the past.

UMn's admin made the mistake of not investing in it's football program, you do know that UMn football almost went the route of Chicago football, right? the surprising 1960 natl title winning season is the only thing that saved Minnesota Gopher football.

Understanding the FACT that attitude of not wanting to fund the football program was directly responsible for that 30 year TOTAL drought from 68 to 97, of even coming close to winning a conf title, and the decade of decline from 61-67, where they were slowly losing the mojo they had in 60, helps simple minded idiots differentiate from those 40 years and what's been going on since 1997 when Glen Mason got hired.





That attitude of not wanting to fund the football program changed right around 1997, with President Yudof(sp?) and the new AD he hired and the hiring of Glen Mason, by 1998 with his surprise win over #2 ranked Penn St and his getting them to a bowl game and his producing or developing a couple star players, the fans took on an attitude of raised expectations and hope.

Since 1997, and especially after the 99 Clem Haskins debacle decimated the bb program, while the winning percentage didn't improve drastically, due in part to seasons like 1997, 2001(injuries rocked Mason's team as he brought in little depth behind his star players), the entire 4 year tenure of Tim Brewster, Kill's 1st season trying to rebuild from the mess Brewster left him, and Fleck's first season, having to clean up another mess, regardless what DID change drastically and is now seeing the fruits of that change, is the amount of money and attention the admin has been willing to give to the football program.

Since 1997, a new outdoor stadium was built, a new practice facility was built and a hot shot coach everyone figured was the #1 candidate at that time(can't say that about either Mason or Kill) was hired and given a good salary, as someone pointed out is the 17th highest salary in the nation right now?


All of that should tell the intelligent people of the cfb world that the losing of the 70s, 80s and 90s shouldn't be held against Minnesota and anyone pointing to those 3 decades to bolster their dumb opinion that no one can ever win at Minnesota now, is simple minded dumbassery!!!

 

[fredsdeadfriend]

Over those 40 years or so Minnesota is 40 games below .500

That's their good old days?

Wow, you really need a reading comprehension class or two or three? Or maybe just a simple brain transplant? Could you really be this stupid???


I didn't say, "good old days", I said "back in the day", with the "the" being referred to being the days when the UMn admin conspired to give up football at Minnesota, DUH, and hence their efforts leading to the program simply being poorly funded or supported for 40+ years, which led to 3 decades of totally never even sniffing at a conf title.

 

[HawkFan]

Fleck is 37-23 overall and 21-22 vs Big Ten. He is 3-14 against Big Ten opponents with a record above .500.

 

[Stakesarehigh]

Wow, you really need a reading comprehension class or two or three? Or maybe just a simple brain transplant? Could you really be this stupid???


I didn't say, "good old days", I said "back in the day", with the "the" being referred to being the days when the UMn admin conspired to give up football at Minnesota, DUH, and hence their efforts leading to the program simply being poorly funded or supported for 40+ years, which led to 3 decades of totally never even sniffing at a conf title.

No one is reading your novels closely

 

[Gator]

NO, it's NOT beyond ridiculous.

Look it up for yourself.

Dabo, in his 2nd-4th non-covid affected seasons went

9-5
6-7
10-4

25-16. Just ONE win over a Top 20 ranked team. 1-2 in bowl games.



Fleck, in his 2nd-4th non-covid affected seasons went

7-6
11-2
9-4



Dabo went 11-2 in his 5th season. Fleck could easily finish 11-2 this season, if not better?

27-12. With THREE wins over Top 20 ranked teams, including a win over Top Ten rated PSU. 3-0 in bowl games.


27 > 25

12 < 16

3 > 1

3-0 > 1-2

There you go again with total BS! Let's see just how much of a lying, conniving, and totally disingenuous SOB you are.

Dabo started coaching on games 7 of 2008 season after Tommy Bowden resigned. Dabo had to use Bowden's coaches and playbook for the rest of the season. However if we started at G7 2008 and went through the end of 2012 ("Five seasons") and compared it to the actual first five seasons of PJ, PJ loses.

Turns out that Dabo had a better record than PJ (40-21 vs 35-23). Dabo played more AP ranked teams than PJ (19 to 14). Played more teams with winning records and therefore fewer teams with losing records than PJ. Therefore it's an "unfair " comparison.

You have a problem with the "covid-year" and want to skip it. However if we omit the "covid-year" because it was only a partial year (7 games even though the NCAA counts it as a year) and we omit Dabo first year as a "partial year", guess what? PJ loses again.

Now Dabo only played more AP ranked opponents (17 to 13) and his lead in winning percentage is lower (36-18 to 32-19). He still leads in playing more teams with winning records and fewer teams with losing records than PJ.

You want to omit BOTH of PJ's losing seasons. However, if we omit Dabo's 2 worst seasons (the partial first season and his 3rd season, dang it PJ loses again!!
Again Dabo plays more AP ranked opponents (now down to 12 to 10) and has a better winning record (30-11 to PJ's 27-12). Dabo still leads in playing more teams with winning records and fewer teams with losing records than PJ.

Your final proposal was to drop the two losing seasons for PJ (seasons 1 and 4 where PJ was a combined 8-11) and keep Dabo's losing season but drop two winning seasons for Dabo (seasons 1 and 3 where Dabo was a combined 15-5)! Now, as you have astutely pointed out, PJ finally has a better winning record (27-12 to Dabo's 25-16). However PJ STILL CLEARLY loses the scheduling battle.

Pretty clear who has better "GOODS" (Clemson win 27 to 17).




Pretty clear that Clemson has less "BADS" (14 to 22).

I am NOT saying that PJ Fleck is a bad coach. I am saying that SO FAR he hasn't done as much as Dabo did this far into his career and you need to STOP trying to convince everyone that he has!

 

[Stakesarehigh]

Fleck is 37-23 overall and 21-22 vs Big Ten. He is 3-14 against Big Ten opponents with a record above .500.

Practically 2018 clemson

 

[fredsdeadfriend]

Historically Minnesota def has a place.

And with the right coach, they can again rise up into at least a fairly regular top ten ranked team. Sort of like Wisconsin did for awhile there, except hopefully more frequently up there. Not trying to claim Fleck is for sure absolutely THAT coach, but if he's not THAT coach, he could be the coach that sets Minnesota up to snag THAT coach. UMn could also fuck it up like they did when they hired that schmuck Tim Brewster?

But all indications except recruiting rankings, show that Fleck is on a similar path/trajectory that Dabo was on early on at Clemson. Now you all seem to believe that the recruiting thing is absolute proof Fleck is not on par with early seasons Dabo, and he may need a longer period of time to get to where Dabo got,

OR you all could be wrong and Fleck and his staff's ability to both find diamonds in the rough and/or to develop players into much better players than the recruiting services ever predicted may eventually prove to be enough to overcome his lack of top notch recruits. Like how Gagliardi found a way to win doing things in a totally different way than what was otherwise the generally accepted ways people thought were needed to win, maybe Fleck's way of doing things, his team building and family focused mentality towards things, could lead to Minnesota doing a football version of what Butler did in cbb or what Gagliardi did in D3 football?

That's all I'm saying, until Fleck loses more than 3 games this year or wins them all and leaves for something like the UCLA or S Car job maybe, nothing that's happened in 2019, or even 2021 or this year proves any of you all right and me wrong.

 

[fredsdeadfriend]

Practically 2018 clemson

No, more like 2009-2011 clemson.

 

[PnkPanther]

Fleck is 37-23 overall and 21-22 vs Big Ten. He is 3-14 against Big Ten opponents with a record above .500.

he's never won game 7-3 with 4 points coming off safeties

we're coming for Floyd this year

 

[fredsdeadfriend]

No one is reading your novels closely

No duh, you wouldn't respond with such dumb idiotic responses if you did.

 

[fredsdeadfriend]

Fleck is 37-23 overall and 21-22 vs Big Ten. He is 3-14 against Big Ten opponents with a record above .500.

Iowa's scored only 14 points so far this year, lol.

 

[Stakesarehigh]

No duh, you wouldn't respond with such dumb idiotic responses if you did.

Pro tip

Edit yourself.

 

[fredsdeadfriend]

There you go again with total BS! Let's see just how much of a lying, conniving, and totally disingenuous SOB you are.

Dabo started coaching on games 7 of 2008 season after Tommy Bowden resigned. Dabo had to use Bowden's coaches and playbook for the rest of the season. However if we started at G7 2008 and went through the end of 2012 ("Five seasons") and compared it to the actual first five seasons of PJ, PJ loses.

Turns out that Dabo had a better record than PJ (40-21 vs 35-23). Dabo played more AP ranked teams than PJ (19 to 14). Played more teams with winning records and therefore fewer teams with losing records than PJ. Therefore it's an "unfair " comparison.

You have a problem with the "covid-year" and want to skip it. However if we omit the "covid-year" because it was only a partial year (7 games even though the NCAA counts it as a year) and we omit Dabo first year as a "partial year", guess what? PJ loses again.

Now Dabo only played more AP ranked opponents (17 to 13) and his lead in winning percentage is lower (36-18 to 32-19). He still leads in playing more teams with winning records and fewer teams with losing records than PJ.

You want to omit BOTH of PJ's losing seasons. However, if we omit Dabo's 2 worst seasons (the partial first season and his 3rd season, dang it PJ loses again!!
Again Dabo plays more AP ranked opponents (now down to 12 to 10) and has a better winning record (30-11 to PJ's 27-12). Dabo still leads in playing more teams with winning records and fewer teams with losing records than PJ.

Your final proposal was to drop the two losing seasons for PJ (seasons 1 and 4 where PJ was a combined 8-11) and keep Dabo's losing season but drop two winning seasons for Dabo (seasons 1 and 3 where Dabo was a combined 15-5)! Now, as you have astutely pointed out, PJ finally has a better winning record (27-12 to Dabo's 25-16). However PJ STILL CLEARLY loses the scheduling battle.

Pretty clear who has better "GOODS" (Clemson win 27 to 17).


View attachment 308186

Pretty clear that Clemson has less "BADS" (14 to 22).

I am NOT saying that PJ Fleck is a bad coach. I am saying that SO FAR he hasn't done as much as Dabo did this far into his career and you need to STOP trying to convince everyone that he has!

The thing is, I showed how it's clear that the ACC is a lesser conference as compared to the B1G, so a 7-6 ACC team is no where as good as a 7-6 B1G team.

I'm sure a thorough analysis of how 5-7, 6-6, 7-5, and 8-4 teams from both the ACC and B1G do in their bowl games would show this "opinion" of mine is based in factual data. But at the moment I don't want to take the time to do that analysis.


And you keep ignoring THAT FACT that playing more ranked teams or teams with winning records doesn't mean you are a better team,

but beating THREE Top 20 teams compared to only beating one 19th ranked team,
and beating THREE bowl game opponents compared to only beating one,

those FACTS speak much louder to the average cfb fan.


What skews things for you simple minded moronic fans is that you can't stop from letting what's happened since 2011 distort and bias your perspective.

 

[fredsdeadfriend]

Pro tip

Edit yourself.

Why? That would deprive me of the enjoyment of seeing simple minded idiots like you from embarrassing yourself with the stupid comments you make.

AND... it will make my enjoyment greater when I end up being right, and on the other side of the coin, it will make your enjoyment greater if I end up being wrong, which is how it works, lol.

 

[Stakesarehigh]

Why? That would deprive me of the enjoyment of seeing simple minded idiots like you from embarrassing yourself with the stupid comments you make.

AND... it will make my enjoyment greater when I end up being right, and on the other side of the coin, it will make your enjoyment greater if I end up being wrong, which is how it works, lol.

No one reads your points when they are multiple paragraphs.

And you won't be right

So there's that as well.