Cain trade twitter rumor

[mistgl]

Don't give any credibility to this, because I haven't seen it anywhere, but a guy on twitter who supposedly works for the Blue Jays says...

To Toronto:

Cain and Hembree

To SF:

Drabek, Jenkins, Snider, Jimenez, Lind

This is about as laughable of a fake trade rumor that I've ever seen. We trade our best minor league arm, and our second best pitcher for a failure and some 700ops scraps, and not a top 10 prospect to boot.

For what it's worth, this same nut job claimed King Felix to the Jays a week or two ago.

His twitter handle is @tmfb82

 

[filosofy29]

Don't give any credibility to this, because I haven't seen it anywhere, but a guy on twitter who supposedly works for the Blue Jays says...

To Toronto:

Cain and Hembree

To SF:

Drabek, Jenkins, Snider, Jimenez, Lind

This is about as laughable of a fake trade rumor that I've ever seen. We trade our best minor league arm, and our second best pitcher for a failure and some 700ops scraps, and not a top 10 prospect to boot.

For what it's worth, this same nut job claimed King Felix to the Jays a week or two ago.

His twitter handle is @tmfb82

TooMuchFuckingBullshit82???

 

[mistgl]

TooMuchFuckingBullshit82???

I was thinking TooMuchFuckingBlow82, but that works too!

 

[tzill]

In order to make this trade fair, they'd need to give us:

Bautista + Norris + Sanchez OR
Escobar + Norris + Nicolino

Something like that, and I'm not sure I'd make the deal. But the convo would start there. The problem with the Jays system is that it's fairly heavy with catching prospects, which doesn't make them a very good trading partner for the Gs.

 

[SFGRTB]

When there are rumors out there saying the Yankees would give one of the Killer B's and Montero or Nunez for Cain, this is ridiculous.

Plus, there is a reason the Jays aren't happy with Drabek anymore, he's not who they thought he was going to be.

 

[mistgl]

In order to make this trade fair, they'd need to give us:

Bautista + Norris + Sanchez OR
Escobar + Norris + Nicolino

Something like that, and I'm not sure I'd make the deal. But the convo would start there. The problem with the Jays system is that it's fairly heavy with catching prospects, which doesn't make them a very good trading partner for the Gs.

They're deep at pitching too.

1) Travis D'Arnaud, C, Grade B+: Borderline A-: He would be an A- or maybe even an A if he was more effective at throwing out runners and struck out less often, but he can really hit and is still a superior prospect even with those weaknesses.

2) Nestor Molina, RHP, Grade B+: Ranking the Blue Jays pitching prospects is quite difficult. Although Molina hasn't received as much press as some of the other guys, his performance was impeccable, I think his stuff is underrated, and he'll get to the majors sooner than the others. Despite his season, he is still underrated by a lot of people.

3) Jake Marisnick, OF, Grade B+: Speed, defense, and a greatly improved bat. More power development would get him into the A-range.

4) Noah Syndergaard, RHP, Grade B+: I'm a believer in his stats, his size, his command, and his fastball, and I think the secondary stuff will come around. Can easily be in the A-range next year.

5) Justin Nicolino, LHP, Grade B+: I think Syndergaard's ultimate ceiling is a bit higher, but Nicolino isn't far behind, and is more polished with his secondary pitches. Could also be in the A-range next year.

6) Daniel Norris, LHP, Grade B+: Higher physical ceiling than Nicolino, but I want to see him in pro ball before ranking him ahead.

7) Deck McGuire, RHP, Grade B+ Doesn't have the ceiling of the younger guys, but should be a solid inning-eater at worst and won't need much longer in the minors.

8) Drew Hutchison, RHP, Grade B+. You can't argue with his results even if he doesn't have as much physical upside as the guys ahead. Like McGuire, an efficiency expert who should chew through innings.

9) Anthony Gose, OF, Grade B: Other people will probably rank him higher due to his tools. He's made a lot of progress, but his hitting approach remains quite raw and the strikeout rate still bothers me. Made big strides refining his defense and baserunning. Grade A tools, Grade C+ skills, makes him a strong Grade B overall.

10) A.J. Jimenez, C, Grade B-: Superior defensive skills and hits for average, even steals a few bases. How much power will he develop?

Granted, this is just Sickles opinion, but from the prospect side of things, they have a lot to offer. Personally, I would find it hard to turn my nose up at any 4 of their top 8.

 

[calsnowskier]

They're deep at pitching too.

1) Travis D'Arnaud, C, Grade B+: Borderline A-: He would be an A- or maybe even an A if he was more effective at throwing out runners and struck out less often, but he can really hit and is still a superior prospect even with those weaknesses.

2) Nestor Molina, RHP, Grade B+: Ranking the Blue Jays pitching prospects is quite difficult. Although Molina hasn't received as much press as some of the other guys, his performance was impeccable, I think his stuff is underrated, and he'll get to the majors sooner than the others. Despite his season, he is still underrated by a lot of people.

3) Jake Marisnick, OF, Grade B+: Speed, defense, and a greatly improved bat. More power development would get him into the A-range.

4) Noah Syndergaard, RHP, Grade B+: I'm a believer in his stats, his size, his command, and his fastball, and I think the secondary stuff will come around. Can easily be in the A-range next year.

5) Justin Nicolino, LHP, Grade B+: I think Syndergaard's ultimate ceiling is a bit higher, but Nicolino isn't far behind, and is more polished with his secondary pitches. Could also be in the A-range next year.

6) Daniel Norris, LHP, Grade B+: Higher physical ceiling than Nicolino, but I want to see him in pro ball before ranking him ahead.

7) Deck McGuire, RHP, Grade B+ Doesn't have the ceiling of the younger guys, but should be a solid inning-eater at worst and won't need much longer in the minors.

8) Drew Hutchison, RHP, Grade B+. You can't argue with his results even if he doesn't have as much physical upside as the guys ahead. Like McGuire, an efficiency expert who should chew through innings.

9) Anthony Gose, OF, Grade B: Other people will probably rank him higher due to his tools. He's made a lot of progress, but his hitting approach remains quite raw and the strikeout rate still bothers me. Made big strides refining his defense and baserunning. Grade A tools, Grade C+ skills, makes him a strong Grade B overall.

10) A.J. Jimenez, C, Grade B-: Superior defensive skills and hits for average, even steals a few bases. How much power will he develop?

Granted, this is just Sickles opinion, but from the prospect side of things, they have a lot to offer. Personally, I would find it hard to turn my nose up at any 4 of their top 8.

Nice find, rep.

And yet, the "rumored" trade only includes one of these guys, and a catcher at that.

I love guys who propose video game trades and try to pass them off as legit (6 mid-level to garbage players for 1 or 2 solid assets).

 

[msgkings322]

They're deep at pitching too.

1) Travis D'Arnaud, C, Grade B+: Borderline A-: He would be an A- or maybe even an A if he was more effective at throwing out runners and struck out less often, but he can really hit and is still a superior prospect even with those weaknesses.

2) Nestor Molina, RHP, Grade B+: Ranking the Blue Jays pitching prospects is quite difficult. Although Molina hasn't received as much press as some of the other guys, his performance was impeccable, I think his stuff is underrated, and he'll get to the majors sooner than the others. Despite his season, he is still underrated by a lot of people.

3) Jake Marisnick, OF, Grade B+: Speed, defense, and a greatly improved bat. More power development would get him into the A-range.

4) Noah Syndergaard, RHP, Grade B+: I'm a believer in his stats, his size, his command, and his fastball, and I think the secondary stuff will come around. Can easily be in the A-range next year.

5) Justin Nicolino, LHP, Grade B+: I think Syndergaard's ultimate ceiling is a bit higher, but Nicolino isn't far behind, and is more polished with his secondary pitches. Could also be in the A-range next year.

6) Daniel Norris, LHP, Grade B+: Higher physical ceiling than Nicolino, but I want to see him in pro ball before ranking him ahead.

7) Deck McGuire, RHP, Grade B+ Doesn't have the ceiling of the younger guys, but should be a solid inning-eater at worst and won't need much longer in the minors.

8) Drew Hutchison, RHP, Grade B+. You can't argue with his results even if he doesn't have as much physical upside as the guys ahead. Like McGuire, an efficiency expert who should chew through innings.

9) Anthony Gose, OF, Grade B: Other people will probably rank him higher due to his tools. He's made a lot of progress, but his hitting approach remains quite raw and the strikeout rate still bothers me. Made big strides refining his defense and baserunning. Grade A tools, Grade C+ skills, makes him a strong Grade B overall.

10) A.J. Jimenez, C, Grade B-: Superior defensive skills and hits for average, even steals a few bases. How much power will he develop?

Granted, this is just Sickles opinion, but from the prospect side of things, they have a lot to offer. Personally, I would find it hard to turn my nose up at any 4 of their top 8.

Molina is a White Sox now: Blue Jays Trade Top Prospect Nestor Molina to White Sox for Sergio Santos - Minor League Ball

 

[mistgl]

Molina is a White Sox now: Blue Jays Trade Top Prospect Nestor Molina to White Sox for Sergio Santos - Minor League Ball

That list is from mid December. I'm sure it'll be fixed for that book he sells.

 

[tzill]

They're deep at pitching too.

1) Travis D'Arnaud, C, Grade B+: Borderline A-: He would be an A- or maybe even an A if he was more effective at throwing out runners and struck out less often, but he can really hit and is still a superior prospect even with those weaknesses.

2) Nestor Molina, RHP, Grade B+: Ranking the Blue Jays pitching prospects is quite difficult. Although Molina hasn't received as much press as some of the other guys, his performance was impeccable, I think his stuff is underrated, and he'll get to the majors sooner than the others. Despite his season, he is still underrated by a lot of people.

3) Jake Marisnick, OF, Grade B+: Speed, defense, and a greatly improved bat. More power development would get him into the A-range.

4) Noah Syndergaard, RHP, Grade B+: I'm a believer in his stats, his size, his command, and his fastball, and I think the secondary stuff will come around. Can easily be in the A-range next year.

5) Justin Nicolino, LHP, Grade B+: I think Syndergaard's ultimate ceiling is a bit higher, but Nicolino isn't far behind, and is more polished with his secondary pitches. Could also be in the A-range next year.

6) Daniel Norris, LHP, Grade B+: Higher physical ceiling than Nicolino, but I want to see him in pro ball before ranking him ahead.

7) Deck McGuire, RHP, Grade B+ Doesn't have the ceiling of the younger guys, but should be a solid inning-eater at worst and won't need much longer in the minors.

8) Drew Hutchison, RHP, Grade B+. You can't argue with his results even if he doesn't have as much physical upside as the guys ahead. Like McGuire, an efficiency expert who should chew through innings.

9) Anthony Gose, OF, Grade B: Other people will probably rank him higher due to his tools. He's made a lot of progress, but his hitting approach remains quite raw and the strikeout rate still bothers me. Made big strides refining his defense and baserunning. Grade A tools, Grade C+ skills, makes him a strong Grade B overall.

10) A.J. Jimenez, C, Grade B-: Superior defensive skills and hits for average, even steals a few bases. How much power will he develop?

Granted, this is just Sickles opinion, but from the prospect side of things, they have a lot to offer. Personally, I would find it hard to turn my nose up at any 4 of their top 8.

I guess I would too, but look at it this way:

Would you trade Belt, Brown, Panik, and Hembree for, say, Matt Kemp?

I don't think I would.

 

[CameronFrye]

I guess I would too, but look at it this way:

Would you trade Belt, Brown, Panik, and Hembree for, say, Matt Kemp?

I don't think I would.

Where do I sign up? Why in the name of all that's holy would you NOT make that trade?

I'd give up all those players AND throw in a bullpen arm just to make sure it gets done.

 

[filosofy29]

Where do I sign up? Why in the name of all that's holy would you NOT make that trade?

I'd give up all those players AND throw in a bullpen arm just to make sure it gets done.

I would if the Dodgers would take Zito's contract as well.....even if we had to sweeten the deal and add Pill and Pagan (or whatever the hell else they'd want that is reasonable).

I think the reason why (not to speak for him tzill, but in general) someone might not do this trade is because it would spell the end of one of Cain/Lincecum.

 

[calsnowskier]

Where do I sign up? Why in the name of all that's holy would you NOT make that trade?

I'd give up all those players AND throw in a bullpen arm just to make sure it gets done.

I think I agree. None of our top 4 are serious Blue-Chippers, so I would not be devastated to see them dealt for a player of the level of a Matt Kemp.

Now if you had asked me 3 years ago if I would have dealt Posey, Bum, AnVil and Alderson for a Matt Kemp equivalent (Adrian Gonzalez?), I would have said no. Those guys were ALL Blue-Chippers.

Edit: I see you have Belt instead of Joseph, so it is not a 100% exact comparison, but you get my idea...

 

[msgkings322]

Where do I sign up? Why in the name of all that's holy would you NOT make that trade?

I'd give up all those players AND throw in a bullpen arm just to make sure it gets done.

Yeah have to agree with Cam here. You get an MVP-type at our 2nd weakest position in the prime of his career for a nice BP prospect, a nice middle infield prospect, a prospect who plays the same position, and a prospect/MLer who might end up hitting pretty well but at a position not hard to find guys to play.

 

[msgkings322]

I think I agree. None of our top 4 or serious Blue-Chippers, so I would not be devastated to see them dealt for a player of the level of a Matt Kemp.

Now if you had asked me 3 years ago if I would have dealt Posey, Bum, AnVil and Alderson for a Matt Kemp equivalent (Adrian Gonzalez?), I would have said no. Those guys were ALL Blue-Chippers.

And look how Alderson turned out...even 'blue chippers' are still just prospects. Unknown quantities.

 

[calsnowskier]

And look how Alderson turned out...even 'blue chippers' are still just prospects. Unknown quantities.

But even if you look at in in the 20/20 hindsight lens, I STILL would not make the deal because Bum and Posey turned out to be super-stars, and AnVil still has a shot.

That game can be played in both directions.

 

[mistgl]

I guess I would too, but look at it this way:

Would you trade Belt, Brown, Panik, and Hembree for, say, Matt Kemp?

I don't think I would.

It all comes down to how much someone want's the player.

We've seen two teams shell out big for the player they wanted this OS. Different circumstances, I know, but for us to trade Cain an Org would have to overpay us to the point that we could overlook his extreme value to us and our success in 2012.

If we were out of it come the AS break, and an extension hadn't been reached, the return would be less, but still size-able.

 

[msgkings322]

But even if you look at in in the 20/20 hindsight lens, I STILL would not make the deal because Bum and Posey turned out to be super-stars, and AnVil still has a shot.

That game can be played in both directions.

Oh totally agree, you don't make the deal in hindsight OR foresight. I just meant, why would you even hesitate to deal the 4 prospects tzill mentioned, when they could all turn out to be Aldersons.

 

[calsnowskier]

Oh totally agree, you don't make the deal in hindsight OR foresight. I just meant, why would you even hesitate to deal the 4 prospects tzill mentioned, when they could all turn out to be Aldersons.

Gotcha. That's my point. None of these 4 guys rate as high as Alderson did back then.

 

[mistgl]

Gotcha. That's my point. None of these 4 guys rate as high as Alderson did back then.

Browns really the only one with super star potential, and that could easily dissipate if he lays the egg in AA.

Hembree could be a stud closer or power arm ala Casilla, but you can't really compare the contributions of an all-star closer to that of an all-star impact bat.