Mayhew is about to do something real crazy.

[TrustMeIamRight]

Signing him doesn't mean to stop upgrading at a position thats been pure hell for the Lions. Investing in Watkins now may pay off over the long run for the defense.

Pure hell? If finishing 3rd, 5th and 6th in passing offense the last 3 years is pure hell. What phrase would you use for our passing defense?

 

[lionstop1]

Our RBs had to do a lot with those numbers. Our CB situation was hell too. I like Gilbert at 10 too.

 

[gandydancer]

Watkins or not, Mayhew will continue to draft WR's until he is fired. Next year we'll be hearing how we need to go WR in round 1 again to "help draw attention away from Sammy and Calvin" or some crap.

Nothing has changed since 2001 with this club.

Saw 2 mocks for 2015 that had Lions drafting WR Green-Beckham (Mizzou) at #15 and 17. One guy had them taking Evans this year another had Gilbert this year. At least he went defense in 2014. Said them same words to myself.

 

[TrustMeIamRight]

Bro, Watkins doesn't have to out-jump everyone in the endzone to score when he can simply just beat defenders to it or catch slants or something. Tate has done pretty well catching balls at his size and I'm sure he'll get his tds.

If Mayhew was trying to save his job by drafting Watkins, I would think that it does make some sense to grasp an elite prospect to take over when your great player exits.

Isn't that what they went out and paid top dollar for Tate to do? To beat defenders off the line, run slants and catch the ball?

The red zone in the NFL is so tough to score, because defenses don't have to worry about teams getting behind them. It is also why the guys you see leading the NFL in touchdowns are all big WRs, as they go up and over CB's to make plays. 10 players in the NFL finished with 11 or more TD catches last year. Guess how many were 6'1" and under. Zero. 15 players had 9 or more TD catches last year -- 2 of the 15 were 6'1" or under.

Detroit's problem isn't moving the football. Detroit's problem is putting up touchdowns. That is why I said -- If Watkins were as tall as Evans, with all his other attributes -- I could understand why they would be willing to part with valuable picks to get him. I think this is a desperation move by Mayhew to try and save his job by trying to get the team into the playoffs by outscoring everyone. Only problem is -- once they get there, they will be facing teams will elite QBs and the Lions defense will be exposed as it was against New Orleans a few years ago.

 

[TrustMeIamRight]

Our RBs had to do a lot with those numbers.

And we still have those same running backs AND we added Golden Tate.

 

[gandydancer]

This debate over Watkins is like a preacher telling a atheist there is a God. At no point will there be middle ground on the stance.

 

[Gulf of Brazil]

This debate over Watkins is like a preacher telling a atheist there is a God. At no point will there be middle ground on the stance.

The most grounded statement on this thread, so far.

 

[tpaulus_2]

I agree -- Detroit did have to overpay to bring in Tate, but that should have ended the discussions of drafting a WR in the 1st round. Detroit gave Tate a contract making him the 20th highest paid WR in the NFL and they already have the the highest paid WR.

Detroit has finished anywhere from 3rd to 6th in passing yards the last 3 years. Last year, they did so with a mish mash of WR's, as everyone was hurt, and at one point their top 4 WRs were injured.

If Watkins was going to be a big red zone target -- I could understand people really wanting to go up to get him. Detroit's problem offensively wasn't moving the ball -- it was getting it into the end zone. At 6'1" with a very average vertical leap -- Watkins isn't going to be jumping over DB's to catch balls.

IMO -- The talk about trading up for Watkins is nothing more than Mayhew trying to save his job for another year. Drafting Watkins may get the Lions to the playoffs, in a season deemed, win now mode. I believe he feels if he gets the Lions to the playoffs in 2014 -- he will keep his job. Problem is -- it doesn't change the fact the Lions defense will be victimized when they have to play a quality team and will more than likely be one and done.

Maybe I am just missing something on Watkins. I think he will be really good player in the NFL, but I just don't understand the infatuation to the point of trading away picks you badly need for a WR who isn't tall (he is tweener between a slot and a big WR), is fast but not a burner and has an average vertical leap. Honestly -- I look at Watkins as a slightly bigger version of the guy we just signed as a FA. Also -- I think Watkins will be best used in the slot, where he can use his biggest asset, which is his quickness. I just don't see how that equates to a can't miss player you trade up to get.

Imo, you're seeing Watkins as you want to see him in order to make it easier to trash the trade-up talk. You're focusing on him not being 6'4" (even though he's not at all small by WR standards), and also his vertical jump over and over, because, apparently, he's going to be completely incapable of getting any separation whatsoever (despite his speed and quickness) and will have to jump over whomever is covering him to make a catch.

I'm not a fan of trading up for Watkins, but trying to pick him apart as a prospect that pretty much everyone else agrees is the best WR prospect since Green/Jones a few years ago seems more like you have an agenda to serve, vs. an objective opinion on the guy...

 

[Gulf of Brazil]

If Mayhew thinks there's only 5 elite prospects in this draft and Sammy is one of them then Mayhew will probably pull the trade. I don't agree with a wr as a 1st rd pick but Watkins could be special. I'd rather see Donald or Clinton-Dix.

 

[Gulf of Brazil]

Imo, you're seeing Watkins as you want to see him in order to make it easier to trash the trade-up talk. You're focusing on him not being 6'4" (even though he's not at all small by WR standards), and also his vertical jump over and over, because, apparently, he's going to be completely incapable of getting any separation whatsoever (despite his speed and quickness) and will have to jump over whomever is covering him to make a catch.

I'm not a fan of trading up for Watkins, but trying to pick him apart as a prospect that pretty much everyone else agrees is the best WR prospect since Green/Jones a few years ago seems more like you have an agenda to serve, vs. an objective opinion on the guy...

YEP.

 

[lionstop1]

I will now close my end of the argument. I enjoy debating but its not worth trying to get m point across because we all have our own opinion. I dont think you guys have to worry about the trade though because I dont think any of the teams will be willing to move down.

I simply see a team possibly going for a elite prospect while others see it as just a #3 WR. Good luck on getting the guys you want come draft day.

 

[Gulf of Brazil]

I will now close my end of the argument. I enjoy debating but its not worth trying to get m point across because we all have our own opinion. I dont think you guys have to worry about the trade though because I dont think any of the teams will be willing to move down.

I simply see a team possibly going for a elite prospect while others see it as just a #3 WR. Good luck on getting the guys you want come draft day.

Man, stick to your guns on who you want and why. You make a lot of valid points LionStop regarding Watkins elite skills, as everyone knows he has those, and CJ rarely practiced last year except on Friday's due to his knee issues. We all saw what happened when he went out. Having Ogletree, Durham, Edwards isn't much to be proud of as replacements should CJ or Tate go down with an injury. I'm not a fan of a 1st rd WR but I can understand Mayhew wanting an ELITE PROSPECT.

 

[gandydancer]

I don't feel it is end of world if Watkins is taken. Mayhew and Zanders hit on 5 contributors last year coupled with 2 UDFA's. My only problem is what will it cost and take away from potential contributors from this draft?. We are making so much emphasis on "elite" players. We have 2 and a 3rd on the brink. Not equating to W's. When was last time the Pats and Packers got the "elite" pick?? Draft and develope these kids.

 

[TrustMeIamRight]

Imo, you're seeing Watkins as you want to see him in order to make it easier to trash the trade-up talk. You're focusing on him not being 6'4" (even though he's not at all small by WR standards), and also his vertical jump over and over, because, apparently, he's going to be completely incapable of getting any separation whatsoever (despite his speed and quickness) and will have to jump over whomever is covering him to make a catch.

I'm not a fan of trading up for Watkins, but trying to pick him apart as a prospect that pretty much everyone else agrees is the best WR prospect since Green/Jones a few years ago seems more like you have an agenda to serve, vs. an objective opinion on the guy...

That is just my opinion of Watkins. I've said repeatedly that I think he will be a good WR in the NFL. I just don't see him as being a dominating can't miss WR. The guy went from Freshman All-American to the #2 WR on his own team in college his sophomore year.

With the NFL teams going to big CB's to counter all the big WR's, IMO, the only WR's worthy of a top 10 pick are those who fit the mold of the WR's dominating the NFL right now, which is big, tall WR's, who can run and jump, who go up over CB's and teams basically throw the ball up to on fade routes in the red zone.

I don't see Watkins as that type of WR. I see him being most successful used in the slot, where his quickness will be utilized to its fullest. I will have no problem coming on here and saying I was dead wrong on Watkins if he goes out and puts up elite numbers.

 

[Kreton]

Just to compare trading up vs keeping the picks, trading up is usually a good idea. Most years the top talent is worth giving up a couple maybes or possibly good talents. Mack and Watkins seem to fit this mold. Get the best player we can in the first. Even if at the expense of the later rounds.

2012 we took Reiff and Broyles. Could have moved up and taken Khalil if we wanted a T.

In 2011 we had alot of holes to fill. What if we traded our 1st, and 2 2nds to move up for peterson? We'd have peterson and we'd have lost Fairley, Titus Young, LeShoure. And the Lions were trying to move up for Peterson.

2010 we took Suh @ 2 so no real moving up to do.

2009 we took Stafford @ 1 so no moving up there either.

 

[Gulf of Brazil]

That is just my opinion of Watkins. I've said repeatedly that I think he will be a good WR in the NFL. I just don't see him as being a dominating can't miss WR. The guy went from Freshman All-American to the #2 WR on his own team in college his sophomore year.
QUOTE]

NOPE. He was the #2 WR on his team as a frosh and Soph. DeAndre Hopkins was Clemson's #1 WR both years until being drafted by Houston in 2013. Martavis Bryant couldn't get a sniff of much playing time in Hopkins last year at Clemson in 2012

 

[TrustMeIamRight]

Just to compare trading up vs keeping the picks, trading up is usually a good idea.

You forgot trading up to draft Best in the 1st round. Trading up to draft LeShoure in the 2nd round. Also -- if Detroit traded away a 3rd round pick last year -- they wouldn't have Warford. If they traded away a 2nd and 3rd, they wouldn't have Slay or Warford.

 

[broncosmitty]

Management is prolly cool wit it Smitty.

Im sure they are.

 

[TrustMeIamRight]

NOPE. He was the #2 WR on his team as a frosh and Soph. DeAndre Hopkins was Clemson's #1 WR both years until being drafted by Houston in 2013. Martavis Bryant couldn't get a sniff of much playing time in Hopkins last year at Clemson in 2012

You can say nope all you'd like. Watkins led the team in receptions, yards and TD as a freshman and was named 1st team all-american -- not 1st team all-freshman, but 1st team all-american.

The reason he fell behind his sophomore year and Hopkins became the team's top WR is that Watkins was caught with marijuana and adderall. He wasn't allowed to workout with the team and was suspended the 1st 2 games his sophomore year.

 

[tpaulus_2]

If Mayhew thinks there's only 5 elite prospects in this draft and Sammy is one of them then Mayhew will probably pull the trade. I don't agree with a wr as a 1st rd pick but Watkins could be special. I'd rather see Donald or Clinton-Dix.

I'm all about Donald, but Clinton-Dix just doesn't have that top-10 moxy, imo. If we were drafting somewhere between 13-17 or so I'd be fine with him, I just hope we don't reach for him at #10 is all...