Series Thread: 1) Boston Celtics vs 8) Chicago Bulls

[gordontrue]

So how does Paul George win an award this year?

He hasn't. And he won't.

 

[SJ76]

He hasn't. And he won't.

And either will Lebron.


But I like your excuse. I guess Lebron needs more superstars on his team so he can be on the all NBA defensive team

 

[gordontrue]

Look. We all know when Lebron wants to flip the switch on offense or defense, he's a monster. But why not bring it consistently your whole career? All season?

Different era? Cramps? Not enough superstars on the team?

First, you tell me who has played the number of games he has played (reg season & playoff) while bringing consistent balls-to-the-wall defense non-stop... then we can discuss it.

Its probably not possible. LeBron's consistency in all areas of the game is getting close to unprecedented levels, and a big part of how he's able to do it likely comes down to the fact that he knows when to throttle back.

 

[trojanfan12]

I dont blame LeBron for not going 1000% every single game.

I mean- he is 32 and has already played more games than Jordan did in his entire career. His work load has been immense- and if not for his freak athleticism and unparalleled work ethic along with scientific advances he might have broke down by now- but knock on wood- he has never suffered a major injury in his entire career.

Right now he has 5 Defensive First teams, and 1 defensive 2nd team. I mean- thats not exactly chopped liver.

10 all NBA First Teams, and 2 All NBA 2nd teams --- thats more All NBA teams than Jordan already.-- and of course add an 11th first team this year

I don't think that the problem is that Lebron doesn't go 1000% or even 100% all of the time. As you point out, he's 32 years old and has a ton of mileage on him. As I've said before, people always talk about how much mileage Kobe put on his body and Lebron has more mileage on him now than Kobe did at the same age.

The problem that I see is that Lebron is pretty blatant about not going 100%, resting and has even come out and said he doesn't care about the regular season (which I'm sure the league loved).

And before you get your Lebron panties all in a twist, I don't necessarily have a problem with any of those things. His first priority should be making sure he's as close to 100% as possible for the playoffs.

What I'm saying is that he needs to stfu and not say things like he doesn't care about the regular season or make it so obvious that he's not giving his best effort on defense. The other millionaires who are on the court with him might understand. But the "thousandaires" who are spending hundreds of dollars to see him play (and who made him a millionaire) don't want to hear/see that stuff.

 

[SJ76]

First, you tell me who has played the number of games he has played (reg season & playoff) while bringing consistent balls-to-the-wall defense non-stop... then we can discuss it.

Its probably not possible. LeBron's consistency in all areas of the game is getting close to unprecedented levels, and a big part of how he's able to do it likely comes down to the fact that he knows when to throttle back.

"throttle back"




Due to cramps I imagine? Poor guy has played too many games so he needs more superstars around him to help and he doesn't have to play D all the time.


Got it

 

[gordontrue]

And either will Lebron.


But I like your excuse. I guess Lebron needs more superstars on his team so he can be on the all NBA defensive team

Actually, most predictions I've seen have LeBron making the all-defense teams this season. We'll see.

It won't change my opinion either way on whether LeBron is a top defensive player or not. I doubt it will change your mind either, despite your claims that these selections are indicative of who are the best defensive players.

 

[gordontrue]

"throttle back"




Due to cramps I imagine? Poor guy has played too many games so he needs more superstars around him to help and he doesn't have to play D all the time.


Got it

Yeah, you clearly didn't get it. But I don't care.

And you're dodging the question.

 

[SJ76]

Actually, most predictions I've seen have LeBron making the all-defense teams this season. We'll see.

It won't change my opinion either way on whether LeBron is a top defensive player or not. I doubt it will change your mind either, despite your claims that these selections are indicative of who are the best defensive players.

He's a monster when he wants to be. I'm just not used to saying great player and plays D when they feel like it. Didn't have to worry about that back when men played bball.

 

[trojanfan12]

First, you tell me who has played the number of games he has played (reg season & playoff) while bringing consistent balls-to-the-wall defense non-stop... then we can discuss it.

Its probably not possible. LeBron's consistency in all areas of the game is getting close to unprecedented levels, and a big part of how he's able to do it likely comes down to the fact that he knows when to throttle back.

You actually can do just that. Kobe still gave pretty consistent defensive effort later in his career as did MJ among others. The difference is, later in their careers, they weren't guarding the opponents best player all game long anymore. They picked their spots. Spending most of the game guarding a lesser player, while still giving their best effort, left them with the energy to guard the opponents best player when necessary.

 

[SJ76]

Kwahi Leonard will make 1st team all D
Giannis Antetokounmpo will make the 2nd team.

 

[gordontrue]

Didn't have to worry about that back when men played bball.

Well to be fair, their parents probably didn't make them walk to school uphill both ways in the snow.

 

[knowyourenemy]

Has Jimmy Butler thrown his teammates under the bus yet for that throwaway inbound pass late in the 4th quarter?

 

[gordontrue]

You actually can do just that. Kobe still gave pretty consistent defensive effort later in his career as did MJ among others. The difference is, later in their careers, they weren't guarding the opponents best player all game long anymore. They picked their spots. Spending most of the game guarding a lesser player, while still giving their best effort, left them with the energy to guard the opponents best player when necessary.

And I don't see a difference between that and what LeBron has been doing. I mean, the guy still shows up on all the leaderboards for blocks, rebounds, and steals.

 

[SJ76]

Yeah, you clearly didn't get it. But I don't care.

And you're dodging the question.

Sure he has alot of mileage on him. Poor guy needs a break I get it. Needs more superstars on his team to play better D so he can win defensive awards. Needs to take plays off, time off, hell the entire regular season.

Probably needs a good asian massage too. We all need those

 

[SJ76]

Has Jimmy Butler thrown his teammates under the bus yet for that throwaway inbound pass late in the 4th quarter?

I think Jimmy is speechless. D Wade looked like he had cement in his shoes last night. Losing Rondo just killed them. Too bad too because defensively they looked really good in those first 2 games. Oh well

 

[gordontrue]

Sure he has alot of mileage on him. Poor guy needs a break I get it. Needs more superstars on his team to play better D so he can win defensive awards. Needs to take plays off, time off, hell the entire regular season.

Probably needs a good asian massage too. We all need those

I never said he needed a break. You're the one who keeps bringing up superstar teammates, that is irrelevant to the discussion, imo.

I don't know whether he needs to take it easy in the reg season or not... but I do think its probably the smart thing to do.

 

[SJ76]

I never said he needed a break. You're the one who keeps bringing up superstar teammates, that is irrelevant to the discussion, imo.

I don't know whether he needs to take it easy in the reg season or not... but I do think its probably the smart thing to do.

You keep saying the individual awards are mostly based on team D. So Lebron obviously needs some help to get on that all NBA team.

Going to switch your tune?

 

[gordontrue]

You keep saying the individual awards are mostly based on team D. So Lebron obviously needs some help to get on that all NBA team.

Going to switch your tune?

No. Why does he need to get onto an all-defensive team? It doesn't matter.

Having more defensive-minded teammates would help his chances at a selection to one of those teams, but it wouldn't mean jack shit in terms of rating his individual defense.

You are the one saying it matters. I'm saying it doesn't matter.

 

[SJ76]

No. Why does he need to get onto an all-defensive team? It doesn't matter.

Having more defensive-minded teammates would help his chances at a selection to one of those teams, but it wouldn't mean jack shit in terms of rating his individual defense.

You are the one saying it matters. I'm saying it doesn't matter.

180 and changing your tune. Nice. I guess he doesn't want to go down as one of the great defensive players of all time if it doesn't matter. He's not even close to what Kobe, MJ, Duncan, KG and Pippen achieved.

 

[trojanfan12]

And I don't see a difference between that and what LeBron has been doing. I mean, the guy still shows up on all the leaderboards for blocks, rebounds, and steals.

Haven't seen any kind of consistent effort out of him. Blocks, rebounds and steals are nice, but they are also easily padded "highlight stats."

What I don't see is Lebron going out and giving 100% effort vs. a lesser player and then taking over against the teams best player when necessary.

Fair or not, he's the Cavs leader and they follow what he does. Imo, if he were giving 100% on defense, the Cavs defense would be much better than what we have seen from them all season.

Case in point, the playoff series they just completed vs. the Pacers. Sure they swept them. But they also gave up 109 points per game and their average margin of victory was 4 points. This was against the #7 seed in a weak conference. If they played anything close to last years defense, they would have destroyed the Pacers and Lebron, Kyrie and Love would have spent 4th quarters on the bench rather than trying to hang on and win.

Compare that to their most likely opponent in the finals, the Warriors. The Warriors gave up an average of 101.5 points per game and their average margin of victory was 18 points. That was with their best player missing 2 of the games.

Is that 100% on Lebron? Of course not. But he is the leader and sets the tone. If he's giving 100% on defense, so will everyone else. He hasn't done that, so neither have they.