Andrew Luck signed thru 2021

[SonnyCID]

Never a day in Hilton's life he was better than Lockett. That's where Luck gets no help from his front office. Some guys go 10-6 with 1-15 talent. And some guys go 12-4 with 15-1 talent.

Wilson maximizes the Seahawks ability by playing to it very well.

I do believe that Luck doesn't get nearly the amount of help. But when you're talking about QB play, help only goes so far. Eventually, a QB needs to help improve the level of his team. And that starts with efficiency.

you're putting statistical disparities of a top 5 guy and of a bottom 10 guy solely on the talent around them? That shit doesn't hold up. I'm guess that if we started to compare Wilsons statistical peers to Lucks statistical peers, you wouldn't make that dumb ass argument for anyone else.

 

[eaglesnut]

Wilson maximizes the Seahawks ability by playing to it very well.

I do believe that Luck doesn't get nearly the amount of help. But when you're talking about QB play, help only goes so far. Eventually, a QB needs to help improve the level of his team. And that starts with efficiency.

you're putting statistical disparities of a top 5 guy and of a bottom 10 guy solely on the talent around them? That shit doesn't hold up. I'm guess that if we started to compare Wilsons statistical peers to Lucks statistical peers, you wouldn't make that dumb ass argument for anyone else.

Stats can say a lot of things depending on what you cherry pick. If you don't think Luck can win a Super Bowl as the Seahawk's QB then you've probably got a screw loose. It's been an easy ride for lil Wilson.

 

[SonnyCID]

Stats can say a lot of things depending on what you cherry pick. If you don't think Luck can win a Super Bowl as the Seahawk's QB then you've probably got a screw loose. It's been an easy ride for lil Wilson.

So, you don't put value in QB efficiency?

Well neither do the Eagles so I guess that makes sense.

 

[Rockinkuwait]

Why is it not realistic? the Broncos just did this with Von Miller's contract. Plus again like I said Brock made it clear back in December that he wanted out of Denver. It to me is unrealistic to think the Broncos didn't know he wanted out of town. He didn't exactly hide his anger about being benched very well.

Well he said that going silent before FA was to get Denver to sweat it out, not that he was wanting out.

I don't think he did bad hiding being upset that Kubiak supposedly went back on his word to him that it was his team heading forward. Nothing from him or his camp at any part of the process. The post-game where he addressed that he said it was tough on the emotions being benched, but so happy for the team win, etc... No problem with that. He was saying the right things every time publicly ever since like a guy not wanting to burn bridges, not like a guy that wanted out. There's been a LOT worse things that teams and players have worked out than that one.

And again if the Broncos felt he was surely leaving, why make the moves to try and keep him at the last minute?



You need a tangible reward over the risk to get me to buy into the conspiracy theory.

Reward. You say it makes Denver fans happier that Denver tried. By showing you were able to re-open negotiations and get a contract offer to Brock and his agent? How's that better than just saying Brock cut off contact with Denver and they had no chance? If Elway truly believes he won't be anything better than mediocre, how does this look when he proves that? I mean really Denver fans are the happiest fans in the league right now. Just seems the reward is absolutely zero.

The risk (if the contract offered was just a fake) is that he takes it. Things change at the last second all the time (ask Elway about Dumerville). Why put that out for the Texans to counter (reported by multiple sources Bronco's negotiated up to 16 mil a year, Texans countered with their 18 mil deal). What if Houston said "nope, that's too much", or had a different situation show itself and Denver's deal was the best one out there?

Huge risk with no tangible reward logically. And nobody with any knowledge or media faith even touched that thought. I just can't see that. They offered 16+ mil a year because they felt he was worth 16+ mil a year.

 

[SonnyCID]

Show me a mediocre QB being paid say 14% of the cap that has won a Super Bowl. We have a ton of examples of teams doing this year after year yet continuing to be a mediocre team at best. They maybe make the playoffs once every 3-4 years to give a team and fans hope when the QB plays above average but otherwise they just fall right back into the old pattern again the next year.

I don't know how much effect the 14% really has.

First, we would need to know how many QBs made 14% over the years.

Then we would need to know how those QBs seasons played out in terms of injuries.

Then we would need to assume that all those teams maxed out their cap in those years in order to prove that the contract really did financially strap them that year.

 

[flyerhawk]

Everyone with Tyler Lockett to throw to gets better.

Of course. The 2nd rookie draft pick WR is the reason why Wilson was so good.

You are hilarious.

 

[Rockinkuwait]

Never a day in Hilton's life he was better than Lockett. That's where Luck gets no help from his front office. Some guys go 10-6 with 1-15 talent. And some guys go 12-4 with 15-1 talent.

That is true. Heard yesterday, Colts spent 50 million in bonuses on free agent weapons for luck over the age of 30, and about $50k in bonuses for the offensive line before he got internal organs ripped up.

As for the defense.. I agree fully that a great QB moving the ball can really help his defense. Going 3 and out and turnovers in bad field position can hurt field position (throwing a 5 yard pick at your own 20 is a lot worse than throwing a pick 30 yards down the field from midfield). Colts D last year was 17th in average starting field position. So he wasn't helping by any means but they weren't set back like Tampa, Denver, Houston, Cleveland, etc. Year before they set their D up with the best average starting field position in the league. You want to talk about field position helping a defense, there you go. That's how a defense can be 30th in yards allowed per drive, but 25th in points, start them further from the end zone. Year before they were 7th.

Colts are the only team over .500 to give up more than 1500 points the past 5 years (ranked 20th in points allowed). The only other outliers for team records that are much better than their defenses that come close to that is Green Bay (14th in points allowed and won the same number of games), and New Orleans (.500 over the past 4 years with the 28th best D in that time). Den and NE have 6th and 8th best D's with records above what you'd expect based on that side of the ball too.





Really interesting how closely this past year followed Peyton's.

Granted he got hurt last year which is different, but

in 2001 after three straight years of improvement and leading the league in TD's, Peyton in his 4th year took a huge step back. They were 6-10, he nearly led the lead in picks, efficiency was way down.

In 2015 after three straight years of improvement and leading the league in TD's, Luck in his 4th year took a huge step back.

 

[Rockinkuwait]

I don't know how much effect the 14% really has.

First, we would need to know how many QBs made 14% over the years.

Then we would need to know how those QBs seasons played out in terms of injuries.

Then we would need to assume that all those teams maxed out their cap in those years in order to prove that the contract really did financially strap them that year.

Well of past deals that are over, Eli did, and so did Peyton. Bledsoe is an oddball situation (did technically win and was a HUGE part in that playoff run, but I'd lean to no). Montana twice was the highest paid, won 2 SB's on the first, none on the 2nd (pre salary cap though). 93 was the year of one upping with the upcoming salary cap. Elway signed his deal, then Aikman beat it, then Young beat that. There's 3 QB's who won 4 SB's after that.


It is a tough situation to deal with. On one hand you are making it tougher to be a good team all around. On the other look at who's winning...


Figure divisional week QB's who made the final 8.

last year was Brady, Carson, Cam, Peyton, Alex Smith, Rodgers, Wilson, and Big Ben. (SB was 20.5 mil cap hit QB's).

Year before was Wilson, Brady, Rodgers, Luck, Cam, Flacco, Romo, Peyton.

Year before was Wilson, Luck, Brady, Peyton, Kaep, Brees, Rivers, Cam.


It's really tough to get close to a SB if you don't have one of those QB's either making big money or have one of those few QB's that really make huge strides early on their rookie deals.

It's either paying big money for your QB play.
Hit on a new stud rookie who works out right away (in which case he's getting paid soon).
Find supermodel wives that absolutely BANK for your franchise QB.

I have a feeling if you looked at who invests big on post-rookie QB contracts vs. post-rookie contracts at other positions, the team that spent on QB's would correlate more to winning. Flacco and Brees get a lot of crap for their salaries, but it's hard to look at their drafts the past 5 or so years and their signings at other positions and say a little more money makes them better.

 

[chf]

but it's still well understood by those able to understand it.

I'm going to have that put on a fvkcing t-shirt. Awesome. Wisdom by e-nut.

 

[Manster7588]

If Wilson, Brady or Rodgers were up for contracts Lucks deal could influence them, all other QB's not so much.

 

[TP76]

Brady just extended through 2019 - shunned Flacco money and is making low teens - before escalating into low 20's in a few years. Of course he sucks, so I guess he's paid about right ----> @HammerDown

 

[eaglesnut]

So, you don't put value in QB efficiency?

Yeah, I value sacks taken.

 

[eaglesnut]

Of course. The 2nd rookie draft pick WR is the reason why Wilson was so good.

You are hilarious.

Kid's uncoverable. He was Antonio Browning 11 months before Antonio Brown.

 

[PDay8810]

Kid's uncoverable. He was Antonio Browning 11 months before Antonio Brown.

darn shame they don't put your posts in one place cause your football opinions have been lacking greatly for as long as you've posted here. It's either attention shock value or the regular stupid hour

 

[flyerhawk]

darn shame they don't put your posts in one place cause your football opinions have been lacking greatly for as long as you've posted here. It's either attention shock value or the regular stupid hour

He'll say anything to "win" an argument. So for him to argue that Wilson was great last year because of a rookie WR is not even mildly surprising.

 

[eaglesnut]

darn shame they don't put your posts in one place cause your football opinions have been lacking greatly for as long as you've posted here. It's either attention shock value or the regular stupid hour

Or you could learn a thing or two.

 

[eaglesnut]

He'll say anything to "win" an argument. So for him to argue that Wilson was great last year because of a rookie WR is not even mildly surprising.

I said Wilson has gotten better. He might not even completely fuck up a Super Bowl with a wretched pass at the end now.

 

[flyerhawk]

I said Wilson has gotten better. He might not even completely fuck up a Super Bowl with a wretched pass at the end now.

I think all QBs should be judge on one play. That's what I call deep analysis.

 

[Money]

Brady just extended through 2019 - shunned Flacco money and is making low teens - before escalating into low 20's in a few years. Of course he sucks, so I guess he's paid about right ----> @HammerDown

Tom Brady is the 6th wealthiest player in the history of the NFL. His situation is extremely unusual.

A. He's extremely marketable and will be as long as the Patriots are relevant and he's playing.

B. The legacy he's working on will ensure he's extremely marketable long after his playing days are over.

C. His wife makes more than he does.

He doesn't need to command top dollar right now and the Patriots are reaping the benefits. It actually benefits him personally in the long run to not take take dollar now.

 

[PDay8810]

Or you could learn a thing or two.

funny....I said the same to you 5 months ago