2015-16 NBA Eastern Conference OFFICIAL THREAD

[lakersrule]

If a star wants to force his way out via trade, the team is left with no option but to trade a dollar for 4 quarters. Teams don't typically voluntarily trade a star for a bunch of role players.

The front office was left with no choice. One of them had to go.

 

[Heatles84]

Warrirors are 66-7 and are wearing down. More proof that Wiggy should've been swallowed.

 

[trojanfan12]

The front office was left with no choice. One of them had to go.

Exactly. Shaq forced his way out. The Lakers were left with the choice of trading him for whatever they could get or watch him leave for nothing.

Something folks seem to forget or ignore is that Shaq says that he didn't leave because of Kobe, he left because of money. Shaq was older, starting to decline and refused to do things like show up to camp in shape or have injury issues taken care of in the off-season. Dr. Buss only wanted to give one of them a max deal and chose the younger guy who stayed in shape year round and took care of health issues in the off-season so that he would be ready to go for camp. Shaq also wanted a max deal.

The final straw came when Shaq dunked in a pre-season game, looked at Dr. Buss who was in the stands and screamed "You gonna pay me now?"

I'm not saying Shaq and Kobe were best friends or anything, but according to Shaq, they would have worked it out. Shaq has also said that he should have listened to Kobe when Kobe told him to stay in shape in the off-season.

 

[trojanfan12]

Warrirors are 66-7 and are wearing down. More proof that Wiggy should've been swallowed.

Warriors are wearing down and the Cavs are rolling. - Wiggy

 

[trojanfan12]

LOL, okay. The Warrirors starting 5 has a large number of games where some don't even see the 4th quarter.

Boy you're setting yourself up for a heart breaking situation. I can't wait.

The Warriors are a young team and as you point out, have been able to rest their main guys in many of their games. As long as Kerr doesn't take them out of their normal rotations and have them playing a bunch of extra minutes to chase the record, I doubt fatigue will be any kind of factor for them.

 

[ChrisGar15]

Highly likely that Jerry Buss tried to do just that. He had just as good of chance as Jerry West would have. It was too late at that point. Their relationship was too fractured and the front office had to make a choice.

I was just quoting what West said. I think he would know the situation and likelihood of fixing it better than us.

 

[lakersrule]

Exactly. Shaq forced his way out. The Lakers were left with the choice of trading him for whatever they could get or watch him leave for nothing.

Something folks seem to forget or ignore is that Shaq says that he didn't leave because of Kobe, he left because of money. Shaq was older, starting to decline and refused to do things like show up to camp in shape or have injury issues taken care of in the off-season. Dr. Buss only wanted to give one of them a max deal and chose the younger guy who stayed in shape year round and took care of health issues in the off-season so that he would be ready to go for camp. Shaq also wanted a max deal.

The final straw came when Shaq dunked in a pre-season game, looked at Dr. Buss who was in the stands and screamed "You gonna pay me now?"

I'm not saying Shaq and Kobe were best friends or anything, but according to Shaq, they would have worked it out. Shaq has also said that he should have listened to Kobe when Kobe told him to stay in shape in the off-season.

I think Shaq is partly playing nice there. I think Kobe was certainly a contributing factor. Kobe in a sense forced the action when considering signing with the Clippers. Phil Jackson wasn't brought back in order to appease Kobe (although some contend that Phil wasn't resigning anyway). That pissed Shaq off.

There were many dynamics in play at the time. Ultimately one of them had to go. The young stud guard or the aging center. The correct decision was made.

 

[lakersrule]

I was just quoting what West said. I think he would know the situation and likelihood of fixing it better than us.

I'm not disagreeing. Perhaps the feud never gets to the point it was with West still in the front office. He may have been able to smooth over what Buss and Phil couldn't.

I have his book sitting on a bookshelf waiting to be read. I'm sure it is an interesting read. I should put it at the top of the queue after I read Bill Walton's new book.

 

[trojanfan12]

I think Shaq is partly playing nice there. I think Kobe was certainly a contributing factor. Kobe in a sense forced the action when considering signing with the Clippers. Phil Jackson wasn't brought back in order to appease Kobe (although some contend that Phil wasn't resigning anyway). That pissed Shaq off.

There were many dynamics in play at the time. Ultimately one of them had to go. The young stud guard or the aging center. The correct decision was made.

Oh, I'm sure that the feud with Kobe made Shaq's decision to force a trade a little easier. It was a real feud, not some overblown minor disagreement. If he and Kobe got along like he and Wade did or if he had let Kobe take the lead like he did with Wade in Miami (or like an aging Kareem did with Magic), he probably doesn't push so hard to leave.

End of the day, it all worked out pretty well for both of them. Shaq got another ring and was a big reason for the Heat's first title. Kobe and the Lakers ended up getting 2 more titles.

 

[ChrisGar15]

I'm not disagreeing. Perhaps the feud never gets to the point it was with West still in the front office. He may have been able to smooth over what Buss and Phil couldn't.

I have his book sitting on a bookshelf waiting to be read. I'm sure it is an interesting read. I should put it at the top of the queue after I read Bill Walton's new book.

Jerry is very open in the book. He has had issues in his life.

Post someplace how Walton's book is. I still find it interesting that he was one of the most anti-media jerks while he was playing -- now he is very open & interesting. (not sure why -- maybe the book talks about it)

 

[Mecca of the “B” Team]

Other than mentioning his son, my post had nothing to do with the Lakers front office or their perceived history with advanced analytics. I wouldn't expect Wiggy to know much about Ryan West or another sharp young man in the organization; Joey Buss. Both embrace the modern and learned from the some of the best.

Jerry West is a genius at talent evaluation. I don't think that can be denied. He's not much for analytics though....

“All of the analytical guys that have started to play a big role in it, and frankly, I’m not a big analytical person,” West told Sirius XM on Friday. “Give me the best players, and give me a great coach, and we’ll beat these analytically-based organizations all the time.

“And I know they have their role. I know they have their place in basketball. But I see a lot of teams that follow that line, and I don’t see a lot of success there.

“I’m not knocking analytical people at all. But just give me the best players, and give me the best competitors, and I will show you a team that has a great chance to win every year.”

Yeah, .......troll, troll, troll your boat.....

Same ole song from my man, Wiggy.

 

[LAD]

A Boston/Miami first round would be intersting- though I think Boston would win and I would once again be deprived of watching the Cavs face the Heat because of Miami bowing out early....but we shall see!

What would be even more interesting is if Miami & Cleveland meet up in the 2nd round. I'm hoping this happens.

 

[LAD]

yah because he doesnt have to do EVERYTHING like in Miami

LeBron was the Heats LEADING REBOUNDER for the majority of the time he was there, lol....its why he left...he was sick of being the only guy with any physicality on that team..sick of having to carry the load while Dwade sat out babying his knees and hamstrings...now TT and Love do the rebounding- LeBron gets to do what he likes to do- play on the perimeter and save himself.

honestly I have not seen those chase down blocks and crazy slams for a while now....I have a feeling LeBron is ready to just explode on these playoffs once they start and hes ready!


LESS THAN A MONTH AWAY!! FINALLY!!!!!!!!!

I'm sorry what team in the Finals were you watching last season? He LITERALLY had to do everything because 2/3 of his big 3 are injury prone. And, when he doesn't play they have a losing record. Just stop talking outta the side of your neck.

 

[LAD]

He might be elevated by Cleveland fans above all others, but other fan bases wouldn't give a fuck.
Thing is, and deny it as much as you want, James doesn't give a shit about "The Land".
He cares about himself and he is loyal to his real friends.
Obviously I knew the video I posted last night was from last year, but that doesn't change the fact that James was caught saying on a live mic that if the Cavs don't win, he'll quickly move on to his next best (in his mind) destination. And, that was after being there only a few months.

Add to that his statement last month about wanting to play with CP3, Wade & Melo & the fact he'd take a pay cut to make it happen are supporting facts to this theory.

 

[LAD]

We've said people of Ohio would care, and nobody else would.
Why would we/ they?

Winning one more title wouldn't exactly erase his losing record when making it to the finals so....

 

[LAD]

Sorry, gordon. But titles aren't the end all be all of the GOAT argument - but they're the most important factor. There have been a number of MVP races that ended in controversy - Lebron should've won it over Rose in 2010, but the media liked the Derrick Rose story and Lebron was dealing with the after math of the decision. Dwayne Wade had his best year in 2008 where he posted a better statistical year than Lebron, yet Lebron won the MVP. Hell, Jordan got screwed out of the MVP in '93, so the league MVP argument is tired and flawed.

Also, constantly bringing up role players like Kerr and Horry is lame and lazy. They both were the greatest role players and had the luxury of playing with some all-time greats. Wiggy's lame ass jokes that the ring argument means that Horry is greater than Barkley - NO. Horry's classified as a role player, Barkley an all-star. The reason why you don't see Barkley compared to Duncan, Jordan, Bird, Kareem, etc. is because he's missing something those guys have - RINGS!

Let's not forget about Kobe being over looked for MVPs because of the r*pe allegations. That was during the prime of his career...he should have more than 1 league MVP given his resume.

 

[LAD]

Maybe I am looking at it wrong.

As far as Bron and Magic, I will likely never rank Bron ahead of him because he was my favorite player of all time.

But, Jordan.......?

Well, John Elway went to 3 Super Bowls in 4 years, and ended up winning 2 rings later in his career.

Would you ever rank him above Montana?

Yes, it's a hell of a stretch for Bron.

But, he will have to win 8 to be in the Jordan Conversation.

I think another factor is how/when titles are won. MJ had a three-peat, TWICE. Kobe had a three peat once and a back to back. Magic had only on repeat. Duncan has never been able to repeat.

 

[LAD]

View attachment 102301
Report: Jerry West threatened to resign if Warriors traded Klay Thompson for Kevin Love

Last summer, the Golden State Warriors were in the mix to get Kevin Love out of Minnesota, but Flip Saunders would not back off his asking price — Klay Thompson. A lot of people (myself admittedly included) thought they should pull the trigger.

They didn’t. It was the right move.

Thompson blossomed this season under Steve Kerr, who gave him added responsibilities. Meanwhile the Warriors found the versatile four they needed in Draymond Green.

Who was maybe the most vocal about keeping their shooting guard? Arguably the best shooting guard of all time — Jerry West. The part owner and consultant to the team was ready to walk if ownership pulled the trigger on the deal, reports Chris Ballard in a brilliant piece for Sports Illustrated (his work is almost always must read).

Perhaps West’s biggest contribution came last summer, though, when, along with Kerr, he adamantly opposed a trade centered around Thompson and Love. West argued that trading Thompson would be an enormous mistake. The Warriors were built on defense and Love, while a skilled offensive player, was a subpar defender. What’s more, West was certain Thompson would continue to improve, giving the Warriors a potential Hall of Fame backcourt for the next decade.

West felt so strongly that, according to one person close to the negotiations, he threatened to resign if the team made the trade. Chances are, West wouldn’t have actually done it—that’s just the way he talks—but when the most successful talent evaluator in league history feels that adamantly about something, it’s probably worth listening.

West tends to feel strongly about everything. And he’s right far more often than he’s wrong.

When we were having this discussion and I told you they wouldn't pull the trigger I knew it was because West was smarter than that. His ability to identify talent in players so early in their careers (before they've really even finished developing) is AMAZING.

 

[LAD]

Golden State will be just fine. They aren't going to be worn down. These are elite athletes in their primes and don't have near the mileage that Lebron does. What evidence have you seen that Golden State is wearing down?

None-especially when we look back over this season and see that Curry has sat an alarming number times in the 4th quarter of games. ENTIRE 4th quarters.

On the flip side I wonder what would happen if LBJ sits out an entire 4th quarter...

 

[LAD]

Just heard news from a guy that knows people within dubs org. Said that they will look to replace barnes with Parsons or atleast will want to get a "meet" with him if barnes is asking for to much money. That would be a interesting add, he's much better than Barnes IMO

Oh yes, saw this coming after he turned down the extension and then his game began to regress after his injury. But, can't say that I'm mad about it. Right now he's the weakest link in that lineup.