Current Roster

[MarcoPolo]

I am always amazed by people who unthinkingly say "not our money". Why do you think that good seats cost more than $50 now? That beers cost over $9 and dogs over $6? it's because our money pays for them (and the players, duh).

 

[Mays-Fan]

Worth every penny, no loss of prospects, not our money, time for our guys to step it up to the LA $$$ challenge.

Two years ago, we paid 3/18, 6 mill/yr for Scutaro, who was 10 years older at the time.

Castillo has a MUCH higher ceiling, and he also plays OF, esp CF. I would find it easy to believe we could go $10 mill/yr - 6/60. If he worked out, we could rethink the Panda re-signing, although I'd rather keep him (hey, it's not MY money).

 

[Mays-Fan]

I am always amazed by people who unthinkingly say "not our money". Why do you think that good seats cost more than $50 now? That beers cost over $9 and dogs over $6? it's because our money pays for them (and the players, duh).

Hey, I live in North Carolina. I have never been to ATT. Been to the 'Stick once in 1983. I don't pay for any special cable packages.

I thought about, and said to myself, "You know what - it's not MY money!!!".

 

[msgkings322]

I am always amazed by people who unthinkingly say "not our money". Why do you think that good seats cost more than $50 now? That beers cost over $9 and dogs over $6? it's because our money pays for them (and the players, duh).

You don't have to pay a penny to root for the team, watch them on TV, and post about them all day long.

It's not our money.

And if ownership groups focus more on every penny spent and not on championships, you end up as the Royals or Pirates or Padres.

I'm aware there are bad contracts and overpays. 5/50 or 6/60 for a guy like this, for what our team needs, in the window we have, in the division we're in: it's a good deal

 

[calsnowskier]

I am always amazed by people who unthinkingly say "not our money". Why do you think that good seats cost more than $50 now? That beers cost over $9 and dogs over $6? it's because our money pays for them (and the players, duh).

Income and outflow are not necessarily directly linked. Seats cost $200+ and beers cost $9 because "WE" will pay those prices. If "WE" did not pay those prices, the prices would not be that high.

If you want to play kitchen-table-GM, and assume you have a budget and attempt to work within that budget, then, by all means, complain about the salaries (I do that on occasion, and it is fun). But to complain that it is our money is faulty logic.

 

[tzill]

I am always amazed by people who unthinkingly say "not our money". Why do you think that good seats cost more than $50 now? That beers cost over $9 and dogs over $6? it's because our money pays for them (and the players, duh).

For me, it's no so much the cost of going to the game (most of the $ comes from TV and radio rights anyway), but the opportunity cost of any contract. That is, every dollar we spend on one player is a dollar we can't spend elsewhere. I'd expect our 2015 payroll to be around $165MM. We are already committed to $127MM without Panda, PeaveMe, Romo, Beast, or Tron. And that $127MM doesn't count BB9, Shark, Guti, Biggie, Ishi, Stamos, and Hacktor. Obviously, not all will be brought back.

However, $12MM a year for Castillo puts us at $140MM with about $25MM to spend to fill 7 roster spots (#5 SP, 4 bullpen arms, 3B, one OF).

Doable, but not a "not my money, no brainer" decision. Panda will be about $15MM, so that's $10MM left for 6 spots, or roughly six minimum guys.

SP: Bum/Cain/Huddy/Timmah/Crick?
RP: JA/KCya/JLo/Biggie?/Kontos?/Guti?/Law?
C: MVP/Susac?
IF: BB9/Panik/Stamos/Panda?/EA/Scoots
OF: Herk/Oxy/JCP?/Castillo?/Shark?

 

[msgkings322]

For me, it's no so much the cost of going to the game (most of the $ comes from TV and radio rights anyway), but the opportunity cost of any contract. That is, every dollar we spend on one player is a dollar we can't spend elsewhere. I'd expect our 2015 payroll to be around $165MM. We are already committed to $127MM without Panda, PeaveMe, Romo, Beast, or Tron. And that $127MM doesn't count BB9, Shark, Guti, Biggie, Ishi, Stamos, and Hacktor. Obviously, not all will be brought back.

However, $12MM a year for Castillo puts us at $140MM with about $25MM to spend to fill 7 roster spots (#5 SP, 4 bullpen arms, 3B, one OF).

Doable, but not a "not my money, no brainer" decision. Panda will be about $15MM, so that's $10MM left for 6 spots, or roughly six minimum guys.

SP: Bum/Cain/Huddy/Timmah/Crick?
RP: JA/KCya/JLo/Biggie?/Kontos?/Guti?/Law?
C: MVP/Susac?
IF: BB9/Panik/Stamos/Panda?/EA/Scoots
OF: Herk/Oxy/JCP?/Castillo?/Shark?

You analysis (a good one) all starts from the top line $165M assumption. Who's to say what that number is? And maybe signing Castillo because the opportunity is there now bumps that number up some? The bottom line is the owners can spend really as much as they want. Maybe not LA Dodgers level but they can go higher if it's for the right opportunities. Castillo IMO is the right reason to spend money.

 

[tzill]

You analysis (a good one) all starts from the top line $165M assumption. Who's to say what that number is? And maybe signing Castillo because the opportunity is there now bumps that number up some? The bottom line is the owners can spend really as much as they want. Maybe not LA Dodgers level but they can go higher if it's for the right opportunities. Castillo IMO is the right reason to spend money.

I've inferred from what Larry Baer says and what the beat writers have implied. I doubt it'll be much more than that. They seem to want to grow payroll 5-10% a year.

I don't disagree with your take, btw. I'm just trying to fit it into the ownerships plan

 

[msgkings322]

I've inferred from what Larry Baer says and what the beat writers have implied. I doubt it'll be much more than that. They seem to want to grow payroll 5-10% a year.

I don't disagree with your take, btw. I'm just trying to fit it into the ownerships plan

Fair enough, and you might be right. But if they can't go to $170MM to accommodate adding Castillo considering the opportunity and the fit and the jerks in LA, then it's a mistake by management and I'm going to call them out on it.

While I don't want them to just turn on the $ spigot like they did in LA, they really could do so...the revenue bump from winning more championships will pay for it, not even getting into how much they will all make on the back end when they sell.

So passing on Castillo for money reasons isn't acceptable to me. Staying squarely at $165Mil becaose of some profit drive isn't acceptable, given an opportunity like Castillo.

 

[Mays-Fan]

You analysis (a good one) all starts from the top line $165M assumption. Who's to say what that number is? And maybe signing Castillo because the opportunity is there now bumps that number up some? The bottom line is the owners can spend really as much as they want. Maybe not LA Dodgers level but they can go higher if it's for the right opportunities. Castillo IMO is the right reason to spend money.

One also has to work into the equation that Timmy ($18mm) and Huddy ($12mm) both roll off the books at the end of 2015. Perhaps a Castillo contract could be structured with that in mind, so as not to cost so much in 2015.

Also, if we signed Castillo and make a deep playoff run, revenues will jump considerably.

The 900-lb gorilla is the bolded. Who really knows?

 

[calsnowskier]

Fair enough, and you might be right. But if they can't go to $170MM to accommodate adding Castillo considering the opportunity and the fit and the jerks in LA, then it's a mistake by management and I'm going to call them out on it.

While I don't want them to just turn on the $ spigot like they did in LA, they really could do so...the revenue bump from winning more championships will pay for it, not even getting into how much they will all make on the back end when they sell.

So passing on Castillo for money reasons isn't acceptable to me. Staying squarely at $165Mil becaose of some profit drive isn't acceptable, given an opportunity like Castillo.

We have always talked about this, but never numerated it. Any idea what exactly that means? Are we talking an additional 10M in the team coffers? 15M? 3M?

I am talking only money DIRECTLY added due to the playoffs and/or World Series. General improvement to the brand is hard to account for since the Giants are so saturated right now due to '10 and '12.

 

[tzill]

Fair enough, and you might be right. But if they can't go to $170MM to accommodate adding Castillo considering the opportunity and the fit and the jerks in LA, then it's a mistake by management and I'm going to call them out on it.

While I don't want them to just turn on the $ spigot like they did in LA, they really could do so...the revenue bump from winning more championships will pay for it, not even getting into how much they will all make on the back end when they sell.

So passing on Castillo for money reasons isn't acceptable to me. Staying squarely at $165Mil becaose of some profit drive isn't acceptable, given an opportunity like Castillo.

Too many unknowns for me to speculate. What I do know is that we are currently #7 in MLB, only 8.5MM behind #4 (Red Sox). They spend money. There's a goofball blogger named Richard Dwyer who constantly rants that the ownership is cheap. They are clearly not and are entitled to set a budget as they see fit. Not saying you're Dwyer (unless you ARE!), but we can't know how much SabeySabes values Castillo. At some point he's too expensive. Maybe that point is more than what we will sign him for.

 

[msgkings322]

Too many unknowns for me to speculate. What I do know is that we are currently #7 in MLB, only 8.5MM behind #4 (Red Sox). They spend money. There's a goofball blogger named Richard Dwyer who constantly rants that the ownership is cheap. They are clearly not and are entitled to set a budget as they see fit. Not saying you're Dwyer (unless you ARE!), but we can't know how much SabeySabes values Castillo. At some point he's too expensive. Maybe that point is more than what we will sign him for.

100% agree with this. I don't think they are cheap, I just think they have flexibility if they see an opportunity. IMO Castillo is that, but as always Sabean knows more about it than I do. I trust he'll make the right call. If he passes solely because the owners tell him they don't want to pay a few extra $, I'm not happy with ownership (not that we'd ever truly know if that's why they pass...)

MaysFan brings up a good point, it's only in 2015 we have so much committed, some salary drops off in 2016 and beyond.

If you don't have an unlimited budget, you have to take a chance once in a while. Right now Cuba is where teams have been rolling the dice (White Sox, As, even the Dodgers with no constraints). I think it's a mistake to not take our shot.

 

[tzill]

100% agree with this. I don't think they are cheap, I just think they have flexibility if they see an opportunity. IMO Castillo is that, but as always Sabean knows more about it than I do. I trust he'll make the right call. If he passes solely because the owners tell him they don't want to pay a few extra $, I'm not happy with ownership (not that we'd ever truly know if that's why they pass...)

MaysFan brings up a good point, it's only in 2015 we have so much committed, some salary drops off in 2016 and beyond.

If you don't have an unlimited budget, you have to take a chance once in a while. Right now Cuba is where teams have been rolling the dice (White Sox, As, even the Dodgers with no constraints). I think it's a mistake to not take our shot.

I tend to agree, but I don't know that much about Castillo. Also, we have a Cuban tearing it up in the minors -- Carbonell -- who was just promoted to San Jose.

 

[calsnowskier]

From yesterday...

Duvall sent down
Kontos called up
Lincecum sent to bully
Petit added to rotation

 

[calsnowskier]

EA and Hacktor moved to the 60-Day
Dominguez and GQ added to the 40-Man
Dominguez, GQ, JCP, Kickham and Strckland called up.

2 more cuppo's on the season, joining Panik, Duffy, Susac, Duvall (and kinda Escobar and Parker). That's 8 legit cuppo's from a crap-ass system. Hmmmm. There is a message in there somewhere...

 

[SFGRTB]

EA and Hacktor moved to the 60-Day
Dominguez and GQ added to the 40-Man
Dominguez, GQ, JCP, Kickham and Strckland called up.

2 more cuppo's on the season, joining Panik, Duffy, Susac, Duvall (and kinda Escobar and Parker). That's 8 legit cuppo's from a crap-ass system. Hmmmm. There is a message in there somewhere...

Boch said there will be another "big" round of callups after this one.

A few are clear: Duvall, Brown, Cordier, Parker. Maybe we'll see Villalona and Carbonall.

Non-roster guys that have a chance? Baby Bochy? Steve Okert? He would be my choice, and would have the inside track at a bullpen spot next year, with Strickland.

 

[tzill]

Boch said there will be another "big" round of callups after this one.

A few are clear: Duvall, Brown, Cordier, Parker. Maybe we'll see Villalona and Carbonall.

Non-roster guys that have a chance? Baby Bochy? Steve Okert? He would be my choice, and would have the inside track at a bullpen spot next year, with Strickland.

Agreed on these three as they're on the roster. Parker is possible. Scoots and Cain go to 60 day and there are your other two 40-man spots.

 

[tzill]

I'd guess Parker and Heston.

 

[SFGRTB]

Agreed on these three as they're on the roster. Parker is possible. Scoots and Cain go to 60 day and there are your other two 40-man spots.

Parker is also on the 40 man, and was in the bigs for a day. He'll probably come up unless he's sent down to reinforce the Flying Squirrels in the playoffs.

I've heard Heston's name mentioned. They'll have 2 spots to play with so we'll see who they are interested in.