2014 Offseason Plans Thread Pt2

[Justinkm83]

I'm telling you ogando in the rotation is not an afterthought. I'm betting they're planning on him being the #3 or #4 right now.

I think you're exactly right. I think right now it sets up as Yu, Matt, Ogando, Perez

 

[Justinkm83]

Lannan

Mets already signed him

 

[donaldson79]

You may be right but if Ogando ends up in the pen that that is a good thing because it means Harrison and Colby are back in form and Tepesch improved. I would not have a problem with that.

IMO to count on Harrison to open the season healthy and 100% of what he was the previous 2 years (2011-12) is too optimistic. It may take him 2 months or so to right his ship completely.

I don't see any way, barring injury, that Ogando is not only starting, but no less than our #3 starter to begin the year.

Hope is, we sign someone, damn near anyone, to add some depth to the competition for our back end starters. Again, to count on a severely injuried Harrison, and Lewis, and a fringe pitcher like Tepesch to be starters and key contributors is a mistake.

 

[Broseidon]

Mets already signed him

Well...shit

 

[WastinSomeTime]

IMO to count on Harrison to open the season healthy and 100% of what he was the previous 2 years (2011-12) is too optimistic. It may take him 2 months or so to right his ship completely.

I don't see any way, barring injury, that Ogando is not only starting, but no less than our #3 starter to begin the year.

Hope is, we sign someone, damn near anyone, to add some depth to the competition for our back end starters. Again, to count on a severely injuried Harrison, and Lewis, and a fringe pitcher like Tepesch to be starters and key contributors is a mistake.

I didn't say any of that. I said if Ogando ended up in the pen then it means it did happen that Harrison and Lewis were back in form and Tepesch who I like improved and that is a good thing. But I am well aware that is asking a lot. By the way, I do not mind counting on Tepesch as our #5 starter.

 

[romeo212000]

he is more vital in the pen because of his inability to stay healthy

Not true. In the pen for an entire year he might pitch 70 innings, even if he stays healthy all year. Even if he spends some time on the DL as a starter he'll pitch far more innings unless he completely breaks down at the beginning of tge season. The innings he provides as a starter, even if he has a DL stint are far more valuable than having him in the pen.

 

[DT LUNA]

I didn't say any of that. I said if Ogando ended up in the pen then it means it did happen that Harrison and Lewis were back in form and Tepesch who I like improved and that is a good thing. But I am well aware that is asking a lot. By the way, I do not mind counting on Tepesch as our #5 starter.

I agree with you on Tepesch at #5. I questioned Harry being ready sometime back and was assured he was healthy and in good shape at that time. Don't remember who but how would anyone know til he is on the mound and pitching? He has to be tested and that won't be long. Lewis is invited to ST so nothing for sure there but time will tell us all a lot more. The beauty in Ogando is he will fit nicely wherever.

 

[scotsman1948]

Not true. In the pen for an entire year he might pitch 70 innings, even if he stays healthy all year. Even if he spends some time on the DL as a starter he'll pitch far more innings unless he completely breaks down at the beginning of tge season. The innings he provides as a starter, even if he has a DL stint are far more valuable than having him in the pen.

don't agree having him healthy and in the pen all season serves the team better

 

[donaldson79]

Originally Posted by WastinSomeTime View Post
Of course the ideal situation with Holland out would be for Harrison to look sharp and Colby and Tepesch win the other spots in ST and Ogando then is able to pitch out of the pen. But if any of those 3 do not work out then Ogando is the most likely candidate. But the problem with that is it just seems like he will end back up on the DL based upon past experiences.

I'm sincerely not taking issue with your statement (s). But I am uncomfortable with anyone thinking Harrison will not miss a beat after not facing MLB hitters for a year, and to believe Colby will come back after not even being competitive for well over a year is just too optimistic.

But, as strange as it may seem, I am semi comfortable with Tepesch at # 5. The five hole may end up being almost a rotation within the rotation if all doesn't go well.

 

[romeo212000]

don't agree having him healthy and in the pen all season serves the team better

Let's see. 70 innings vs 150 innings. Yeah, you got this one wrong.

 

[donaldson79]

don't agree having him healthy and in the pen all season serves the team better

This isn't a what if question, but a reality based assessment....we need five ST pitchers and Ogando is one of the 5 right now. No doubt about this IMO.

Don't get me wrong, I'd love it if Matty hit the ground running - so to speak - and Colby (one of my favorites) looked like the Coby of the earlier years. And I do have a little faith that Tep has learned/stronger, etc and the # 5 spot may be is in decent hands too.

And do keep in mind, Ogando wants to start. It's tough for the organization not to try to accommodate his personal goals when today his and our's meet in the middle.

 

[WastinSomeTime]

Originally Posted by WastinSomeTime View Post
Of course the ideal situation with Holland out would be for Harrison to look sharp and Colby and Tepesch win the other spots in ST and Ogando then is able to pitch out of the pen. But if any of those 3 do not work out then Ogando is the most likely candidate. But the problem with that is it just seems like he will end back up on the DL based upon past experiences.

I'm sincerely not taking issue with your statement (s). But I am uncomfortable with anyone thinking Harrison will not miss a beat after not facing MLB hitters for a year, and to believe Colby will come back after not even being competitive for well over a year is just too optimistic.

But, as strange as it may seem, I am semi comfortable with Tepesch at # 5. The five hole may end up being almost a rotation within the rotation if all doesn't go well.

Definitely agree it would be optimistic but it sure would be nice. Can't wait for ST to start and seeing what we have.

 

[lainey12]

Well ... since you bring it up ... why did YT get the start in Game 3 ... why was Pujols pitched to and thereby given the opportunity to hit 3 HRs in Game 3 after TEX took Game 2 in STL ... and most importantly why was Endy Chavez on the bench leaving Cruz in the OF in the bottom of the 9th in Game 6?

Because you can't take Cruz out of the lineup, it's too risky if the game gets tied up, or you lose the lead.
I've been through this with Romeo before, Hamilton was hurt far worse (surgery immediately after that Series) than Cruz and not hitting as well throughout the playoffs as Cruz, but you don't pull him out of the line-up either, because they're too good...and they were game-changers

I'm sure you realize that alot of good players (any team) are frequently banged up in the Series and they rarely get pulled. And Hamilton hitting that HR that should have won the Series is a PERFECT example of why you keep hitters of that caliber in the game. He had adjusted his swing a little, you could see it...and it worked, because he's good (or he was)... players can adjust for being banged up when they're elite hitters

As far as I'm concerned, I considered it a pitching failure.... I think we need to move on from Wash, and probably will if we miss again
But I don't blame Wash for that Series, and I certainly don't blame him for keeping Cruz in.

 

[Justinkm83]

don't agree having him healthy and in the pen all season serves the team better

That's just not true. Especially with how thin we're now.

 

[lainey12]

I agree with you on Tepesch at #5. I questioned Harry being ready sometime back and was assured he was healthy and in good shape at that time. Don't remember who but how would anyone know til he is on the mound and pitching? He has to be tested and that won't be long. Lewis is invited to ST so nothing for sure there but time will tell us all a lot more. The beauty in Ogando is he will fit nicely wherever.

Harrison is apparently throwing very well off the mound at 80%, according to Maddux and Sullivan reported it in a recent article.

edit- I misunderstood your question, or rather it wasn't a question. No, we don't know until he goes live, but I was really encouraged by this report. Only January, off the mound...80%, all good news

 

[donaldson79]

That's just not true. Especially with how thin we're now.

.........folks.....somebody has got to get us a bunch of innings. Starting innings I'm speaking of.

 

[donaldson79]

Harrison is apparently throwing very well off the mound at 80%, according to Maddux and Sullivan reported it in a recent article.

edit- I misunderstood your question, or rather it wasn't a question. No, we don't know until he goes live, but I was really encouraged by this report. Only January, off the mound...80%, all good news

Honestly....wasn't that some kind of good news?

Maybe some people forget what a hoss he was for 2 seasons before the injury. And a damn good guy too.

 

[lainey12]

That's just not true. Especially with how thin we're now.

I'd prefer him in the pen, but I agree...he's got to start
fingers crossed, ya know
I doubt his durabilty, but if he's effective and can get us through a few months, then things look better

 

[lainey12]

Honestly....wasn't that some kind of good news?

Maybe some people forget what a hoss he was for 2 seasons before the injury. And a damn good guy too.

yes, to me it was very good news...preaching to the choir, I think we all love Harry

 

[Windingmywatch]

Thanks for finding it. Hey I was wrong and I'll eat my crow. All is good.

What an amazing things ... folks on a MLB chat board being accountable for their mistakes.

Whatever happened to the good old days when Larry Legend was never wrong?