2015 Entry Draft Thread

[Likewall32]

Oshie traded for peanuts --- another player that first rnd pick wouldve helped out on...

 

[Cbrower91]

Oshie traded for peanuts --- another player that first rnd pick wouldve helped out on...

Can't win a Stanley cup in a shoot out and that's about TJ Oshies biggest strength

 

[MrChangoT97]

Joel Ward 3yrs 3.15mil total salary

 

[sjrules99]

Joel Ward 3yrs 3.15mil total salary

its 3.25 per year. Not a bad signing, as he is a character guy, but I cant believe they got him for the same price as justin williams. I would have rather had williams x 1000 over ward. And for 3 years? Hell be 36, 37, and 38 by the end of his three seasons. It's another massive overpay (like 1M too much and too much term). Love the heart, but too much money and term, especially in comparison to a far far far superior player in williams, whos a 2 time cup champ and conn smyth winner who is also younger.

Dougie has signed two quality old guys, but overpaid for both with too much term on each. the market didnt dictate these kind of salaries and terms either, so while Im pleased to add good guys, and they are very likely a better team now than last year, I really wish dougie had an offseason like Washington.

Got Oshie for veery little. Signed williams for a very good number.

 

[MrChangoT97]

I thought it was 3.25mil total

 

[MrChangoT97]

Damn, that sign in kinda sucks then. No more money for another impact dman. Trade possibly coming soon?

 

[Cmon_WTF]

The main piece St. Louis was trying to aquire was a center and the only movable center for the Sharks is Couture. While Couture for Shattenkirk would have been a straight up move that helped both teams you don't move Couture for Oshie so it makes no sense for the Sharks to go after him.

 

[Cmon_WTF]

Given what Belesky and Frolik signed for $3.25 per for Ward is a huge steal. I'm surprised it's so little given it was reported at least 8 teams were interested in him.

 

[23sharks]

Given what Belesky and Frolik signed for $3.25 per for Ward is a huge steal. I'm surprised it's so little given it was reported at least 8 teams were interested in him.

Agreed. Getting a guy that can get you 20 goals for $3M a year is a good move. Plus the work ethic and heart hopefully rubs off on some of these other guys. Lots of question marks among the young guys at forward, so I like this. Should have 3 really good lines.....and be able to put together a quality 4th line too.

 

[23sharks]

Here's a comment from DeBoer about Ward:

Said DeBoer in a statement:

"Joel is an identity player in that he plays exactly the way I want our team to play. He's big, strong, fast and hard to play against. That's exactly what we are looking for."

 

[sjrules99]

Given what Belesky and Frolik signed for $3.25 per for Ward is a huge steal. I'm surprised it's so little given it was reported at least 8 teams were interested in him.

All of this assumes that he can come anywhere near his last two years in terms of production over the next 3 years. Id say that extremely unlikely to downright impossible. the ages of 35-38 are steep decline years. He may be worth 3.25 today, and maybe even one more year, but no way hes worth that at 38 years old given his physical game. He's gunna break down, lose a step, and it's not gunna be pretty. His heart and character are there, but frolik and belesky are young and could easily get better and better. Cant compare the deal by the two today, as you gotta look at it over the life of their deals. If Ward loses a step and is barely a 4th liner within a year or two, is it still good.

Also, comparing to frolik and belesky is one option, but a better comparison for an older player with heart is clearly williams. Who the hell would rather have ward for 3 years at 3.25 over williams for 2 years at the same number??? To me williams>>>>ward, so I cant be too happy.

Also, I see the need for another solid Dman as a greater need. The top 4 of burns, martin, vlasic, braun are just fine for me, but mueller and dillon are unimpressive and in the case of 1 or 2 injuries, the D will be downright ugly. They really could have used to get some more D help with that money or to sign ward for less (if possible) and still get a dman.

Its not a horrible deal. its just not ideal given the number and term, the still large hole on D, and the williams deal as a comparison

 

[sjrules99]

Of course, this is also a key move toward PK improvement. He averaged nearly 2 mins/gm of PK work, so that's a pretty regular shift. By comparison, pavelski who was one of the sharks biggest regular Pkers averaged a little less than Ward as did marleau, another of the sharks top PKers. Justin williams averaged just around 20 secs/gm on the PK.

I guess this is another move toward solidifying the Pk as much as anything.

 

[sjrules99]

I also wonder if this move is a reflection that Torres is not gunna play. I heard news to the contrary, but if he is gunna play, and brown is also healthy, it gives the sharks 14 forwards. That leaves no space for rookies unless some guys get beat out like Barclay Goodrow. Seems they have their 12 regular starters assuming all is healthy:

Thornton, marleau, pavelksi, couture, wingels, ward, hertl, nieto, karlsson,Torres, Smith, Tierney (Mike Brown and Barclay Goodrow are extras).

On the other hand, assuming Mueller remains in the NHL, the sharks have 6 D: Burns, Martin, Vlasic, Braun, dillon, Mueller. They have tennyson signed, but that's pretty much it. I cannot imagine they are going to leave the D that dangerously thin. They would be one or two injuries from complete disaster on the back end. They obviously arent going to go into the season as it is and at least one more guy is likely to be signed, but Mcnally, stollery, or Ryan are not a great #8's and tennyson is a weak #7. I suppose the fact that Irwin remains unsigned is a likely signal that he will be coming back since e likely tested the market and found it dry. 2 years, 2.5M remains a relatively fair and likely deal to me. Or just 1 yr, 1.2M.

The sharks only have about 2M left for that #7 roster Dman, so Irwin is the calber of guy they have gotta be looking at.

 

[Cmon_WTF]

I would take Ward far before Williams. Ward brings a physicality that Williams does not and Ward is a tremendous defensive player where as Williams is a liability in that regard. Ward will take PK minutes fom top guys like Pavelski, Couture, and Marleau which means a lot less wear and tear on their bodies over the course of the season. Let's not forget that like Williams, Ward is considered a huge PO preformer as well.

 

[Cmon_WTF]

And how do you consider a 3rd pairing RD as a large hole? If Martin can return to form the D shapes up like:

Vlasic - Braun
Martin - Burns
Dillon - ??????

Dillon's play over the last 15 or so games last year was very good in his own zone. If he can build off that and they can find a decient puck moving RD to pair with him it improves an already solid group of dmen.

 

[MrChangoT97]

Trade seems likely to happen.

 

[Cbrower91]

Given what Belesky and Frolik signed for $3.25 per for Ward is a huge steal. I'm surprised it's so little given it was reported at least 8 teams were interested in him.

Sharks desperately needed a net front presence a amongst its forwards and it still needs it on the blue line, sharks really lack a guy who can effectively clear the net outside of Burns and that's usually a train wreck.

I like the signing because it fills a hole but i don't like the money and term but that's the market so it is what it is

 

[sjrules99]

And how do you consider a 3rd pairing RD as a large hole? If Martin can return to form the D shapes up like:

Vlasic - Braun
Martin - Burns
Dillon - ??????

Dillon's play over the last 15 or so games last year was very good in his own zone. If he can build off that and they can find a decient puck moving RD to pair with him it improves an already solid group of dmen.

If everyone is healthy all year, its an average D, middle of the pack Id say. Not nearly as good as some (like chicago or nYR), but better than others (edm or Pho). However, health is a big issue. Martin is a major injury risk. Pickles has missed some time. Braun too. Dillon is a big big question mark in terms of his ability to step into the top 4. Thus, if everyone is 100% healthy all year, its a servicable crew. If not, then we will have Mueller and Tennyson in the lineup on a daily basis, and 2 injuries (also pretty common and happened a bunch last year) would put mueller, Tennyson, and stollery in the lineup as they have no depth at D in the system as far as I can see. Its gigantic risk, and their top 4, while solid arent the minute eaters of other top D. Keith and seabrook can push 30 mins/gm as can a drew doughty. No shark can easily handle more than 23-25 max, so the depth matters more for SJ.

 

[sjrules99]

I would take Ward far before Williams. Ward brings a physicality that Williams does not and Ward is a tremendous defensive player where as Williams is a liability in that regard. Ward will take PK minutes fom top guys like Pavelski, Couture, and Marleau which means a lot less wear and tear on their bodies over the course of the season. Let's not forget that like Williams, Ward is considered a huge PO preformer as well.

Wow, this is interesting. I understand that Ward is a more well rounded player who can play in many spots, but Williams is a much more potent and scary scorer with 3 cups and conn smyth. Maybe its just that I have watched williams play more, and watched him destroy the sharks that gives me the impression, but I would much rather have had williams.

 

[sjrules99]

On another bright side, we now know that Mr. SAP is willing to spend to the cap and wants to win now. If this little revolution works, and the sharks are a solid team next year, it will bode well for the longer term as they picked up 2 grade A prospects this draft and have a nice system of young forwards coming along. The 2 years left on the big two and 3 for ward are good lengths for the development curves of their abundant 19-20 year old forward prospects.

I have absolutely no idea what to expect this upcoming year now. They could suck just as much as last year if jones falls short, martin or anyone on the D gets hurt, and the young guys (karlsson, nieto, hertl, tierney, etc) do not progress. Or they could be legit contenders if Jones is a clear #1 as many say, the kids develop nicely, and the D health holds up. This is one of the most unknown years that I can remember

And the biggest wild card is DeBoer, and namely his ability to fix the locker room and establish a captain and leadership structure that gets everyone pulling in the same direction.