AL Central Discussion

[WiggyRuss]

The Guardians are on pace to have their outfielders hit a total of 24 home runs this season.

Think about how bad that is.

 

[mr.hockey4242]

Hey, its good for Twins fans

But what the fuck is Cleveland doing?? Just gonna keep sending Quantrill out there every 5 days to get his shit pushed in??

 

[mr.hockey4242]

Pablo Lopez gonna over take Arraez in fWar.

 

[catman]

Another nice game by the Twins' pitchers. Pablo Lopez threw a CG, 4-hit shutout with 76 of his 100 pitches being strikes. Good series against the Royals, but the Orioles come in next and the Royals go to Cleveland.
Fun fact -- this was Pablo's first complete game in his career.

 

[WiggyRuss]

Hey, its good for Twins fans

But what the fuck is Cleveland doing?? Just gonna keep sending Quantrill out there every 5 days to get his shit pushed in??

not good.....gotta figure something out with him.

problem is that Allen was sent down because they want to limit him to innings limit. Same problem is going to come up with Williams and Bibee. Sucks no McKenzie and Espino....glad this Braves series is over.

 

[broncosmitty]

Another nice game by the Twins' pitchers. Pablo Lopez threw a CG, 4-hit shutout with 76 of his 100 pitches being strikes. Good series against the Royals, but the Orioles come in next and the Royals go to Cleveland.
Fun fact -- this was Pablo's first complete game in his career.

Big boost for me in dynasty tonight.

 

[navamind]

Even in his good seasons, Quantrill's peripherals were not in line with his ERA. He just doesn't strike many out or get enough ground balls to compensate for that. Hard for any pitchers nowadays to succeed with a K/9 around 5.

At least he still has minor league options

 

[mr.hockey4242]

Like I said, Arraez defense is so bad he better keep hitting near .400

 

[WiggyRuss]

Even in his good seasons, Quantrill's peripherals were not in line with his ERA. He just doesn't strike many out or get enough ground balls to compensate for that. Hard for any pitchers nowadays to succeed with a K/9 around 5.

At least he still has minor league options

true- though its not like it was a small sample size.

Do I expect a 2.9 ERA like a couple years ago? no.

but his last start was against the Braves and the one before that was his first after coming off the DL- so- I will give him a LITTLE bit more of a leash-

especially because the options are not exactly great.

If Cody Morris got stretched out I would def. like to see him in the rotation. Beytonfield is prob. more of the same.

 

[mr.hockey4242]

true- though its not like it was a small sample size.

Do I expect a 2.9 ERA like a couple years ago? no.

but his last start was against the Braves and the one before that was his first after coming off the DL- so- I will give him a LITTLE bit more of a leash-

especially because the options are not exactly great.

If Cody Morris got stretched out I would def. like to see him in the rotation. Beytonfield is prob. more of the same.

Yeah but with underlying metrics, a lot of times guys can complete defy them for a year maybe 2.

Like Quantrill 149 2/3 with a 2.89 era and a 4.07 FIP and 186 1/3 with a 3.38 and a 4.12 FIP.

He did it for two years but eventually things usually catch up. And his K rate is even lower so that helps explain it.

This year he actually has the much lower FIP 4.92 compared to ERA 6.45. Because his ERA is so damn high.

I think he could definitely go on a little run, hes got enough pitching ability. But it was clear eventually the league was gonna knock him around and hes more of a 4 ERA+ pitcher than anything close to 3.

 

[navamind]

Yeah but with underlying metrics, a lot of times guys can complete defy them for a year maybe 2.

Like Quantrill 149 2/3 with a 2.89 era and a 4.07 FIP and 186 1/3 with a 3.38 and a 4.12 FIP.

He did it for two years but eventually things usually catch up. And his K rate is even lower so that helps explain it.

This year he actually has the much lower FIP 4.92 compared to ERA 6.45. Because his ERA is so damn high.

I think he could definitely go on a little run, hes got enough pitching ability. But it was clear eventually the league was gonna knock him around and hes more of a 4 ERA+ pitcher than anything close to 3.

Quantrill's still a pretty decent pitcher even if he pitches to his 2021-22 FIP. Problem is, his pedestrian strikeout rate is even lower than it was those years and opposing hitters are making more contact. His slider and changeup haven't been as effective. He's also had trouble with his fastball command

I just can't believe how much that lineup has regressed this year. Pretty much everyone but Jose Ramirez and Josh Naylor are hitting worse than last year, especially Gimenez (from 140 wRC+ in 2022 to just 95 this year). Bell has also regressed even though he wasn't on last year's squad. Not only has Straw not improved offensively, but his glove is rating significantly worse than it did in 2021-22

 

[mr.hockey4242]

Quantrill's still a pretty decent pitcher even if he pitches to his 2021-22 FIP. Problem is, his pedestrian strikeout rate is even lower than it was those years and opposing hitters are making more contact. His slider and changeup haven't been as effective. He's also had trouble with his fastball command

I just can't believe how much that lineup has regressed this year. Pretty much everyone but Jose Ramirez and Josh Naylor are hitting worse than last year, especially Gimenez (from 140 wRC+ in 2022 to just 95 this year). Bell has also regressed even though he wasn't on last year's squad. Not only has Straw not improved offensively, but his glove is rating significantly worse than it did in 2021-22

I think it was pretty obvious that guys like Kwan and Gimenez(heck even Rosario) were going to regress this year. But yeah the drop off for Gimenez is staggering.

Josh Bell post 2019 basically just rotates between looking washed up and being effective every day player. Wouldnt surprise me if he heats up. Just a matter of if itll be 2nd half or not until next year.

 

[WiggyRuss]

Quantrill's still a pretty decent pitcher even if he pitches to his 2021-22 FIP. Problem is, his pedestrian strikeout rate is even lower than it was those years and opposing hitters are making more contact. His slider and changeup haven't been as effective. He's also had trouble with his fastball command

I just can't believe how much that lineup has regressed this year. Pretty much everyone but Jose Ramirez and Josh Naylor are hitting worse than last year, especially Gimenez (from 140 wRC+ in 2022 to just 95 this year). Bell has also regressed even though he wasn't on last year's squad. Not only has Straw not improved offensively, but his glove is rating significantly worse than it did in 2021-22

Quintrell back on the DL today- not surprising. He did not look right.

I do have to say--- I expected Kwan to be able to keep up what he did last year more so than Gimenez. Gimenez had like a 7 WAR last year which was ridiculous.

Obviously both have had pretty steep drop offs.

I totally believe that both will improve and get closer to last years numbers.

Kwan is too good with the bat not to. Gimenez's bat consistency worries me a little more- all though he has a lot better power.

Kwan just has such a great command of the strike zone. He will come around- he will never have power- but I think his OBP and AVG. will improve.

Straw is atrocious- but they owe him like 15 million or something- and they hate eating money. I cant believe they ate Zuninos 6M- their metrics had to be BAAAAD on him

 

[WiggyRuss]

think that bugs me about the Guardians is they rarely pull the trigger on a trade. Guys like Owen Miller, Will Benson and Nolan Jones all had some decent peak value--- but they let them languish- never give them full opportunities and then they get the 40 man squeeze.

I worry the same thing is happening with Freeman, Arias and Gonzalez---- either let the dudes play- or trade them when they are prospects with peak value. Get rid of Rosario and Straw.

Id much rather se Rocchio or Freeman at SS than Rosario- and Will Benson would have been great in center. Nolan Jones would have been fine as a DH, 1B, RF rotation guy.

should have dealt guys for Murphy is what it comes down too.

 

[mr.hockey4242]

think that bugs me about the Guardians is they rarely pull the trigger on a trade. Guys like Owen Miller, Will Benson and Nolan Jones all had some decent peak value--- but they let them languish- never give them full opportunities and then they get the 40 man squeeze.

I worry the same thing is happening with Freeman, Arias and Gonzalez---- either let the dudes play- or trade them when they are prospects with peak value. Get rid of Rosario and Straw.

Id much rather se Rocchio or Freeman at SS than Rosario- and Will Benson would have been great in center. Nolan Jones would have been fine as a DH, 1B, RF rotation guy.

should have dealt guys for Murphy is what it comes down too.

Yeah its frustrating. Guardians dont trade like at all. Twins just make stupid ass ones(aside from Lopez) where we dont look at medicals and trade prospects for random ass guys with potential.

Just once I want them to take a legit swing. Said it in the deadline thread. Go get Goldy or Arenado. Instantly become a legit contender in the AL which I think is just ok.

 

[WiggyRuss]

Quantrill's still a pretty decent pitcher even if he pitches to his 2021-22 FIP. Problem is, his pedestrian strikeout rate is even lower than it was those years and opposing hitters are making more contact. His slider and changeup haven't been as effective. He's also had trouble with his fastball command

I just can't believe how much that lineup has regressed this year. Pretty much everyone but Jose Ramirez and Josh Naylor are hitting worse than last year, especially Gimenez (from 140 wRC+ in 2022 to just 95 this year). Bell has also regressed even though he wasn't on last year's squad. Not only has Straw not improved offensively, but his glove is rating significantly worse than it did in 2021-22

people dont really notice it- but Rosario was actually pretty decent last year. He had like the 5th most hits in the AL.

Him and Kwan were much better at the 1 and 2 spot. Those 2 guys regressing this year have really hurt more than anything else- though surprisingly Naylor has a shit ton of RBI's.

Rosario is coming around a little bit lately. Gimenez a little bit.

We do not need Rosario, Kwan, Gimenez and Bell to be world beaters- just to be something resembling decent.

Jose Ramirez is so good. He had a straight steal of home a week or so ago.

 

[WiggyRuss]

Yeah its frustrating. Guardians dont trade like at all. Twins just make stupid ass ones(aside from Lopez) where we dont look at medicals and trade prospects for random ass guys with potential.

Just once I want them to take a legit swing. Said it in the deadline thread. Go get Goldy or Arenado. Instantly become a legit contender in the AL which I think is just ok.

2 deals in "recent" history (past 10-15 yearS) where the Guardians traded A prospects for major league talent- once for a reliever and once for a SP.

Can you name them off the top of your head?

One is easy- the other more obscure

 

[mr.hockey4242]

2 deals in "recent" history (past 10-15 yearS) where the Guardians traded A prospects for major league talent- once for a reliever and once for a SP.

Can you name them off the top of your head?

One is easy- the other more obscure

The reliever has to be Miller. And to my point with the Twins....the prospects were mostly busts. I think it included bum ass Frazier and Sheffield.

Idk maybe the Bauer deal off top of my head.

 

[WiggyRuss]

Yeah its frustrating. Guardians dont trade like at all. Twins just make stupid ass ones(aside from Lopez) where we dont look at medicals and trade prospects for random ass guys with potential.

Just once I want them to take a legit swing. Said it in the deadline thread. Go get Goldy or Arenado. Instantly become a legit contender in the AL which I think is just ok.

Cardinals should sell. They are a shit heap. Their SP is a joke.

 

[WiggyRuss]

The reliever has to be Miller. And to my point with the Twins....the prospects were mostly busts. I think it included bum ass Frazier and Sheffield.

Idk maybe the Bauer deal off top of my head.

I was not thinking of Bauer- but only because they didnt trade A prospects for him- they dealt Shin Soo Choo if I remember correctly who was in the last year of his deal

The Cleveland Indians traded Drew Pomerantz and (I think his name was) Andrew White for - 2 former 1st rounders- that were SP and ranked highly- for Ubaldo Jimenez.