First Games of Series/Homestand

[Stokes1931]

I was thinking to myself last night, "Man, the Giants have not done well in the first games of series this year. It seems like they always lose the first game, especially of a home stand."

So I checked the schedule.

First Game of a Series: 19-17

First Game of a Home Stand: 5-4

For a first place team, I would expect better. But the record shows they are better than my perception (slightly). It also shows, I think, the team's resilience. Being what 14 games over .500 while losing the first game of half the series played means they do awfully well coming back from an opening loss.

 

[Stokes1931]

First Game of a Series: 19-22

First Game of a Home Stand: 5-5

The Giants have lost the first game of the series for the last NINE series.

7/22 Brewers
7/26 Philth
7/29 Reds
8/1 DBacks
8/4 Philth
8/8 Pirates
8/12 Marlins
8/15 Braves
8/19 Astros

That is a terrible streak that needs to be broken. It means the Giants are always playing catchup to win a series. Here's hoping they turn this miserable stat around.

And play Belt. Though, after his 4-5 with a HR and 3 RBI's, I suspect Noggin will find some way to bench him.

 

[OzzieGiant]

And play Belt. Though, after his 4-5 with a HR and 3 RBI's, I suspect Noggin will find some way to bench him.

This really proves to me how badly BB has handled this guy. If they simply put him in and let play there is little doubt in my mind he would have hit over 250 with 15+ HR as a minimum, better production then we are getting out of either LF or 1B, and set Belt up for a big 2012 - as it stands now more likely we have set him back and 250 may be all we should expect the first half of next year - really really poor stuff.

 

[SF11704]

Yep - not playing belt is one of my biggest disappointments of this year. I agree with Ozzie on his stats prediction. He just never gave the kid a chance.

Also very disappointed in Torres this year. Not sure what his problem is. Ross is definitely not the answer for leadoff -

 

[msgkings322]

Yep - not playing belt is one of my biggest disappointments of this year. I agree with Ozzie on his stats prediction. He just never gave the kid a chance.

Also very disappointed in Torres this year. Not sure what his problem is. Ross is definitely not the answer for leadoff -

His problem is that he's Andres Torres. 2010 looks like a big time aberration for him. His lifetime stats are closer to what we see now...

If we didn't have all the injuries we could handle some regression from a Torres or a Ross...but we do. And we are also dealing with regressions from Huff and Burrell and whomever we trot out there at SS.

It's a testament to management and the pitching that we are still in this. Also a weak division and injuries to our rivals.

 

[jimsan15]

I was thinking to myself last night, "Man, the Giants have not done well in the first games of series this year. It seems like they always lose the first game, especially of a home stand."

So I checked the schedule.

First Game of a Series: 19-17

First Game of a Home Stand: 5-4

For a first place team, I would expect better. But the record shows they are better than my perception (slightly). It also shows, I think, the team's resilience. Being what 14 games over .500 while losing the first game of half the series played means they do awfully well coming back from an opening loss.

The Giants are not a first place team.

 

[filosofy29]

The Giants are not a first place team.

On August 2nd, they were

 

[the_broom]

His problem is that he's Andres Torres. 2010 looks like a big time aberration for him. His lifetime stats are closer to what we see now...

If we didn't have all the injuries we could handle some regression from a Torres or a Ross...but we do. And we are also dealing with regressions from Huff and Burrell and whomever we trot out there at SS.

It's a testament to management and the pitching that we are still in this. Also a weak division and injuries to our rivals.

Other than Stamos...none of our SS's have trotted out to their position. They've used walkers...

 

[calsnowskier]

Other than Stamos...none of our SS's have trotted out to their position. They've used walkers...

I approve of this message

 

[gp956]

Other than Stamos...none of our SS's have trotted out to their position. They've used walkers...

Rep+

 

[tzill]

This really proves to me how badly BB has handled this guy. If they simply put him in and let play there is little doubt in my mind he would have hit over 250 with 15+ HR as a minimum, better production then we are getting out of either LF or 1B, and set Belt up for a big 2012 - as it stands now more likely we have set him back and 250 may be all we should expect the first half of next year - really really poor stuff.

This is the classic fan reaction of "I know more than the manager/head coach/GM" syndrome. Bochy has access to all kinds of information, every day, that we do not. How players are feeling, how they're acting, what they look like in BP, etc, etc, etc.

There may be "little doubt" in your mind, but you're succumbing to confirmation bias and Dunning-Kruger.

To be clear: I respect your right to express your opinion; just pointing out your error.

 

[the_broom]

This is the classic fan reaction of "I know more than the manager/head coach/GM" syndrome. Bochy has access to all kinds of information, every day, that we do not. How players are feeling, how they're acting, what they look like in BP, etc, etc, etc.

There may be "little doubt" in your mind, but you're succumbing to confirmation bias and Dunning-Kruger.

To be clear: I respect your right to express your opinion; just pointing out your error.

I have to agree....we don't really know what management knows. I think we all see a player have a game like Belt did yesterday and start projecting. Stamos was a good example, he started off like gangbusters and the league quickly found his weaknesses at the plate. The kid just wasn't ready.

Or maybe this is a horrible example... Belt was touted as being ready at the end of spring training but didn't he have actually very little pro experience?

 

[calsnowskier]

I have to agree....we don't really know what management knows. I think we all see a player have a game like Belt did yesterday and start projecting. Stamos was a good example, he started off like gangbusters and the league quickly found his weaknesses at the plate. The kid just wasn't ready.

Or maybe this is a horrible example... Belt was touted as being ready at the end of spring training but didn't he have actually very little pro experience?

I hear what you are saying, but Belt/Crawbaby is a bad example.

Belt DESTROYED the minor leagues with the bat and was a top prospect in all of baseball. At the beginning of the year, Belt was not getting the results, but his ABs were, almost 100% of the time, well put together. Sending him down was PROBABLY the right thing to do at the time, because although his ABs were good, his contact was not. He needed to go back down and get his confidence back so we could swing hard when he swung. It looks like he has that confidence now.

Crawford has struggled most of his pro career at the plate, and his bat has pretty much been written off by all who know anything. He came up and had a good week, than his numbers fell to where the experts expected him to be. However, he still put up nice ABs, so he could likely be a .330 OBP (or so) player when/if he becomes a MLB regular.

In short, Belt is expected to do some damage with the bat in his career while Craw has some potential with his OBP ability, but really nothing more. To see a good game from Belt, it is fair to extrapolate and want him in more. To see a good game from Craw, it is more likely the illusion than the fact.

 

[Stokes1931]

I brought this up before, but had no takers.

There is a comparison to be made between the Braves' Freddie Freeman and Brandon Belt.

Both are young, Freeman is 22, Belt is 23.

Through April, Freeman was hitting .217 (20 for 92) with 3 homers, 8 RBI's, 12 walks, and 17 K's in 92 AB's

Through April, Belt was hitting .184 (10 for 52) with 1 homer, 4 RBI's, 7 walks and 12 K's.

The Braves continued to give Freeman starts, and he is now hitting .293 with 17 homers, 62 RBI's, 41 walks, and 115 K's. (457 AB's)

The Giants have been jimmyjacking Belt (and OK, he did get injured and spent some time on the DL), and he is now hitting .230 with 5 homers, 12 RBIs, 13 walks and 28 K's. (100 AB's)

My point is, the Braves stuck with a young, talented first baseman and he began hitting significantly better. The Giants saw their young, talented first baseman struggle, and pulled the plug too soon, IMHO.

This is not quite apples and apples, I agree. We had a washed up Huff with a $22 million contract as our regular first baseman, and the Braves really had no one to give the position to except Freeman. And the Braves had a better hitting lineup, and there was less pressure on Freeman to be the savior. There would have been more pressure on Belt to be sure.

Still, I can't help but wonder what might have been if the Giants had stuck with Belt, how much he would have improved with PT and more AB's.

Obviously, I am not Sabes nor Noggin. I am just a hack with a keyboard, monitor, and internet access. But this screams to me as being a no brainer. We just don't develop young hitters the way other teams do, to our detriment.

 

[calsnowskier]

I brought this up before, but had no takers.

There is a comparison to be made between the Braves' Freddie Freeman and Brandon Belt.

Both are young, Freeman is 22, Belt is 23.

Through April, Freeman was hitting .217 (20 for 92) with 3 homers, 8 RBI's, 12 walks, and 17 K's in 92 AB's

Through April, Belt was hitting .184 (10 for 52) with 1 homer, 4 RBI's, 7 walks and 12 K's.

The Braves continued to give Freeman starts, and he is now hitting .293 with 17 homers, 62 RBI's, 41 walks, and 115 K's. (457 AB's)

The Giants have been jimmyjacking Belt (and OK, he did get injured and spent some time on the DL), and he is now hitting .230 with 5 homers, 12 RBIs, 13 walks and 28 K's. (100 AB's)

My point is, the Braves stuck with a young, talented first baseman and he began hitting significantly better. The Giants saw their young, talented first baseman struggle, and pulled the plug too soon, IMHO.

This is not quite apples and apples, I agree. We had a washed up Huff with a $22 million contract as our regular first baseman, and the Braves really had no one to give the position to except Freeman. And the Braves had a better hitting lineup, and there was less pressure on Freeman to be the savior. There would have been more pressure on Belt to be sure.

Still, I can't help but wonder what might have been if the Giants had stuck with Belt, how much he would have improved with PT and more AB's.

Obviously, I am not Sabes nor Noggin. I am just a hack with a keyboard, monitor, and internet access. But this screams to me as being a no brainer. We just don't develop young hitters the way other teams do, to our detriment.

As an ignorant outsider, I agree wholeheartedly.

However, as I stated earlier, I think it was a good idea to send Belt down at the time he was (the first time). Not only was he figuratively on his heals, Huff was REALLY hurting the team in the OF with his D.

Remember all those "Would Huff have gotten that?" comments?

 

[OzzieGiant]

This is the classic fan reaction of "I know more than the manager/head coach/GM" syndrome. Bochy has access to all kinds of information, every day, that we do not. How players are feeling, how they're acting, what they look like in BP, etc, etc, etc.

There may be "little doubt" in your mind, but you're succumbing to confirmation bias and Dunning-Kruger.

To be clear: I respect your right to express your opinion; just pointing out your error.

I think you mean flaw (in logic) not error nothing you posted makes my opinion wrong. Anyway there are plenty of experienced and knowledgeable analyst asking questions re how Belt has been handled.

Just because BB gets a lot right and has access to the information doesn't mean he gets it all right, in this case me and many others think he had gotten it very wrong.

 

[mistgl]

Alcides Escobar Stats, News, Pictures, Bio, Videos - Kansas City Royals - ESPN

If Crawford ever becomes a competent major leaguer, those kind of numbers are what I would expect of him.

They're not omg amazing, but with his GG D they are more than acceptable. Essentially, all I ask of him is to not be an automatic out.

 

[tzill]

I think you mean flaw (in logic) not error nothing you posted makes my opinion wrong. Anyway there are plenty of experienced and knowledgeable analyst asking questions re how Belt has been handled.

Just because BB gets a lot right and has access to the information doesn't mean he gets it all right, in this case me and many others think he had gotten it very wrong.

Let's say that's true. How does that differ from Dunning-Kruger?

 

[ugafan6612]

Arizona down 4-0 in the 6th against the nats

 

[tzill]

Arizona down 4-0 in the 6th against the nats

In the 7th now.....