Lions stigma: suck down the stretch

[Old Lion]

Everyone forget that penalties and turnovers are a huge part of the game. Cant just look at offense and defense and ST.

 

[Thruthefog]

Teams have been known to overcome penalties and win it all. Don't know of any that could overcome turnovers.

 

[gandydancer]

I agree that the turnovers suck. Need to be fixed. I will wait til the starters are playing full games to judge some things. Sure not all will change, but should get better with starters if culture has changed.

 

[gvsulaker82]

It really all hinges on stafford. If hes the stafford Im expecting they will make the playoffs. If its smittys version they will be 6-10.

 

[LPinSLC]

It really all hinges on stafford. If hes the stafford Im expecting they will make the playoffs. If its smittys version they will be 6-10.

If it's Smitty's version they'll go 0-16.... Again.

 

[gandydancer]

Laker had all the numbers there. He may be lysdexic like me.

 

[LPinSLC]

Laker had all the numbers there. He may be lysdexic like me.

If life gives you melons, you might be dyslexic.

 

[FamineGod]

I know many seem to be of the belief, the new coaching staff is going to change the culture of the team. what are the thoughts of those who believe this, when the Lions biggest struggles, penalties and turnovers, are the same issues they have had in their preseason games to this point?

I REALLY hope they are able to turn it around, as they have the talent to be a playoff team, IMO. I just want to scream when I see 26 penalties in the last two games and all the fumbles they have had.

As I have not watched any of the games... How many of the penalties/turnovers have been committed by guys who won't really see the field at all after tomorrow?

Concerning penalties, this preseason they are up all across the league, thanks to the crack down on the passing game penalties.

Further, Seattle was the most penalized team last year. They fared pretty well. The year prior, Baltimore was the 2nd most penalized team. They, also, fared pretty well.

I'm not saying this team doesn't have a discipine issue...they do. It likely won't be righted immediately, either. I'm not ready to just heap the ills of the previous regime on this one. They've got work to do but should have the opportunity to right that ship.

 

[FamineGod]

No. What good things have they done? I've watched Sparty own MI and win the Big Ten under RR/Hoke while the Lions have a mere eight starters who were originally drafted by the team (7 drafted by Mayhew).

That's only one more than the league-worst Jaguars, Buccaneers and Bears (seven apiece), and none of those teams have had the same GM for as long as the Lions have had Mayhew, making it even worse.

Yes, MSU owned the state under RichRod...there's no denying. Under Hoke, the teams have held serve at home. And, guess what...? Michigan State actually made the right coaching hire. The days of "Little Brother" are long gone (despite what Denard continues to want to say). Sparty's not going anywhere. Generally holding serve at home with some 2-3 game winning streaks sprinkled in, I think, will be the norm going forward for both teams, I believe.

What good has Hoke done? He's brought the program back together after it was splintered during the RichRod years. I think Nussmeier was a good hire (though what happens on the field is how it will be judged). Recruiting is back to where it should be...5 star guys are continually talking about Michigan again and committing. This year, I agree, he needs to right the ship and have a 9-10 win season. They need to win the B1G next year, if not this year. So, I'm not a "Hoke is on the hot seat" guy, yet.

As for Mayhew... He must do more than just draft players. This article does a decent job detailing how he transformed an 0-16 roster (I don't think we fully grasp how awful a team must be to go 0-16).

Again, I think Schwartz was the right guy to hire out of the 0-16 season. And, Mayhew got rid of him at the correct time, too. The scouting department has been overhauled by Mayhew, hiring Brian Xanders to oversee that. Xanders was interviewed for a couple open GM positions this past offseason.

Mayhew hasn't been perfect. He has had a stiff hill to climb. I do fault him for things. But to give him an F? I see no reason to do that...at all.

 

[Old Lion]

For how many penalties the refs will be calling this year, there is no chance of the most penalized team is going anywhere. In years past, the penalties did not add up to that much even for the heaviest penalized teams. Now that the flags will fly on every other play, it will make a big difference. The least penalized teams will probably have as many penalties this year as the most penalized teams in the last couple years.


That's how bad it will be. The NFL will become practically unwatchable.

 

[FamineGod]

I think everyone will adjust. Things will normalize. Everyone in the NFL seem to agree on this. There seem to be a lot of chicken little fans this offseason.

 

[gandydancer]

Again, I think Schwartz was the right guy to hire out of the 0-16 season. And, Mayhew got rid of him at the correct time, too. The scouting department has been overhauled by Mayhew, hiring Brian Xanders to oversee that. Xanders was interviewed for a couple open GM positions this past offseason.
.

I was no fan of Mayhew being hired after assisting and being on Millen's staff.

I sure as hell will take Xanders to run the show though.

 

[FamineGod]

I was no fan of Mayhew being hired after assisting and being on Millen's staff.

I sure as hell will take Xanders to run the show though.

I was also of the belief that they should have just wiped the slate clean. Just the principle.

That said, people closer to the situation made it sound like Mayhew tended to be more of the voice of reason...that he was instrumental in getting everyone to prepare well for the draft, doing their due diligence and setting up the draft board. When it came time to actually execute the draft...Millen would ignore all of the scouting and just do his own thing.

I dunno.

 

[RobBase]

imo the job is to win the NFC North. They never have so I give Mayhew an F. I don't think they win it this year either.

Famin - do you think Mayhew and LewAAnd get fired if no playoffs this year? In other words, do you buy the "playoffs or bust" war cry this year?

And if not, what does Mayhew have to do to get fired? How many years will Caldwell get to make the post season?

My prediction: (I hope) Ford Jr. cleans house next year after another 5 or 6 win season where we miss the playoffs.

 

[FamineGod]

I think the only way Mayhew gets fired after this year is if the year is a complete disaster...something like 3 or 4 wins. Otherwise, you get into a cycle where you hire a new GM who didn't hire Caldwell...so Caldwell ends up getting replaced. You lose about 3 or 4 years...not advantageous unless the team completely falls apart this year.

I don't understand the A+ or F grading scale...things are never black or white. There are a lot of variables to take into consideration. If 90% of GMs get an F then there is no grading scale.

When it comes to the Lions, basically everyone agrees that there is talent on paper. The talent hasn't translated itself to consistent wins on the field. Who's fault is that? Is it Mayhew's direct fault that this team has been terrible down the stretch these past 2 or 3 years? No, he certainly plays a role in it...but how much? Will hiring a new GM automatically fix that? Is it the type of player that Mayhew brings in that is causing it? Maybe...maybe not. Is it the coaching staff's fault? Is it just the players' fault?

 

[RobBase]

When it comes to the Lions, basically everyone agrees that there is talent on paper.

I think that's a lie made up by Mayhew and LewAAnd to save their jobs. Maybe some journalists have said that, but no one in the NFL seems to believe it. We had the private jet all warmed up for Wisenhunt and he left them and all their "talent" hanging.

Stafford, Calvin, Suh, Fairely. That's the real talent on this team, and 2 of them are on their way out of town. The rest are good to piss poor. No one else on the team is great.

How can anyone look at Mayhew's record and not give him an F? He's worst in the league. If that isn't failure, not sure what is.

 

[Thruthefog]

I think everyone will adjust. Things will normalize. Everyone in the NFL seem to agree on this. There seem to be a lot of chicken little fans this offseason.

This is the Lions board. The sky is in a constant state of falling.

 

[FamineGod]

I think that's a lie made up by Mayhew and LewAAnd to save their jobs. Maybe some journalists have said that, but no one in the NFL seems to believe it. We had the private jet all warmed up for Wisenhunt and he left them and all their "talent" hanging.

Journalists around the NFL have said that. Former players have said that. Living in western IL, I listen to Chicago sports radio...their NFL and on-air guys talk about the Lions having talent who are undisciplined. So, either Mayhew/Lewand have been successfully using a Jedi mind trick, or it is true.

Stafford, Calvin, Suh, Fairely. That's the real talent on this team, and 2 of them are on their way out of town. The rest are good to piss poor. No one else on the team is great.

The OL is talented. Warford is likely a future All-Pro. Tulloch is talented. Glover Quin is talented. Golden Tate is talented. Reggie Bush and Joique Bell are talented.

How can anyone look at Mayhew's record and not give him an F? He's worst in the league. If that isn't failure, not sure what is.

Worst in the league? Hyperbole much?

 

[RobBase]

Remember the 90's, when the Lions made the post season 6 out of 10 years?

Good times.

 

[TrustMeIamRight]

As I have not watched any of the games... How many of the penalties/turnovers have been committed by guys who won't really see the field at all after tomorrow?

Concerning penalties, this preseason they are up all across the league, thanks to the crack down on the passing game penalties.

Further, Seattle was the most penalized team last year. They fared pretty WELL. The year prior, Baltimore was the 2nd most penalized team. They, also, fared pretty well.

I'm not saying this team doesn't have a discipine issue...they do. It likely won't be righted immediately, either. I'm not ready to just heap the ills of the previous regime on this one. They've got work to do but should have the opportunity to right that ship.

I agree -- the best teams in the NFL can get away with penalties and still win games. While Detroit has talent, they are not going to be confused as one of the best teams in the NFL right now. To be successful, IMO, Detroit has to limit the penalties, ESPECIALLY the unnecessary 15 yarders they get at the end of plays quite often.

As far as the preseason penalties and turnovers -- it has been a mix of the regulars (Detroit starters had 10 penalties in a little over 2 quarters in the last game) and the backups. I think the same can be said about the turnovers too. Stafford has looked good sans the one pass against Jax. The RB's are still having a case of the drops and fumbles.

For Detroit to make the playoffs this year -- they have to find a way to limit the drops. To put it in perspective -- Detroit had, I believe 46 drops last year with Bush having 9 drops. Green Bay's entire team had 9 drops total. That is unacceptable. Detroit had 10 more drops than the next closest team. So if they cut that down -- they should improve by a game or two.

Our RB tandem was one of the most productive in the NFL last year both rushing and receiving. The bad part was -- they led the league in lost fumbles and drops. This should be an easy fix and if they cut these two down -- the team should improve by another game or two.

Detroit has the talent to be a playoff team, but as Trent Dilfer said last year -- Detroit has a very good team, but they continue to keep throwing up all over themselves. If the Lions get out of their own way -- we should be able to be competitive with any team in the NFL and should beat most of them.