Game Day! Bears vs Packers

[beardown07]

good point.

I'm not trying to cherry pick. There are a lot of other examples in this game. But they are illustrative for what separates him from a good QB.

All in all I'd say he played pretty mediocre. He's played better, he's played worse.

I actually think the O line played a really solid game having re-watched this. Not perfect, but all in all pretty solid. Bushrod had a few breakdowns, but I am pretty impressed with Montgomery. Bears also used a lot 2 and 3 TE personnel groups, but they managed to run OK against mostly single high safety defensive alignments. All in all the O line seemed pretty good.

The defensive line, though, yikes. There are some serious problems.

Ya. To the naked eye, it seems GB game-planned to eliminate McPhee. Seems to have worked. I saw a couple of flashes from the rookie, Goldman, but as a whole they never sniffed AR. Their best D was their O in the first half controlling the TOP. In the second half, they were unable to match that, be it thru execution or playcalling, I don't know...just know that the D gave little resistance all day.

 

[cubzzzfanincali]

It seemed like they were attacking the 3 gap on the Bear right side. A lot of time that was Goldman or Sutton. They definitely weren't running McPhee's way much if I could tell.

So as to Cutler, OK, so look at it this way. The Bears had 16 non-penalty red zone snaps. 5 were runs. Of the 11 passes, 3 were what I would call "successful" (one TD and two shorter passes where is was best option). The 4th play was a completion (the pass to Forte I identified above) but it was the wrong target. The other 7 were incompletions. Of those, one was not Jay's fault (Forte dropped). One other one you could maybe chalk up to bad play design (the pass to Royal that was very nearly picked off). The other 5 are totally Cutler. Two of those five was Cutler missing the open target (both times Wilson, also as you mentioned Martellus would have worked on the one). The other 3 were poor throws.

So in the red zone, he was 3-6-2. Not too hot.

The other three plays involving the end/red zone were his 3 longer passes of the day, the long end zone pass to AJ which was inaccurate in the first half, the 20 yd sideline throw to Forte in the 3rd, and the post pattern pass he threw to AJ near the end. The first AJ pass was inaccurate, the pass to Forte was maybe catchable, but he missed a completely wide open Martellus right in the middle of the field (safety bailed to Forte's side because surprise surprise Jay was locked), and the pass to AJ at end was desperate and dangerous (old Jay makes one cameo appearance?).

So, I don't know, I don't think it is cherry-picking.

 

[NCChiFan]

I honestly believe, some of this is due to Jay's belief in his Arm and being able to fit the ball where ever he deems necessary. This has always seemed to be an issue for him and why he prefers wide wingspan type WR's. If a guys covering the left of a wR he thinks he can toss it over the right shoulder or vice versa. If a DB is covering the WR deep, then he throws behind the Wr, etc...

For what it is worth. We all know the frustration with Jay. We all want him to perform better. Maybe Case will figure it out for him and get him to respond to at least running through a progression. It also could be that Case is trying to ease Jay into the new system by focusing on primary receivers to start with .

It can also be an issue with avoiding pass rush by 3 step release the ball... which doesn't give you much time to figure out who's open, who's not and where to go to next. Timing type passes become an issue here as well. Dunno.

I'm like everyone else though. Getting tired of the excuses. Did like how we ran the ball in the first half though. Much much better play calling.

 

[beardown07]

It seemed like they were attacking the 3 gap on the Bear right side. A lot of time that was Goldman or Sutton. They definitely weren't running McPhee's way much if I could tell.

So as to Cutler, OK, so look at it this way. The Bears had 16 non-penalty red zone snaps. 5 were runs. Of the 11 passes, 3 were what I would call "successful" (one TD and two shorter passes where is was best option). The 4th play was a completion (the pass to Forte I identified above) but it was the wrong target. The other 7 were incompletions. Of those, one was not Jay's fault (Forte dropped). One other one you could maybe chalk up to bad play design (the pass to Royal that was very nearly picked off). The other 5 are totally Cutler. Two of those five was Cutler missing the open target (both times Wilson, also as you mentioned Martellus would have worked on the one). The other 3 were poor throws.

So in the red zone, he was 3-6-2. Not too hot.

The other three plays involving the end/red zone were his 3 longer passes of the day, the long end zone pass to AJ which was inaccurate in the first half, the 20 yd sideline throw to Forte in the 3rd, and the post pattern pass he threw to AJ near the end. The first AJ pass was inaccurate, the pass to Forte was maybe catchable, but he missed a completely wide open Martellus right in the middle of the field (safety bailed to Forte's side because surprise surprise Jay was locked), and the pass to AJ at end was desperate and dangerous (old Jay makes one cameo appearance?).

So, I don't know, I don't think it is cherry-picking.

Well, ya gotta give GB some credit at some point as well, but yer the numbers guy, so if you say he sucked, I'll buy it, but all I'm saying is he played well enough to win or have a chance at winning against one of the better teams in the league. And I'll make mention again, if not for his play on 3rd down, the Bears would not have even been in the running.

 

[JoeyTourettes]

damn forgot all-22 isn't available day after yet. Just going through first drive, I this this is an instructive play. Look at this for a second:

View attachment 29215

Cali I think you have a pretty good understanding of football and a willingness to learn. But...I'm going to venture you never played Quarterback.
Like I said before you can freeze and replay just about every play from 2 stories up where you can see the whole field and nitpick the "missed receivers" or perceived time to throw.
And by these pictures I can see your point. You make a convincing argument. AND I'm POSITIVE you can do this for just about EVERY Quarterback at every level and find these types of things and make your argument.

BUT as a former college QB at a high level... there are KEY things we did when we broke down film after a game.
1. We had the script of the plays called. WE knew what the play was designed to do. When you don't have the play calls you're guessing what the QB's read/job Was supposed to be. (this way we can correct it, if needed or praise when needed. Including the receivers.)
2. MOST...even in the NFL... plays are directed at ONE side of the field. The #1 rule is take the first thing they are giving you. (and in the NFL there simply isn't time to get to your 3rd or 4th read) SO yes... the backside TE might be "wide open" BUT the first option was there. Ball out. Good Job.
3. "Locked on Targets" this gets said A LOT!! When the first read is the playside corner- if he squats you go to the over route, if he bails you come to the under route... QB's head and eyes are going directly to that Corner. To a layman that may look like he's "Locked on the target" because that's where the WR's are too...but he's really looking at the corner and the ball is out quick. OR he's watching/waiting for the trailing crossing route to clear a LB.
4. Throw-aways... ball placement... these things may result in an incomplete pass. And freezing a clip or slowing it down can convince people the QB sucked... (example: the blown up screen pass that gets thrown into the ground. OR a play designed for a particular coverage and you don't get the coverage you intended and you throw the ball over out of bounds)
5. Play design: Often, some routes are INTENDED to simply occupy/clear out defenders. They may not even be in the read progression. OR are the 3rd or 4th option. (which you never get to, because A. The ball is out B. You don't have the time. Defenders know this too... They leave zones when they see 3 step drop. knowing the ball is coming out quick...they will cheat to "name" receivers or certain formations.
6. And this is really important: Watching ALL 22... YOU Can see everything. It's great... PLAYING and standing in that pocket. YOU CAN NOT. No matter how tall you are. You simply can't see everything.
You have keys/reads... AND...THE DEFENSE moves too. When you come off your first read- the defense can see that too. LEAVING that backside TE "wide open" because they know you won't/Can't come back to your first read. it just doesn't work that way.
7. Set up plays. OFTEN they run a play out of a certain formation that looks exactly same- quick passes that go to the first read. And THEY TELL the QB. Take either of these in the first half. If it's not there throw it away or run... WITH the intention of showing the SAME thing late in the game and flipping the first read to the deep safety or backside or whatever. With the intention to get the D to cheat to that play they saw earlier. SO You're "bad" play of he was "locked on target" get's a "GREAT JOB" in film, because later in the game it hit big in a different way.

I would love to watch an NFL game tape with the Script and coaches and really hear what they have to say about some of these plays. I'm SURE...they would say Jay (and every QB) missed reads, missed plays etc. BUT I'm also POSITIVE they would compliment on some of these plays that you deem failures. Based on the design, down and distance, previous play... etc.

You have all 22... watch a different game for ONE Qrt... I'm sure you can find the EXACT same things from other QB's. And I'm defending ALL QB's not just Jay for this type of thing.

 

[cubzzzfanincali]

I played QB for about 3 weeks in one season. My arm isn't very strong, they moved me to running back. Wasn't too good at that either! I wasn't bound to be a football player. My ass is good so I'm a pro sitter.

Joey, I've watched a lot of All-22. This is hardly the first. Your "rules" are definitely not hard and fast. Great QBs deviate from the script if they have to. Ours is not a great QB. He committed these mistakes throughout the game, and has done so through his career. C'est la vie, he is who is he is. I do him him credit at playing less carelessly than usual, but he's a pretty flawed qb, and he played a pretty mediocre game.

I get your point about it being easier to see from the sky, but that excuse cannot be used for yesterday's game. One, you can get a pretty good idea of how locked he was by watching his head, and guess what? You know, has it occurred to you that there's a reason "it gets said a lot"? That's because it is true. Two, his protection was pretty good yesterday. Not outstanding, but he was hardly under the constant wall of players we've seen in past Bear O lines. His sight lines look OK to me. But he's not even trying to look elsewhere, it's pretty obvious on many plays. There are a few plays where he is clearly reading around, but it isn't consistent enough. Sure..no QB does it every time. But as a percentage, he is worse than the average in this respect.

Whatever, defend a very mediocre game as something better than it was if you like Joey. He's not the only reason we lost, by a long shot, but he threw in his two cents.

 

[cubzzzfanincali]

BUT as a former college QB at a high level... there are KEY things we did when we broke down film after a game.

By the way, to put it mildly, I laughed my ass off when I read this. Keep 'em coming, MAN.

 

[anotheridiot]

ok last thing I'm gonna say about this play, having just watched the broadcast replay where they show Jeffery one-on-one with Clinton-Dix in the end zone. Im actually NOT upset that Cutler didn't just (as AI would say) toss a throw-it-and-jump-for-it pass in that case. It doesn't excuse totally missing the wide open Bennett and Forte, but it seems like the coaching staff may have at least convinced Cutler to stick to actually-open receivers before he passes. His pass choices on drive 1 were definitely conservative, but on the bright side at least he didn't come close to getting picked off.

Early in the game cutler tried to let Alshon jump for a ball in the end zone, it looked like he got about 6" off the ground backpedaling. At least he knew not to try that anymore.

 

[RP-29]

God it is next-to-impossible to tolerate Troy Aikman. If it wasn't for Phil Simms, he'd be hands-down the worst analyst in all of football television.

Bears fans and Packers fans unite in mutual loathing of Aikman.

 

[noonthirtyjoe]

Cutler is not a good QB between the ears. He just does not have it and never will. He is not terrible, but he is exactly what we see every week. Time to move on from him. I like the guy as a person and hate the way the media portrays him. Did we ruin him? IDK but he is never gonna be a great QB. It's time to move forward,take the hit and get the young guy Fales in there.

 

[leomaz]

Cali can you please do that for the great Andrew Luck

 

[JoeyTourettes]

I played QB for about 3 weeks in one season. My arm isn't very strong, they moved me to running back. Wasn't too good at that either! I wasn't bound to be a football player. My ass is good so I'm a pro sitter.

Joey, I've watched a lot of All-22. This is hardly the first. Your "rules" are definitely not hard and fast. Great QBs deviate from the script if they have to. Ours is not a great QB. He committed these mistakes throughout the game, and has done so through his career. C'est la vie, he is who is he is. I do him him credit at playing less carelessly than usual, but he's a pretty flawed qb, and he played a pretty mediocre game.

I get your point about it being easier to see from the sky, but that excuse cannot be used for yesterday's game. One, you can get a pretty good idea of how locked he was by watching his head, and guess what? You know, has it occurred to you that there's a reason "it gets said a lot"? That's because it is true. Two, his protection was pretty good yesterday. Not outstanding, but he was hardly under the constant wall of players we've seen in past Bear O lines. His sight lines look OK to me. But he's not even trying to look elsewhere, it's pretty obvious on many plays. There are a few plays where he is clearly reading around, but it isn't consistent enough. Sure..no QB does it every time. But as a percentage, he is worse than the average in this respect.

Whatever, defend a very mediocre game as something better than it was if you like Joey. He's not the only reason we lost, by a long shot, but he threw in his two cents.

My rules are pretty standard as it comes to playing the position. Great QB's are GREAT because they DON'T deviate from these rules. Now- superior athletes who can throw harder or run faster. Can get away with skirting some of them, but usually you're not going to last too long if you don't follow. Michael Vick was good for awhile because he could out run people. Didn't make him a good QB. Brett Favre had terrible mechanics, and bad habits, but could fit the ball into bad reads. Making him LOOK like a genius!
You've always been a "I'm smarter than you" football person on these boards so I'm just going to let you keep thinking that. Dude stop that- I want to like you... I keep trying to settle our differences.

What I said about QB play is the truth. You can use your little pictures, to paint whatever biased opinion you want. (Please do watch any other game- and tell me they don't do the same thing) You always think I'm just defending Jay... I'm not, I'm trying to educate you on playing QB.
Jay didn't play great, (& I never said he did) I'm just sick of the nitpicking that you've done after each game with your All-22 magic, It's simple pandering. It's easy and popular to point out "how bad" Jay Cutler is, because you're going to get a bunch of "we agree!" ... Do it with Andrew Luck on the main board and see how that works out.
Or Better yet... Go through your All-22 and pick out what you think are the BEST Jay Cutler plays...and tell me WHY?

I like that you're a dedicated Bears fan, I just wish you would use your powers for good instead of beating the dead horse that is Jay Cutler hatemail.

 

[noonthirtyjoe]

(I like that you're a dedicated Bears fan, I just wish you would use your powers for good instead of beating the dead horse that is Jay Cutler hatemail.) Cali, like most of us here have defended Cutler to no ends. But year after year of bad QB play has taken it's toll on all of us. It's time to face the facts Joey. The rest of us have and you need to also. I think you are a real good poster and I always look for your posts. But it's time to face the truth the rest of us have come too. PS@ Cali my FF team. I must have hit the wrong button and my subs did not switch. Good luck my mistake is your gain.

 

[wood20ks]

It seemed like they were attacking the 3 gap on the Bear right side. A lot of time that was Goldman or Sutton. They definitely weren't running McPhee's way much if I could tell.

So as to Cutler, OK, so look at it this way. The Bears had 16 non-penalty red zone snaps. 5 were runs. Of the 11 passes, 3 were what I would call "successful" (one TD and two shorter passes where is was best option). The 4th play was a completion (the pass to Forte I identified above) but it was the wrong target. The other 7 were incompletions. Of those, one was not Jay's fault (Forte dropped). One other one you could maybe chalk up to bad play design (the pass to Royal that was very nearly picked off). The other 5 are totally Cutler. Two of those five was Cutler missing the open target (both times Wilson, also as you mentioned Martellus would have worked on the one). The other 3 were poor throws.

So in the red zone, he was 3-6-2. Not too hot.

The other three plays involving the end/red zone were his 3 longer passes of the day, the long end zone pass to AJ which was inaccurate in the first half, the 20 yd sideline throw to Forte in the 3rd, and the post pattern pass he threw to AJ near the end. The first AJ pass was inaccurate, the pass to Forte was maybe catchable, but he missed a completely wide open Martellus right in the middle of the field (safety bailed to Forte's side because surprise surprise Jay was locked), and the pass to AJ at end was desperate and dangerous (old Jay makes one cameo appearance?).

So, I don't know, I don't think it is cherry-picking.

Right where it counts......

And what yard line was it where Jay threw that crucial into?.....I think around GBs 30?

And he threw behind Bennett if I remember right....


Jay, yeah he played less than mediocre..... And no Cali, you were not cherry picking..... What you said and I added are crucial plays of the game.

 

[wood20ks]

Well, ya gotta give GB some credit at some point as well, but yer the numbers guy, so if you say he sucked, I'll buy it, but all I'm saying is he played well enough to win or have a chance at winning against one of the better teams in the league. And I'll make mention again, if not for his play on 3rd down, the Bears would not have even been in the running.

Dude...... lmao

I told you he sucked and you don't believe me unless someone else tells you?.... lmao

Ps.....I don't need anyone to tell me who sucks.....I can tell by watching.

 

[wood20ks]

JAY played fine yesterday.......you are just a piss and moan about anything and everything Jay and you know, but of course you will deny it....... what lost us the game is a non existent, undisciplined pass rush...PERIOD........ not Jay and the offense. You are just a whiney little bitch and need to just get over whatever this complex you have with Jay.....maybe call his agent and have a heart to heart with him.....my GOD man your jealousy with Jay is disgusting

I didn't know that ndisciplined pass rush threw a crucial int around GBs 30 and missed four throws inside the 10.

Yes you have to put some blame on Jay.... And he had what,a 27 qb rating?

Yeah no blame there......

 

[wood20ks]

You are a dick

 

[beardown07]

Dude...... lmao

I told you he sucked and you don't believe me unless someone else tells you?.... lmao

Ps.....I don't need anyone to tell me who sucks.....I can tell by watching.

 

[wood20ks]

Oh... look... more Cutler fights. What a shocker.

Wood, AI... Fuck off. Acting as though Cutler was somehow to blame for today is ludicrous.

Joey... Cutler was far from good today, and missed A LOT of throws. Threw a couple into the ground, missed a back shoulder throw down the sideline (to Royal?) Badly. Although, Forte was hit in the hands with that deep ball, which was a touchdown if he just holds on.

All in all, just a meh game. He made some good throws, and made some bad ones. He tried to force a ball late, and it was picked. I mean, you're so short sighted if you really pin a whole loss on him for that. He was fine. For whatever reason, he really isn't what he was in 10 and 11. Just looks like he hears ghosts in the pocket. For whatever reason.

But again... so expected to log on here and see Wood and AI spouting their usual shit. Cutler was not great, but fuck off... it was a fine performance from this team today. There's shit to clean up, but what did you expect? I was absolutely elated at halftime when we were leading.

Especially the Royal throw on 4th down... seriously? He had multiple worse throws. It was a jailbreak blitz... Royal couldn't even finish his route and was covered quite well. Jay had to throw way off balance with multiple defenders in his face.

Fuck off?........ lmao

And no..... He is not the only one to blame, but he's always is part of the blame game.
His welcome has been worn out gere for at least 3 years now.
The only way he can make amends is win us a SB..... And that's not happening anytime soon.

 

[leomaz]

Fuck off?........ lmao

And no..... He is not the only one to blame, but he's always is part of the blame game.
His welcome has been worn out gere for at least 3 years now.
The only way he can make amends is win us a SB..... And that's not happening anytime soon.

No his welcome from you is worn out