How long does Philly stick with Wentz before going back to Foles?

[Roy Munson]

How many picks did Wentz throw in that game? You can’t point out one play and say “that’s it!! That’s why the team lost.” If Wentz is so good why does it come down to that one play.

its a game of inches.

But when the team is making a drive at the end and a TD ball hits a WR in the hands, its a direct cause of the loss.

Sure, you could change a million other things, but at that moment the game was win or lose and the WR dropped the pass delivered between his hands. Maybe he was surprised because all the other passes were shitty and he had to dive for them, we'll never know.

 

[Roy Munson]

No one will never know. Wentz doesn't play after December.

Its ok, we didn't need him to beat the Pats...

 

[dbldwn711]

Wow there, cowboy, I am not going bull in a china shop on every argument and poster in this thread. This thread has morphed and taken different meaning for different posters.

But I am going to go directly after people who are unequivocally anti-Wentz. That doesn't mean Wentz-uncritical.

The ribbing I don't care about- ribbing Wentz was funny when it was ironic and people had no chill with the Wentz praise. Almost MVP!

Admit it... You don’t like this thread because if this were a discussion about TOP this thread with own it!!

 

[Roy Munson]

Hahaha

You know I’m a BIG @Roy Munson fan so let me offer you this friendly bit of advice:

When you take a position and @There is A Moose at 3rd comes along and agrees with you it’s probably time to re-evaluate that position.

I guess I should have listed more things he's wrong about...

 

[NWPATSFAN]

Its ok, we didn't need him to beat the Pats...

Glad you're here to remind us. No one else remembers nor cares.

Enjoy that one lonely trophy.

 

[Fountain City Blues]

Admit it... You don’t like this thread because if this were a discussion about TOP this thread with own it!!

TOP may need to be my new arch enemy, after #AllPlayersMatter

 

[Roy Munson]

TOP may need to be my new arch enemy, after #AllPlayersMatter

But it all circles back to RBs... because the more RBs are used, the more TOP a team probably has.

 

[dbldwn711]

are we talking healthy wentz or coming back too early from injury wentz?

Because healthy Wentz beats the Pats by 40 in the Super Bowl...

I won’t deny that the Eagles were the best team that year. No doubt. They were so good that their back up QB lead them thru the playoffs and SB.

 

[Roy Munson]

I won’t deny that the Eagles were the best team that year. No doubt. They were so good that their back up QB lead them thru the playoffs and SB.

That year the D was lights out and the OL was disgustingly good. It also helped that the team usually put up points in the first quarter and made most opponents one dimensional in the 2nd half.

 

[dbldwn711]

Let me offer this:

Recently, @PhoenixEagles1 has characterized Wentz as ONLY being “excellent”. This is clearly a downshift from “phenomenal” or “a generational talent.” It only took 500 pages for us to make that progress towards reality. This shows we are making progress and for that reason alone this thread should continue.

 

[_phiLLies_]

Wow there, cowboy, I am not going bull in a china shop on every argument and poster in this thread. This thread has morphed and taken different meaning for different posters.

But I am going to go directly after people who are unequivocally anti-Wentz. That doesn't mean Wentz-uncritical.

The ribbing I don't care about- ribbing Wentz was funny when it was ironic and people had no chill with the Wentz praise. Almost MVP!

i loved drafting wentz. i preferred him over goff. i backed the shit out of him when people were dogging his mechanics during his rookie year. i easily backed him after foles won the superbowl (despite the fact i've always been a big foles fan as well.)

but i'm not a homer, and i'm not stupid. he was a wreckless runner and a serious injury was eventually going to happen. and when it did, he was going to become a straight up pocket passer.. which was sketchy. after watching him last season (nothing to do with injuries) it was clear he is NOT going to be a great QB in this league as a pocket passer. he simply does not have the tools to succeed in that fashion alone.

so all the wentz nut huggers talk about 2017. great. he was able to run wild then. that will never happen again. he doesn't have the accuracy, consistency and willingness to repeatedly make tough throws. fans will just keep blaming everyone else. because.. blaming a whole offense makes more sense than blaming one guy controlling it.

 

[dbldwn711]

That year the D was lights out and the OL was disgustingly good. It also helped that the team usually put up points in the first quarter and made most opponents one dimensional in the 2nd half.

It also had intangible factors. It had certain players that knew how to win and were driven to do so. Long and Blount jump to mind but I’m sure there were others. Nothing was gonna stop that team, that year.

 

[Roy Munson]

Let me offer this:

Recently, @PhoenixEagles1 has characterized Wentz as ONLY being “excellent”. This is clearly a downshift from “phenomenal” or “a generational talent.” It only took 500 pages for us to make that progress towards reality. This shows we are making progress and for that reason alone this thread should continue.

can we still use AMVP?

 

[dbldwn711]

i loved drafting wentz. i preferred him over goff. i backed the shit out of him when people were dogging his mechanics during his rookie year. i easily backed him after foles won the superbowl (despite the fact i've always been a big foles fan as well.)

but i'm not a homer, and i'm not stupid. he was a wreckless runner and a serious injury was eventually going to happen. and when it did, he was going to become a straight up pocket passer.. which was sketchy. after watching him last season (nothing to do with injuries) it was clear he is NOT going to be a great QB in this league as a pocket passer. he simply does not have the tools to succeed in that fashion alone.

so all the wentz nut huggers talk about 2017. great. he was able to run wild then. that will never happen again. he doesn't have the accuracy, consistency and willingness to repeatedly make tough throws. fans will just keep blaming everyone else. because.. blaming a whole offense makes more sense than blaming one guy controlling it.

Careful, the point about him having to transition to being a pocket passer and him not having that skill set got me put on ignore by several posters and had PE1 talking to his therapist about me.

 

[dbldwn711]

can we still use AMVP?

If we can’t just ban me now!

 

[jarntt]

so do you deny we're 5-2 if WRs do their job and catch balls delivered that hit them between 2 hands?

Or 4-3 if Wentz hits Agholar in stride on the long pass completion that got them into the red zone in the Atl game instead of making him wait for it...

 

[Fountain City Blues]

Careful, the point about him having to transition to being a pocket passer and him not having that skill set got me put on ignore by several posters and had PE1 talking to his therapist about me.

There are certainly some things Wentz needs to clean up and I think Eagles fans probably know those things better than I do, so I am not going to be pretentious about it. He's hardly a bum, but I think he's due some positive regression from his current 6.9 YPA to something more in line with the previous two years at 7.5-7.7.

If there's a problem with Wentz, holistically speaking, it's that he's good rather than elite as a QB and passer; and the Eagles just aren't a very good team around him. At the very least, it's a very flawed team around Wentz. That Falcons game is more baffling by the day to me. It's a humble pie for some of the Eagles fans trashing Dak nonstop while he now all of the sudden is putting up MVP-like efficiency numbers.

I'd need to check, but I don't think Wentz has a single qualifying WR ranked above 32 this year in PFF's system, and that one WR just outside of that is Jeffrey. Similar story if you look at DVOA. That's tough to survive when your secondary is also pretty bad and can flat tank you in any given game unless the QB plays at an MVP level.

 

[dbldwn711]

There are certainly some things Wentz needs to clean up and I think Eagles fans probably know those things better than I do, so I am not going to be pretentious about it. He's hardly a bum, but I think he's due some positive regression from his current 6.9 YPA to something more in line with the previous two years at 7.5-7.7.

If there's a problem with Wentz, holistically speaking, it's that he's good rather than elite as a QB and passer; and the Eagles just aren't a very good team around him. At the very least, it's a very flawed team around Wentz. That Falcons game is more baffling by the day to me. It's a humble pie for some of the Eagles fans trashing Dak nonstop while he now all of the sudden is putting up MVP-like efficiency numbers.

I'd need to check, but I don't think Wentz has a single qualifying WR ranked above 32 this year in PFF's system, and that one WR just outside of that is Jeffrey. Similar story if you look at DVOA. That's tough to survive when your secondary is also pretty bad and can flat tank you in any given game unless the QB plays at an MVP level.

I heard some stat that Wentz is like 9-15 on the road. If that’s accurate it’s atrocious.

 

[jarntt]

There are certainly some things Wentz needs to clean up and I think Eagles fans probably know those things better than I do, so I am not going to be pretentious about it. He's hardly a bum, but I think he's due some positive regression from his current 6.9 YPA to something more in line with the previous two years at 7.5-7.7.

If there's a problem with Wentz, holistically speaking, it's that he's good rather than elite as a QB and passer; and the Eagles just aren't a very good team around him. At the very least, it's a very flawed team around Wentz. That Falcons game is more baffling by the day to me. It's a humble pie for some of the Eagles fans trashing Dak nonstop while he now all of the sudden is putting up MVP-like efficiency numbers.

I'd need to check, but I don't think Wentz has a single qualifying WR ranked above 32 this year in PFF's system, and that one WR just outside of that is Jeffrey. Similar story if you look at DVOA. That's tough to survive when your secondary is also pretty bad and can flat tank you in any given game unless the QB plays at an MVP level.

But Dak is incapable of putting up MVP type numbers. He doesn't have the arm strength. I've read that somewhere like 500 times.

 

[Fountain City Blues]

I heard some stat that Wentz is like 9-15 on the road. If that’s accurate it’s atrocious.

Would want to check a little deeper, but yeah, that's not very impressive at all for a QB of Wentz' caliber good, elite, or whatever.