2019 Offseason Thread

[trojanfan12]

You watch with your Kobe goggles on, it is why you don’t see basketball impartiality.

Guess you missed the part where I never liked Kobe.

You really should watch a game sometime.

Basketball is a really cool sport.

 

[Bart]

I loved Shaq but he wasn't dominant when he was in Miami.....

19.6 ppg and 9rpg was good for his age but that's not dominant at all....

It was the double and triple teams that Shaq attracted that allowed for Wade to operate virtually unencumbered. Just Shaq's presence alone is a huge asset.

 

[msgkings322]

Good point about there being other stacked teams during that time. I think Lebron gets unfairly criticized for having a super team because the way he went about forming the super team. The Celts team around that time IMO was more of super team than Lebron's but you rarely hear criticism directed at Garnett, Ray Allen or Pierce.

There have ALWAYS been superteams in the NBA, from the 60s Celtics to the 80s Lakers and Celtics to the 90s Bulls, the early 2000s Lakers, etc. Which is why all the bitching about the Warriors was so dumb.

What LeBron definitely started and what transformed the league was the PLAYERS themselves deciding to team up. That's what bothers some fans these days, the players are in control in a way they never have been. I don't see why that's such a problem for folks (racism?), but times change.

 

[Bart]

Most lists do have Kobe somewhere around the very end like 10 or 11, if you're being reasonable.

This isn't my exact list but something like:

Jordan
LeBron
Magic
Kareem
Wilt
Oscar
Hakeem
Shaq
Duncan
Kobe

Is that in order? I assume one day Curry or Durant will replace Kobe on your list, don't you think?

 

[trojanfan12]

If you never done the exercise how do you know Kobe is on it. You could surprise yourself if you ever did one.

I've done one once or twice. But it's been a long time. I think I had Kobe at around #8 or 9.

 

[msgkings322]

It was the double and triple teams that Shaq attracted that allowed for Wade to operate virtually unencumbered. Just Shaq's presence alone is a huge asset.

How about Kobe winning 2 rings as by far the best player on his team, drawing all the double teams himself, without Shaq? No credit for that?

 

[Bart]

Yep, they had 2 great players at the beginning and Bosh was a top 20-25 player, if not higher.

LOL at 20-25, hardly a super team member when he wasn't a good defender.

 

[msgkings322]

Is that in order? I assume one day Curry or Durant will replace Kobe on your list, don't you think?

Certainly possible. Like I said that's not my exact list but it's close. So one day you can say Kobe is not top 10, maybe if passed by one of those guys (maybe Kawhi?) he won't be but for now you are arguing too stridently that he's not.

 

[trojanfan12]

Sure you can.

Especially now that positions are dying anyway.

It is merely a coincidence that most people’s top 4 all play different traditional positions (MJ, LeBron, Magic, Kareem)

But I highly doubt most all time top 5s have a PF in them. In fact, I would bet a lot of top 10s don’t.

Mine does.

 

[Bart]

Guess you missed the part where I never liked Kobe.

You really should watch a game sometime.

Basketball is a really cool sport.

 

[Bart]

I've done one once or twice. But it's been a long time. I think I had Kobe at around #8 or 9.

You should do it again, it isn't that hard. It would be interesting who you kicked off for a player you supposedly don't like.

 

[msgkings322]

You should do it again, it isn't that hard. It would be interesting who you kicked off for a player you supposedly don't like.

Who would you replace Kobe with on my list?

 

[trojanfan12]

You should do it again, it isn't that hard. It would be interesting who you kicked off for a player you supposedly don't like.

I don't have to like a player to acknowledge that he is/was a great player.

I don't like Lebron either and he's in my top 5.

I just really don't care enough about all time lists to go beyond top 5 and I really don't even like that.

Basketball has changed so much over the years that doing an all time list is kind of a pointless exercise.

 

[Bart]

How about Kobe winning 2 rings as by far the best player on his team, drawing all the double teams himself, without Shaq? No credit for that?

That Lakers team aside from Kobe was much better than people give it credit for. Bynum and Gasol were a pair of 7 foots who totally closed off the inside on defense. They had they best inside presence in the league, both offensively and defensively. And I'm not even bringing up Odom who was 6-11 and mobile with close to triple double potential every game. That team didn't have the names but top to bottom one of the best at the time. Not to mention a HOF coach.

 

[Bart]

Certainly possible. Like I said that's not my exact list but it's close. So one day you can say Kobe is not top 10, maybe if passed by one of those guys (maybe Kawhi?) he won't be but for now you are arguing too stridently that he's not.

Just too many great players to have Kobe in your top 10 especially of you analyze the evidence.

 

[Bart]

Who would you replace Kobe with on my list?

Bird.

 

[Bart]

I don't have to like a player to acknowledge that he is/was a great player.

I don't like Lebron either and he's in my top 5.

I just really don't care enough about all time lists to go beyond top 5 and I really don't even like that.

Basketball has changed so much over the years that doing an all time list is kind of a pointless exercise.

Sounds like an excuse. It's just 5 more players

 

[trojanfan12]

Sounds like an excuse. It's just 5 more players

If you want to call lack of interest in a pointless exercise an excuse, that's fine.

But most people consider pointless exercises a waste of time.

 

[WiggyRuss]

*Paging Mr @WiggyRuss*

I bet the LAkers got an A last year

how did that work out?

#paging Mr. DJ

oh yah. holding their dicks when the playoffs started

 

[Bart]

If you want to call lack of interest in a pointless exercise an excuse, that's fine.

But most people consider pointless exercises a waste of time.

How about posting on a message board debating trival matters isn’t that pointless too? But you do that everyday