2023-24 Flyers: What's new is old again.

[Retroram52]

Yes!! After losing to Carolina, we get a win from Boston with Foerster's 3rd Period goal. Love It!! Eleven to go!

 

[Sparhawk]

 

[Maverick426h]

No excuses for this team. After Tuesday night, our remaining 9 game schedule is one of the weakest in the entire Nhl. 4 of those games are against last place teams and another 3 are against non-playoff teams that will probably have nothing to play for at that stage.

Basically, I'm saying this shouldn't come down to the very last game of the season against the Caps. We better have a 3 point lead over them or better entering play that night. Right now, it's only 2 and they have a couple games in hand, so we have some work to do.

The Pens, Devils and Isles appear to have all played themselves out of this race. They are just too far behind and still losing games left and right.

The Caps, meanwhile, will still have to deal with Toronto, Boston (x2), Carolina, Detroit and Tampa.

 

[chy1127]

No excuses for this team. After Tuesday night, our remaining 9 game schedule is one of the weakest in the entire Nhl. 4 of those games are against last place teams and another 3 are against non-playoff teams that will probably have nothing to play for at that stage.

Basically, I'm saying this shouldn't come down to the very last game of the season against the Caps. We better have a 3 point lead over them or better entering play that night. Right now, it's only 2 and they have a couple games in hand, so we have some work to do.

The Pens, Devils and Isles appear to have all played themselves out of this race. They are just too far behind and still losing games left and right.

The Caps, meanwhile, will still have to deal with Toronto, Boston (x2), Carolina, Detroit and Tampa.

It looks like the Flyers and Caps schedule reverse over the last 10 games. Ours went from extremely difficult to not too bad while the Caps have gone from not too bad to very difficult. No excuses!!!!!

 

[awaz]

More likely he will be traded for peanuts in the offseason and John won't even be here by the time this team finally competes again.

Ya. It's a fine line to walk and I think Torts botched the communication of it. I have no problem with scratching Couturier and sending the message that everyone needs to be accountable. That's fine.

But how hard is it to have a 3 minute conversation with your friggin captain and say 'Look Coots, you're playing terribly. I'm gunna sit you down for a couple games, give you a chance to reset, maybe rest a minute. When you get back in the lineup the team needs you to focus on X, Y, and Z. We need more from you.'?

Sounds like Couturier basically found out he was sitting by reading the lineup on the chalk board during the morning skate. That's ridiculous in today's landscape. Tell the guy what he needs to work on. He's your damn captain. Like eaglesnut says here, if this creates a rift with Couturier (or the team) the Flyers have a huge problem. He's the closest thing they have to contender-level 1C and he's on a big contract. "If he doesn't wanna play for Torts, then we don't want him here" is a childish approach to asset management. If they have to trade Couturier as a salary dump, getting very little in return, they're even further from cup contention. If I were Jones/Briere I'd be having a fit with Torts. Don't risk devaluing an important asset because you have to be some macho old school coach that doesn't have conversations with your players. You're not going to win a cup on effort alone, as much as we might want them to.

 

[lasgop8]

Ya. It's a fine line to walk and I think Torts botched the communication of it. I have no problem with scratching Couturier and sending the message that everyone needs to be accountable. That's fine.

But how hard is it to have a 3 minute conversation with your friggin captain and say 'Look Coots, you're playing terribly. I'm gunna sit you down for a couple games, give you a chance to reset, maybe rest a minute. When you get back in the lineup the team needs you to focus on X, Y, and Z. We need more from you.'?

Sounds like Couturier basically found out he was sitting by reading the lineup on the chalk board during the morning skate. That's ridiculous in today's landscape. Tell the guy what he needs to work on. He's your damn captain. Like eaglesnut says here, if this creates a rift with Couturier (or the team) the Flyers have a huge problem. He's the closest thing they have to contender-level 1C and he's on a big contract. "If he doesn't wanna play for Torts, then we don't want him here" is a childish approach to asset management. If they have to trade Couturier as a salary dump, getting very little in return, they're even further from cup contention. If I were Jones/Briere I'd be having a fit with Torts. Don't risk devaluing an important asset because you have to be some macho old school coach that doesn't have conversations with your players. You're not going to win a cup on effort alone, as much as we might want them to.

If you think Couts at this point is even close to a contender level 1C you haven't been watching many games. Hes playing with the 4th line and isnt even the best player on that line.

If we get rid of him over the summer it will be a godsend to get rid of that contract,

 

[lasgop8]

It looks like the Flyers and Caps schedule reverse over the last 10 games. Ours went from extremely difficult to not too bad while the Caps have gone from not too bad to very difficult. No excuses!!!!!

We have to beat the teams in front of us. I think we are doing pretty decent with this gauntlet of a schedule and 3 defenseman out.

 

[awaz]

If you think Couts at this point is even close to a contender level 1C you haven't been watching many games. Hes playing with the 4th line and isnt even the best player on that line.

If we get rid of him over the summer it will be a godsend to get rid of that contract,

He's the closest the Flyers have. Said it that way on purpose. Maybe he's toast after losing 2 seasons to back problems. But prior to the injuries he was a 70 point, Selke contender. The Flyers have a real problem at C when it comes to contending. The roster is thin there as it is and there aren't any blue chip top 6 guys in the prospect pool either.

Frost has been pretty good this year, but a guy that hangs his hat on offense scoring at a 52 point per season clip isn't going to win any cups as a 1C either. And at almost 25 he's probably closer to a finished product than a prospect.

Either way, there's no sense in potentially causing a conflict with the highest value center in the organization when all you had to do to avoid it was have a simple conversation with the guy. If they want to move him, fine. But there should be good assets coming back for Couturier, especially if they were to retain salary. If there's a rift with him and Torts and everyone knows the Flyers HAVE to get rid of him, they aren't getting shit and they're going to have to retain anyway. And that's a waste.

 

[lasgop8]

He's the closest the Flyers have. Said it that way on purpose. Maybe he's toast after losing 2 seasons to back problems. But prior to the injuries he was a 70 point, Selke contender. The Flyers have a real problem at C when it comes to contending. The roster is thin there as it is and there aren't any blue chip top 6 guys in the prospect pool either.

Frost has been pretty good this year, but a guy that hangs his hat on offense scoring at a 52 point per season clip isn't going to win any cups as a 1C either. And at almost 25 he's probably closer to a finished product than a prospect.

Either way, there's no sense in potentially causing a conflict with the highest value center in the organization when all you had to do to avoid it was have a simple conversation with the guy. If they want to move him, fine. But there should be good assets coming back for Couturier, especially if they were to retain salary. If there's a rift with him and Torts and everyone knows the Flyers HAVE to get rid of him, they aren't getting shit and they're going to have to retain anyway. And that's a waste.

We all know we lack at the center position and the reason for that is Couts isn't anywhere near a first line center.

If he played like his contract dictates and was a real number one center we wouldn't have a problem at the center position as Frost would be a good number 2 and Laughton is a good number 3. All of our deficiencies at center is because of Couts.

If anyone outside our organization is aware of a rift between Couts and Torts its all because Couts and his agent went crying to the press.

Everyone in our organization knows Torts coaching style and his communication with players by now. If you dont get a conversation and your name isn't in the line up that's just how it is. Its nothing new so man up.

 

[lasgop8]

We cither have to play Errsson every game of find a credible back up goalie in our system somewhere as this is becoming very frustrating to watch easy saves turn up as goals for the other team.

 

[awaz]

We all know we lack at the center position and the reason for that is Couts isn't anywhere near a first line center.

If he played like his contract dictates and was a real number one center we wouldn't have a problem at the center position as Frost would be a good number 2 and Laughton is a good number 3. All of our deficiencies at center is because of Couts.

If anyone outside our organization is aware of a rift between Couts and Torts its all because Couts and his agent went crying to the press.

Everyone in our organization knows Torts coaching style and his communication with players by now. If you dont get a conversation and your name isn't in the line up that's just how it is. Its nothing new so man up.

It's fine to think Coots isn't a 1st line center. And that he's overpaid (though you should probably look around the league at what it's going to cost to sign a 1C). You can know it. Torts can know it. Everyone on earth can know it. He's still proven throughout his career that he's a good player. And if the Flyers decided they don't want him to be a part of it, that's totally fine too. Retain a little salary and teams would be lining up around the block for a 3.5M Couturier. Perfect. Bidding war. You get 3.5M off the books and you get a good asset for the future.

But not if the Flyers HAVE to move him or start painting him as a bad attitude. It's asset management 101. It has nothing to do with manning up, it's about maximizing the value of every asset you have, even if you don't want them anymore. That’s what well run organizations do.

 

[Chris p Bacon]

Ya. It's a fine line to walk and I think Torts botched the communication of it. I have no problem with scratching Couturier and sending the message that everyone needs to be accountable. That's fine.

But how hard is it to have a 3 minute conversation with your friggin captain and say 'Look Coots, you're playing terribly. I'm gunna sit you down for a couple games, give you a chance to reset, maybe rest a minute. When you get back in the lineup the team needs you to focus on X, Y, and Z. We need more from you.'?

Sounds like Couturier basically found out he was sitting by reading the lineup on the chalk board during the morning skate. That's ridiculous in today's landscape. Tell the guy what he needs to work on. He's your damn captain. Like eaglesnut says here, if this creates a rift with Couturier (or the team) the Flyers have a huge problem. He's the closest thing they have to contender-level 1C and he's on a big contract. "If he doesn't wanna play for Torts, then we don't want him here" is a childish approach to asset management. If they have to trade Couturier as a salary dump, getting very little in return, they're even further from cup contention. If I were Jones/Briere I'd be having a fit with Torts. Don't risk devaluing an important asset because you have to be some macho old school coach that doesn't have conversations with your players. You're not going to win a cup on effort alone, as much as we might want them to.

Every article I've read has Coots saying different things, to me it's all click bait. The only realistic comment I've heard was he said, I've gotta work harder and it is what it is. I personally don't believe Torts would've sat Coots and not explained why. He's having a pretty shitty season, not sure he needs the coach to tell him that. Only reason this has any traction IS because he's the Captain.

 

[Chris p Bacon]

Also we all know we're pretty weak at the Center position, hopefully with all these number one picks we've acquired we can find one. I think we're going to draft better, remember, just because we are competing doesn't mean we're not rebuilding too.

 

[Chris p Bacon]

Sean Couturier doesn’t want to talk about healthy scratches

The Philadelphia Flyers captain was back in the lineup for Saturday’s win over the Boston Bruins but he just wants to put the healthy scratches behind him.

www.broadstreethockey.com

Here's another article where I believe this is about all Coots said about being scratched, doesn't sound like a fit or bad attitude to me.

 

[lasgop8]

It's fine to think Coots isn't a 1st line center. And that he's overpaid (though you should probably look around the league at what it's going to cost to sign a 1C). You can know it. Torts can know it. Everyone on earth can know it. He's still proven throughout his career that he's a good player. And if the Flyers decided they don't want him to be a part of it, that's totally fine too. Retain a little salary and teams would be lining up around the block for a 3.5M Couturier. Perfect. Bidding war. You get 3.5M off the books and you get a good asset for the future.

But not if the Flyers HAVE to move him or start painting him as a bad attitude. It's asset management 101. It has nothing to do with manning up, it's about maximizing the value of every asset you have, even if you don't want them anymore. That’s what well run organizations do.

I dont care what other teams centers are doing I'm only interested in our team so bringing up players on another team to compare with our situation is a moot point.

I am lining up around my own block to get a 3.5 million dollar Couts too. Unfortunately we are stuck with a 3rd line center making almost 8 million per year. If jhe was making 3.5 million for us id be jumping for joy.

We never HAVE to give away anyone unless they request a trade and if Couts and his agent do it professionally instead of through the media we will get fair value in return.

However it would be best for our team if he actually played like a number one center and earn his money and stop crying.

 

[awaz]

Sean Couturier doesn’t want to talk about healthy scratches

The Philadelphia Flyers captain was back in the lineup for Saturday’s win over the Boston Bruins but he just wants to put the healthy scratches behind him.

www.broadstreethockey.com

Here's another article where I believe this is about all Coots said about being scratched, doesn't sound like a fit or bad attitude to me.

Ya, I don't mean to say he is or that we currently have a problem. But the reports right after it happened, both from Coots' agent and all the media, was that Torts basically didn't talk to him about it at all. Then they might've chatted a little after everyone got wound up about it. And Coots did the right thing and said 'its water under the bridge' yesterday or Saturday. And hopefully that's all it is.

Torts still should've been up front with him and talked to him first. Then there's no risk of it. And there's not 'first cut' in a relationship with the captain of the team. And there's nothing in the media about Torts being a jerk. No interviews from former players so Joe Beat Writer has a story for the day.

The Flyers need to be a destination top players want to come play in. Torts, even before coming to Philly, had a reputation of not being everyone's favorite coach. Sure, everyone wants mentally strong guys and guys that give it all night in and night out, doesn't matter who the coach is they just put their head down and play, blah blah blah. But if the Flyers only solution to their 1C problem is to sign a free agent and they go to Draisatl in 2025 with a 12M x 7 years offer and he's got 6 other ones to choose from, why would he choose to play for Torts when he could play for someone else for the same money? And probably one closer to cup favorite level.

 

[awaz]

I dont care what other teams centers are doing I'm only interested in our team so bringing up players on another team to compare with our situation is a moot point.

I am lining up around my own block to get a 3.5 million dollar Couts too. Unfortunately we are stuck with a 3rd line center making almost 8 million per year. If jhe was making 3.5 million for us id be jumping for joy.

We never HAVE to give away anyone unless they request a trade and if Couts and his agent do it professionally instead of through the media we will get fair value in return.

However it would be best for our team if he actually played like a number one center and earn his money and stop crying.

You do have to move him though if the relationship with the coach sours. And you can bitch about Coots and his agent doing it professionally all you want. The Flyers don't have control over that. And the outcome is the same, a devalued asset. Whine about Coots or his agent being soft if you want, but it doesn't change that the Flyers are worse off if it happens.

So don't be a dick when you bench him. It's not that hard. Protect the relationship, protect the asset value. It literally costs the Flyers nothing. What could they possibly have gained from not telling him why he's scratched? I see how scratching him has value, but specifically the not telling him part. What's the point? There's nothing of value to gain and there's risk of significant damage. It's a stupid thing to do.

 

[awaz]

Also we all know we're pretty weak at the Center position, hopefully with all these number one picks we've acquired we can find one. I think we're going to draft better, remember, just because we are competing doesn't mean we're not rebuilding too.

Hopefully. I hope they can use the picks they have to move up. They really need the high end guys that are typically found in the top of the draft.

Hopefully they can move there 20ish and 30ish pick in to the top 14 or so to get one of the 7 dmen slated to go in there that seem to have some promise. The next year hopefully they can move up similarly. In some of the 'way too early' rankings they have 8 C's in the first 13 picks. Top pair D and top line C are the two biggest holes facing the team right now for sure.

 

[lasgop8]

You do have to move him though if the relationship with the coach sours. And you can bitch about Coots and his agent doing it professionally all you want. The Flyers don't have control over that. And the outcome is the same, a devalued asset. Whine about Coots or his agent being soft if you want, but it doesn't change that the Flyers are worse off if it happens.

So don't be a dick when you bench him. It's not that hard. Protect the relationship, protect the asset value. It literally costs the Flyers nothing. What could they possibly have gained from not telling him why he's scratched? I see how scratching him has value, but specifically the not telling him part. What's the point? There's nothing of value to gain and there's risk of significant damage. It's a stupid thing to do.

Couts is under the Flyers contract not the other way around. If he wants out it doesn't matter we dont have to trade him he can just play 4th line minutes for the next 5 years until his contract is up. If you want to get traded dont you and your agent whine to the media just request a trade quietly and wait for it to happen.

We hold all the cards here. I hope Torts keeps being Torts! If you need to bench Couts again i hope it gets done in the very same way and if he doesn't like it to bad we own that contract for 5 more years.

 

[Chris p Bacon]

Couts is under the Flyers contract not the other way around. If he wants out it doesn't matter we dont have to trade him he can just play 4th line minutes for the next 5 years until his contract is up. If you want to get traded dont you and your agent whine to the media just request a trade quietly and wait for it to happen.

We hold all the cards here. I hope Torts keeps being Torts! If you need to bench Couts again i hope it gets done in the very same way and if he doesn't like it to bad we own that contract for 5 more years.

Regardless of what happens, I like the kid and actually hope he takes some time off in the off season to work on his back. Any injury that keeps you sidelined for a whole year is nothing minor. He has to decide from here wether his game can be resurrected or if he's done. I would think him being who he is would hang them up if he couldn't go 100% any more. Just my 2 cents.