Eli Manning, the HOF, and my long standing Jim Plunkett comparisom

[DirtDirtDirt]

he played a playoff game here, bone on bone in his knee. played his heart out.

LT pouted under a poncho on the sideline.

always respected that.

It was Tom Brady's worst ever postseason game, 3 picks

And Rivers still lost that game

 

[DirtDirtDirt]

To be honest I really don't want Eli in a big game either.

He's proven that to be a dumbass statement twice more than most QBs in this league

 

[NWPATSFAN]

Again, I don't think Eli, Plunkett or Namath should be in the HOF. But if you want me to point out why Namath's career was much more impressive than Plunkett's I'm here for you. It really isn't all that close.

What do Eli and Namath have in common

 

[Rock Strongo]

Wrong, I'm not gonna retype it for you, go look at the postseason game logs in 07 and 11

He was better than Brady in Both postseason runs, not just the SBs

The Giants defense ranked middle of the pack in both years, people that always talk about the greatness of that defense is the only way from admitting Brady sucked

dirt

playoffs

playoffs

both times the giants got healthy on D literally as the playoffs started. regular season stats didnt mean a thing.

eli has an 87.4 playoff rating. rivers is 85.2 FWIW.

over elis career, the giants gave up (on D) the following:

23 (lost)
23 (lost)

now the winning starts:

14
17
20
14* you know this one
23 (lost)
2
20
17
17

38 his last go

remove that 23 point loss in the middle (bad team) the D gave up 15.1 PPG in that stretch.

thats really, really good dirt.

 

[PhillyGreen]

He's proven that to be a dumbass statement twice more than most QBs in this league

He got really lucky as well. In 2007 the helmet catch was one of the luckiest things I have ever seen. That had nothing to do with ability.

Look...I am not saying that Eli is not a good QB because he is he is not HOF material IMO. Hell in 2007 he rode the defense and luck to that championship. He was average at best in the playoff and the Superbow. However I will admit that in 2011 he played well in all the playoffs games (including the SB) and deserve credit for that. That does not make him an HOF QB.....I mean Nick Foles put up far superior numbers. Riding a stretch of games does not make you great.

 

[DirtDirtDirt]

He got really lucky as well. In 2007 the helmet catch was one of the luckiest things I have ever seen. That had nothing to do with ability.

Look...I am not saying that Eli is not a good QB because he is he is not HOF material IMO. Hell in 2007 he rode the defense and luck to that championship. He was average at best in the playoff and the Superbow. However I will admit that in 2011 he played well in all the playoffs games (including the SB) and deserve credit for that. That does not make him an HOF QB.....I mean Nick Foles put up far superior numbers. Riding a stretch of games does not make you great.

I can't get into luck and defense

It's a double standard that only applies to Eli

You want me to detail what defenses and Luck has done for a guy you all call the greatest QB ever?

 

[PhillyGreen]

I can't get into luck and defense

It's a double standard that only applies to Eli

You want me to detail what defenses and Luck has done for a guy you all call the greatest QB ever?

Are you talking Brady? I don't consider him the GOAT so I am not sure what you are getting at. Joe Montana still tops my list.

I am talking ability and performance. You can't throw SB performances out there and ignore the performance of the QB and then turn around and ignore the luck factor that obviously comes into play.

 

[DirtDirtDirt]

Are you talking Brady? I don't consider him the GOAT so I am not sure what you are getting at. Joe Montana still tops my list.

My point is defense and luck applies to most SB winning QBs

If Matt Ryan wasn't a complete choker, nick Foles is knocked out in round one last season

It wasn't him that prevented the Falcons from scoring from the 3 yard line

 

[Rock Strongo]

It was Tom Brady's worst ever postseason game, 3 picks

And Rivers still lost that game

it was his first playoff start. remove that 55 rating from that day, and his rating in the postseason is better than elis, FYI.

 

[DirtDirtDirt]

it was his first playoff start. remove that 55 rating from that day, and his rating in the postseason is better than elis, FYI.

He chokes in every big game he plays

 

[Wazmankg]

i'm talking about these metrics:



career passing yards - plunkett 25,882. namath 27,663

TD's/INT's
namath 173/220
plunkett 164/198

rating?

namath 65.5
plunkett 67.5

Namath lead the league in -

Yards - 3 times
Yards per Game - 3 times
Yards per catch - 3 times
Yards per Attempt - 2 times

Plunkett lead the league in -

nothing


Plunkett played his first 7 season prior to the '78 rule changes to help the passing game and his best passer rating during that time was 68.6

Namath played his entire career prior to the 78 rule changes to help the passing game and he had a passer rating better than 68.6 .. 7 times.

Namath was a 1st team all pro once.
Plunkett - nothing

Namath made 4 pro bowls
Plunkett - nothing.


This is actually a worse example than the Manning one, because the fact they played under the same rules for a number of years provides more of an apples to apples comparison.

 

[Rock Strongo]

He chokes in every big game he plays

5 of rivers 9 playoff starts he has a 92 or better rating, 3 well over 110.0

i know the angle youre going for, but i dont see it the same way. of those 9 games, his defenses gave up 23+ ppg 4 times. he won one of those.

 

[Rock Strongo]

Namath lead the league in -

Yards - 3 times
Yards per Game - 3 times
Yards per catch - 3 times
Yards per Attempt - 2 times

Plunkett lead the league in -

nothing


Plunkett played his first 7 season prior to the '78 rule changes to help the passing game and his best passer rating during that time was 68.6

Namath played his entire career prior to the 78 rule changes to help the passing game and he had a passer rating better than 68.6 .. 8 times.

Namath was a 1st team all pro once.
Plunkett - nothing

Namath made 4 pro bowls
Plunkett - nothing.


This is actually a worse example than the Manning one, because the fact they played under the same rules for a number of years provides more of an apples to apples comparison.

yards
TD/INT ratio
rating
rings

all i need.

 

[Wazmankg]

yards
TD/INT ratio
rating
rings

all i need.

Apparently you also need to mix pre-rule change stats with post rule change stats and pretend it doesn't matter. Because that's what you did with those.

 

[DirtDirtDirt]

5 of rivers 9 playoff starts he has a 92 or better rating, 3 well over 110.0

i know the angle youre going for, but i dont see it the same way. of those 9 games, his defenses gave up 23+ ppg 4 times. he won one of those.

so the guy that can't beat New England, he's a big game player

The guy New England can't beat, a 2 time SB MVP, he's the
Shitty one

Got it

 

[Pure Steel]

It was Tom Brady's worst ever postseason game, 3 picks

And Rivers still lost that game

Brady put up a 57.6 QBR.....Rivers put up a 55.5.....

 

[DirtDirtDirt]

Brady put up a 57.6 QBR.....Rivers put up a 55.5.....

Rivers must be on Rocks fantasy team

 

[Rock Strongo]

Apparently you also need to mix pre-rule change stats with post rule change stats and pretend it doesn't matter. Because that's what you did with those 4.

plunkett was out of football in 78. he also started 8 games per year on avg after 79. namath DID lead the NFL in picks 4 times, something plunkett never did.

food for thought:

plunkett before the rule changes:

49.3% comp, 60.4 rating

namaths career

50.2%, 65.5 rating

 

[Rock Strongo]

so the guy that can't beat New England, he's a big game player

The guy New England can't beat, a 2 time SB MVP, he's the
Shitty one

Got it

im just pointing out the numbers.

rivers defenses failed him wheres elis lifted him.

 

[Pure Steel]

Rivers must be on Rocks fantasy team

Rivers must cry when he hears someone say 2006.....That team was loaded and should have gone further, if not win the whole thing....

 

[Rock Strongo]

Rivers must cry when he hears someone say 2006.....That team was loaded and should have gone further, if not win the whole thing....

it was also his first playoff start.