10,000 Posts for a Flyers Cup in 2019

[awaz]

Schwartz - 5.35M through 2021 / 26 years old / 59 points in 62 games last year (78pt pace)
Schenn - 5.125M through 2020 / 27 years old / 70pts in 82 games last year

Giroux - 8.25M through 2022 / 30 years old / 102pts in 82 games last year

If you're the Blues, do you make that deal?

148 points (pace) out of 10.4M in cap space, two guys in the middle of their prime
or
102 points out of 8.25M in cap space, one guy who is at the tail end of his prime

If you can convince the Blues to do that deal, I'm on board, but I think you're going to find it tough sledding.

Maybe you add to it, draft picks, prospects, maybe there is something there. But you have to keep in mind you've got about $2M in cap space to work with and the Blues are trying to win now, which would be even clearer trading two guys in their mid 20s for a 30 year old star.

So given that, I don't think a 1st round pick is of any interest to them, nor are any of the guys in juniors or college. So you're probably looking at Weal, Laughton, Patrick, Lindblom, Konecny, Provorov, or Sanheim (< $2M guys). Or the highest profile Lehigh Valley guy that might help them, Myers.

I could be wrong, but I'm guessing Weal doesn't move the needle for them. Patrick, Konecny, and Provorov are non-starters I expect. So, my guess is, you're looking at Giroux + [Laughton or Lindblom or Sanheim or Myers] for Schenn and Schwartz. At that point, I don't think the Flyers are much better off, unless its Myers, but that's a lot to give up. Top pair potential RHD don't grow on trees.

 

[awaz]

I'm not trying to be a Debbie downer or poke holes in every theory, but there are reasons guys like Giroux, Crosby, MacKinnon, Bergeron, Ovechkin etc don't get traded at this point in their career. Matching money and on-ice value at that level is very difficult. And if it you mess it up, you're setting your franchise back years or even decades.

 

[lasgop8]

I'm not trying to be a Debbie downer or poke holes in every theory, but there are reasons guys like Giroux, Crosby, MacKinnon, Bergeron, Ovechkin etc don't get traded at this point in their career. Matching money and on-ice value at that level is very difficult. And if it you mess it up, you're setting your franchise back years or even decades.

So lets just stay the course and be legit 1st round and out or miss the playoffs team. Just what the fans want to live through.

 

[JBM73]

Winning is as much about chemistry as it is about talent, both with each other as well as with a coaches system. Gee-Couts-Konecny have chemistry. Leave it alone. Lindblom-Patrick-Jake have shown significant flashes of chemistry. Go with it. The 3rd and 4th lines are a train wreck and that’s where the changes are needed. Trade one of JVR or Simmonds. Move any of the other guys for a PK specialist or two. Get a real 3C. Do something to shake up the bottom 6 mix. Move forward prospects if needed.

On D, I honestly don’t make any changes since MacD is untradeable. Go with Provy, Ghost, Sanheim, Gudas and Hägg. They shown flashes of chemistry, we just need to figure out what the heck is wrong with Provy. Make sure Myers gets some NHL experience this year and hope Morin gets healthy for next season.

In goal, if a good deal pops up take it, otherwise you’re looking to shore this up in the offseason. Make sure Lyon and Stolarz get some NHL games so we can shit or get off the pot with them. Elliot, Neuvy and Pickard will all be gone.

I can’t imagine the new GM keeps Hak.

 

[Chris p Bacon]

To me though, they wouldn't have hired Hextall and let him have the helm for 5 years just to blow up the core now. The fact that they fired Hextall mid-season means they bought in and expected this year to be a significant step forward. It wasn't, Hextall wasn't willing to change, so they fired him. They're going to ride or die with this core at least this season.

I expect his firing to result in a big shakeup, but I don't see it being a Giroux trade or even a Voracek trade. I expect it to be more along the lines of trading one of the big name prospects (Farabee, Frost, Myers) and some "futures" (1st/2nd round picks) for NHL help. Likely a goaltender, back up plan would be a 3C that can kill penalties.

I also expect the coaching staff to be let go when the new GM is brought in and can hire in his guys.

I would be SHOCKED, if they kept the coaching staff or traded away the core. If they were content with a 'rebuilding' type season, they would've just been patient with Hextall.

The problem with Hextall is, while he was building the farm team etc, he wasn't doing anything for the now.Fans or players don't want to wait around 5-10 years for some master plan that may or may not pan out. He did absolutely 0 when it came to any type of real free agency among goalies. Come on, really, Elliott was the best he could come up with? Also he passed on some players we've discussed where we all did a head scratch or two, Players that could have really helped bolster this team now. So far all his farm players look good on paper but how many of them will pan out to be real stars or dominate players. He was betting too much on the future IMO instead of trying to let the guys here now feel like he wanted them to win.

 

[awaz]

So lets just stay the course and be legit 1st round and out or miss the playoffs team. Just what the fans want to live through.

Not at all what I’m saying. I’m saying moving Giroux is difficult and a step back this season. If you want to do that, do it. I can see why people want to.

You can improve the team in other ways. They’re loaded with young players, prospects, picks, and cap space. That’s all very valuable to teams, use it to improve the on ice product this season. Look for goalies, PKers, and teams that are feeling the same heat the flyers are and take advantage of them. LA is a train wreck right now, what can you essentially steal from them? They’re old, expensive, and have nothing in the pipeline. If they’re not, they should be looking to blow it up right now. What can you get from them with our loaded pipeline?

 

[JBM73]

I’ll take Hextall’s asset management with a dash of Holmgren’s risky/ballsy trades, please.

 

[mall3013]

I’ll take Hextall’s asset management with a dash of Holmgren’s risky/ballsy trades, please.

Homer wouldn't even blink about the offer sheet for Nylander. I still would love for this to happen.

 

[wbon22]

Personally, I am not looking to deal G, or Cooter, I postulated on the thought of G asking to be moved because of recent events...which seems unlikely from his interviews.

Really the priorities need to be a real goalie, then a center and then assess as you go. Don't trade the store to get these two parts. But don't try to get it done on the cheap either. Try to get Anderson out of Ottawa, maybe try Vecchione as the 3rd line center...but do something.

 

[awaz]

I’ll take Hextall’s asset management with a dash of Holmgren’s risky/ballsy trades, please.

I thought about ‘what if it’s Holmgren even temporarily’ a lot today. Seriously with this ammo, he’d go crazy. Cap space. Assets. I could see him adding two major pieces in short order.

Really curious to see what they have to say in the press conference tomorrow.

 

[FlyerFinFan]

I thought about ‘what if it’s Holmgren even temporarily’ a lot today. Seriously with this ammo, he’d go crazy. Cap space. Assets. I could see him adding two major pieces in short order.

Really curious to see what they have to say in the press conference tomorrow.

Philosophical differences...sounds like Hexy didn't want to mortgage the future for the present. Homer was the exact opposite. Homer failed hard to say if Hexy would have but they feel like they are close. I just hope that they don't blow it up because then we will be waiting longer than Hexys plan. Just my opinion...a few tweaks would be ok but shorten any dynasty ideas although that may be impossible these days.

 

[Psych-Ward]

So from what I've read and seen on Twitter, this all boils down to Carter Hart and Hexy's goalie signings.

It was stated that Holmgren gave Hexy an open checkbook to sign any free agent he could. Needing goalies Hexy signed Elliott and Pickard.....well we've all seen how that's went over. Then Holmgren told Hexy that if Carter Hart is the future, bring him up now. Hexy believing in his system and knowing Hart isn't ready didn't bring him up. So now that the Flyers attendance is down and revenue is down a couple million from last year, they pulled the plug on Hexy. Holmgren wants a playoff team now. Something was also stated Holmgren doesn't want to move any of the talent they have, but he does want one or two guys to kick it up a notch, and he wants a goalie that's worth a shit. Names were dropped for the chopping block on Twitter, and they want to clean house on goalies......NO ONE ELSE, just the goalies.

Now something I did not know and leaves me to wonder, Hexy picked Hakstol because he's good with young talent AND because Hakstol coached Hexy's kid Brett at North Dakota.....so how long does Hakstol have????

Dean Lombardi's name has come up often to replace Hexy.

But basically Hexy was remaining patient to the system and Holmgren's patience ran out...
Especially since they are losing money like crazy.

 

[Chris p Bacon]

So from what I've read and seen on Twitter, this all boils down to Carter Hart and Hexy's goalie signings.

It was stated that Holmgren gave Hexy an open checkbook to sign any free agent he could. Needing goalies Hexy signed Elliott and Pickard.....well we've all seen how that's went over. Then Holmgren told Hexy that if Carter Hart is the future, bring him up now. Hexy believing in his system and knowing Hart isn't ready didn't bring him up. So now that the Flyers attendance is down and revenue is down a couple million from last year, they pulled the plug on Hexy. Holmgren wants a playoff team now. Something was also stated Holmgren doesn't want to move any of the talent they have, but he does want one or two guys to kick it up a notch, and he wants a goalie that's worth a shit. Names were dropped for the chopping block on Twitter, and they want to clean house on goalies......NO ONE ELSE, just the goalies.

Now something I did not know and leaves me to wonder, Hexy picked Hakstol because he's good with young talent AND because Hakstol coached Hexy's kid Brett at North Dakota.....so how long does Hakstol have????

Dean Lombardi's name has come up often to replace Hexy.

But basically Hexy was remaining patient to the system and Holmgren's patience ran out...
Especially since they are losing money like crazy.

Hexy lost sight of the here and now, building a system is good but players aren't going to want to wait on a 5 year plan to compete. Hexy blew on free agency last summer and now he'spaying the price. Next uneventful loss will be Hakstols last.

 

[Psych-Ward]

Hexy lost sight of the here and now, building a system is good but players aren't going to want to wait on a 5 year plan to compete. Hexy blew on free agency last summer and now he'spaying the price. Next uneventful loss will be Hakstols last.

I agree.
When the president of a company gives you an open check book to sign some heavy hitters, and all you do is get some retread players and a couple of mediocre at best goalies.......WTF where you thinking?
I agree with Hexy in the fact of not rushing Carter Hart, but when you go on the market and purchase a couple of duds....what did you think would happen.

Sad thing is Hexy will get in someplace else, and restock someone else's farm system.
It's a double edge sword.

 

[JBM73]

According to Jay Greenberg, Hextall created a front office environment that increasingly became Hextall’s way or no way, cutting everyone else out of the decision making process. If true, good riddance. I work in a similar environment and am trying to get out, as I know all about the toxic culture this creates.

We’ll never know the whole truth. What I do know is that Hextall needed to do SOMETHING and instead sat back continuing to do nothing, paralyzed by his plan that was right at the time of hire but needed to begin evolving. If they bring up Carter Hart now I’m done with this team though.

 

[awaz]

According to Jay Greenberg, Hextall created a front office environment that increasingly became Hextall’s way or no way, cutting everyone else out of the decision making process. If true, good riddance. I work in a similar environment and am trying to get out, as I know all about the toxic culture this creates.

We’ll never know the whole truth. What I do know is that Hextall needed to do SOMETHING and instead sat back continuing to do nothing, paralyzed by his plan that was right at the time of hire but needed to begin evolving. If they bring up Carter Hart now I’m done with this team though.

Ya that sounds bad. But I agree, he was definitely right on Hart. He may have been the best goalie in camp, but he's struggling in just the AHL. He wouldn't have saved them in the NHL this season.

Hextall gambled on Elliot being able to regain his health and for Neuvirth to get it together. It was a high risk gamble and he lost. Then it seems like he refused to do anything about it, and got the axe for it.

 

[lasgop8]

According to the posts i've just read most on here would like to keep the core. All that tells me is you guys are OK with being a first round out or miss the playoffs team. As soon as Haks is fired this core has gone through 4 coaches and a few GM's and still we are in the same situation we have been in since this core was put together years ago. Maybe after we go through a few more coaches it will be realized its not the hierarchy in this organization that has us as a middling team for years but rather its the core.

 

[lasgop8]

https://www.yahoo.com/sports/firing-ron-hextall-wasnt-dave-211004810.html

 

[JBM73]

According to the posts i've just read most on here would like to keep the core. All that tells me is you guys are OK with being a first round out or miss the playoffs team. As soon as Haks is fired this core has gone through 4 coaches and a few GM's and still we are in the same situation we have been in since this core was put together years ago. Maybe after we go through a few more coaches it will be realized its not the hierarchy in this organization that has us as a middling team for years but rather its the core.

So says the guy who was pushing hard to trade Couturier just 2 seasons ago, and now lists him as the only guy to keep.

 

[lasgop8]

So says the guy who was pushing hard to trade Couturier just 2 seasons ago, and now lists him as the only guy to keep.

C'mon please, Couts is a part of the core and if you read my post the CORE is the problem not the 4 coaches or the GM's. So keep your core and have fun with a middling team as you prefer.