2018-2019 NBA Regular Season Thread

[CitySushi]

Agree. But would be more helpful if he wasn't such an awful shooter. sure, they have enough talent to hide his poor offense.

Offense = shooting? Got it.

 

[dtgold88]

Possibly, but also Draymond is probably one of the top 5 passing PF's in NBA history. Do you think Nance would be capable of filling that role?

As good? No. But before this season I didn't think he could ever run an offense but he surprised me when given the chance this year

 

[dtgold88]

He utilizes his role on the W's perfectly without a doubt, but that doesn't mean he is a better player than Nance currently. Nance can knock down the mid-range and 3 pointer pretty consistently. He isn't the rebounder or defender that Draymond is. Two years ago I would say Draymond was better, pretty easily even compared to the Larry Nance Jr. currently.

But currently, both players comparing wise are pretty close imo

All I'm saying. Nance this year isn't really close to peak Green.

 

[dtgold88]

That's plausible. And offensively, it's not without the realm of possibility. Nance may end up being a better scorer, but he won't be a better facilitator that's for sure. Defensively, it's not close though.

Again, I'm not saying Nance Jr. is trash, but Draymond, IMO, is a horrible comparison for him.

And I think you are comparing peak Green. Current Green is far from "horrible" comparison as nance looks to be a better scorer and probably rebounder. Not an elite defender but he seems solid.

 

[CitySushi]

I mean I get we won't see eye to eye on this, but Draymond and Nance are NOT comparable players. They don't do the same things.

Draymond once got a triple double scoring only 4 points. That's the kind of impact player he is. It's not his job to score and when he does, it's completely a bonus. Draymond saw where he could make the biggest impact and where his value was on the team and turned that up to all star level play.

If you swap out Draymond for Blake Griffin right now, I'm talking All-Star level Blake Griffin, are the Warriors better or worse given the construct of their team? I'd say worse. Conversely if you swapped them out are the Pistons better or worse? I'd say worse for sure.

Context is key when valuing players.

 

[dtgold88]

Two years ago Draymond was easily a top 20 player in the NBA. This year, he's closer to 50.

I just think Draymond is a horrible comp for Nance Jr. It's like just trying to pick the low hanging fruit on the Warriors based off of statistical value, whereas I know for a fact that you see deeper impact than just the face value numbers.

Just curious...do you think if they started Nance and didn't have Green they fail to win the title?

Where would the cavs be with the switch?

 

[dtgold88]

No need. Common sense.

Hopefully you aren't among those who think "common sense" says they'd all take him over Love.

 

[CitySushi]

And I think you are comparing peak Green. Current Green is far from "horrible" comparison as nance looks to be a better scorer and probably rebounder. Not an elite defender but he seems solid.

Again you're thinking that Draymond has fallen off a cliff is hilarious. I'm not comparing him to peak Draymond, I'm definitely comparing him to this years version.

Just two years ago here were Draymond's numbers:

10.2 pts per game on 8.6 attempts per game
FG%: 41.8
3pt%: 30.8
APG: 7.0
RPG: 7.9
SPG: 2.0
BPG: 1.4

versus this year:

7.5 pts per game on 6.5 shots
Fg%: 44.8
3pt%: 28.5
APG: 7.0
RPG: 7.3
SPG: 1.5
BPG: 1.1


And on top of all that he's playing the same quality defense that he has in years past.

 

[dtgold88]

Context also matters as well. There are tons of players in the NBA who are great shooters, that don't carry their own weight during the course of a basketball game. That's why there are other areas of a game that can be impacted OTHER than scoring and shooting.

If we limit the game and the value of players based on their ability to shoot and score, we can eliminate some of the all-time great players from contention. I mean take Harden and D-Wade for example. Harden is a much better scorer and shooter than Wade ever was. But there's not even a debate as to who the better player was.

OK, but this season his rebounds are also better (in less minutes). And of course nance is not surrounded by great players allowing the D to focus more on him (they ignore Green) and he still shoots better.

sorry, but my opinion is if Green played for an also-ran his entire career, other than his antics, you'd barely know who he is.

 

[CitySushi]

Just curious...do you think if they started Nance and didn't have Green they fail to win the title?

Where would the cavs be with the switch?

YES. Absolutely. Draymond's impact to the teams is also his mean streak, his drive, attitude and willingness to hold teammates accountable is one of the primary reasons for the Warriors success, past and current.

Also the Cavs would certainly be better. Draymond's leadership within the team would boost their overall production for sure. Everywhere Draymond has gone, his teams have been winners. He's got that in him. He's the ultimate underdog, who thrives off of people discounting them. He'd hold the Cavs young guys accountable and help them grow. He'd boost your teams overall defensive efficiency and you would be in many more competitive games just because of his impact there.

There's no question the Cavs are better and no question the Warriors are worse.

 

[dtgold88]

I mean I get we won't see eye to eye on this, but Draymond and Nance are NOT comparable players. They don't do the same things.

Draymond once got a triple double scoring only 4 points. That's the kind of impact player he is. It's not his job to score and when he does, it's completely a bonus. Draymond saw where he could make the biggest impact and where his value was on the team and turned that up to all star level play.

If you swap out Draymond for Blake Griffin right now, I'm talking All-Star level Blake Griffin, are the Warriors better or worse given the construct of their team? I'd say worse. Conversely if you swapped them out are the Pistons better or worse? I'd say worse for sure.

Context is key when valuing players.

Draymond is a great player for GS. Who said otherwise? Though they could swap out Green for Griffin and my money is still on GS for the title. Not sure anyone challenges them. Green on the Pistons all year? Guessing Miami fans who wanted to make the playoffs would like this.

 

[msgkings322]

And shooting's a big part of basketball if you weren't aware. Not sure one needs to be a genius to know this, but OK.

Not for Draymond it isn't. And the results have been satisfactory.

 

[dtgold88]

Sorry @Wamu but you made a claim I said Nance > Green when I specifically said - over and over - this is not the case.

continue your Yosemite sam-like meltdown if you like, though.

 

[msgkings322]

You polled every single one of them?

I did, they all agreed

 

[CitySushi]

Draymond is a great player for GS. Who said otherwise? Though they could swap out Green for Griffin and my money is still on GS for the title. Not sure anyone challenges them. Green on the Pistons all year? Guessing Miami fans who wanted to make the playoffs would like this.

I don't know if you know this or not, but you've been saying it. While not outright, it's clearly implied by every one of your posts comparing him and Nance. Again Nance isn't trash, but he's not in Draymond's league. And it's evident because the MAIN points of contention for you saying that they are similar is scoring production, when it's never been Draymond's strength or role to begin with. You're simply picking areas you think Nance would provide value to the Warriors in a potential swap, while discounting nearly every other thing he does for the team better than Nance, including any intangibles he brings to the locker room.

I don't believe you think Draymond is trash. I do believe you think Nance is probably better than he is (and I'll admit maybe even better than I believe he is), but there's a clear cut difference between the players and what they bring to the table on a given night.

 

[WiggyRuss]

Again you're thinking that Draymond has fallen off a cliff is hilarious. I'm not comparing him to peak Draymond, I'm definitely comparing him to this years version.

Just two years ago here were Draymond's numbers:

10.2 pts per game on 8.6 attempts per game
FG%: 41.8
3pt%: 30.8
APG: 7.0
RPG: 7.9
SPG: 2.0
BPG: 1.4

versus this year:

7.5 pts per game on 6.5 shots
Fg%: 44.8
3pt%: 28.5
APG: 7.0
RPG: 7.3
SPG: 1.5
BPG: 1.1


And on top of all that he's playing the same quality defense that he has in years past.

i dont know if he has "fallen off a cliff" but i would certainly not have him in my top 30 players anymore......probably somewhere between 40 and 60.

 

[msgkings322]

We are talking about a regressing Draymond Green. If he were playing like he had in the past it probably never gets brought up.....but he's not.

He is regressing a bit, sure. Hasn't been a problem yet.

 

[WiggyRuss]

Sorry @Wamu but you made a claim I said Nance > Green when I specifically said - over and over - this is not the case.

continue your Yosemite sam-like meltdown if you like, though.

Yosemite Wamu...lol....

 

[Wamu]

@Wamu but you made a claim I said Nance > Green when I specifically said - over and over - this is not the case.

continue your Yosemite sam-like meltdown if you like, though.[/QUOTE]

Bullshit. Where exactly did I say you said Nance > Green.

 

[Shanemansj13]

Possibly, but also Draymond is probably one of the top 5 passing PF's in NBA history. Do you think Nance would be capable of filling that role?

Not exactly that role but who can fill Draymond's role. I have seen Nance dramtically improve his shooting and passing skills though. I would say Draymond definitely more of a liability turnover wise.