Game Thread: Game 5: Lions at Patriots

[Gulf of Brazil]

I made the comment that I thought he was good enough. I think I am probably wrong. He has given up 3 tds in 5 games. The defense sucks enough on its own. They dont need him adding to the problem.

So, are you missing Stafford as the Lions QB because he had a day similar to Goff's yesterday and one other game this year that I've seen.
Good thing Tom Brady never in his career gave up points to the opponents - or Patrick Mahomes or Aaron Rodgers or Joe Burrow

 

[Gulf of Brazil]

Dan Campbell had no reason to go for 4th down attempt from his own 45-yard on the very first series of the game.

He had no reason to go for 4th down and 9 from NE 32 down 13-0. You either attempt the FG - Badgely is 3/10 lifetime from 50+ and into the wind or you pooch punt or a possibility of a Jack Fox fake punt and throw to whoever. Hell, Ben Johnson would've been better off with Tom Kennedy in as a wildcat QB with a RPO. Hoodie just dialed up the heat and Sewell easily let Judon get past him.

 

[Gulf of Brazil]

DC needs to dial back all the confidence he attempts to show his players by going for all of those damn 4th down attempts. Take the points when you can or pin the opponent with a punt.

Campbell hasn't learned one damn thing and at some point, he's going to lose this team - especially the O-line when points are available. You have to reward your O-line for their effort at some point.

 

[Gulf of Brazil]

Should Campbell continue his ego maniacal aggressiveness with all of those ill-advised 4th down attempts and the team is still spiraling down after the Thanksgiving game, albeit having at least Jacobs, Cominsky and Paschal back, then he needs to be fired at that time.

Brad Holmes needs to direct Campbell not to kill this team's morale with his ego, poor clock management and decision making, and Chris Speilman needs to be in on that meeting.

 

[Zwalt]

I rewatch3d the first half of the game. Couldn't bring myself to stay up and watch the second half. They went for it on 4th down twice, first time 4th and 1/2 a yard or less from their own 46. (Should have been a first if Goff had stretched out the ball as he was going out of bounds, but he has zero situational awareness). Personally I punt from my side of the field, but with the #1 offense in the league, needing half a yard, and essentially at midfield I think this decision to go for it is in my opinion acceptably aggressive. I hated the playcall, either go QB sneak, full power running, or pile insude and pitch around the edge. The stupid FB dive was like psuedo trick play, but with no upside.

Only other time in the first half they went for it on 4th was at like the 33 yard line, 4th and 9. But we don't have a FG kicker who could even reasonably hit from 51 yards, Campbell knows that better than us, since they tried out several this week to find anything. Nobody goes for it on 4th and 9 expecting to convert, that was desperation. Not like you gain anything by punting from the opposing 30 yard line. I'm sure if Campbell knew Goff was gonna run backwards and then fumble for a TD he would have instead let some nobody miss the FG. And maybe they would have kicked a 44 yard FG if Reynolds hadn't lost 7 yards on 3rd down.

This game had guys from the street or practice squad starting in the secondary, and then getting injured and putting the back-up of practice squad players into the game. And we still held them below our season average points scored. The whole team was gathered around and looked shaken as a teammate (they thought) might have broken his neck. We would have still lost this game if New England had punted on 1st down every time they got the ball. Just our offense vs their defense and they still scored more points than us. And that's when you guys are complaining about decision making? I get people are upset, but find another hill to die on.

Yeah, totally disagree.

4th and 9 at the opponent's 30 when they have a 3rd string rookie QB is the incredibly stupid. You just signed a kicker that made 4/4 last week, if you don't think you can make it from under 50, then you failed as a coach and GM to get a marginal pro kicker. Going for it there is INSANE! There is no possible benefit other than to help the other team, and that is exactly what happened. Campbell has shown he is terrible as an in game coach, and that was the cherry on top. Seriously, this isn't that fricking hard but he makes it so much worse. That dumb ass move sealed the game, you can't do that type of stupid shit.

 

[Zwalt]

DC needs to dial back all the confidence he attempts to show his players by going for all of those damn 4th down attempts. Take the points when you can or pin the opponent with a punt.

Campbell hasn't learned one damn thing and at some point, he's going to lose this team - especially the O-line when points are available. You have to reward your O-line for their effort at some point.

Bulls-fucking-eye

 

[jayfan]

Yes, but it's more towards our O-line not holding up. Goff, like most QB's and even Stafford, need a clean pocket to work from. If you want more proof, then take your eyes and look straight towards what Brian Dabol has done with Daniel Jones this year - he has a cleaner pocket more often than not to work from - it's not going to happen every game as there will be a handful of games, like this one, that every NFL QB has to endure.

Our O-line was completely overmatched yesterday and even CJ Stroud or Bryce Young would've struggled - and so would Tom Brady,

While Jackson was back at left guard, Stenberg was given the start at right guard because Evan Brown has a sprained ankle. Stenberg was reportedly such a mess in pass protection that they benched him at halftime and put Brown in with a bum ankle.

 

[Old Lion]

So, are you missing Stafford as the Lions QB because he had a day similar to Goff's yesterday and one other game this year that I've seen.
Good thing Tom Brady never in his career gave up points to the opponents - or Patrick Mahomes or Aaron Rodgers or Joe Burrow

None of those guys gave up 3 tds in 5 games. Goff has given up a score in more than every other game so far. And he has nowhere near the mobility. His decision making is not even close to theirs either.

 

[Old Lion]

Yeah, totally disagree.

4th and 9 at the opponent's 30 when they have a 3rd string rookie QB is the incredibly stupid. You just signed a kicker that made 4/4 last week, if you don't think you can make it from under 50, then you failed as a coach and GM to get a marginal pro kicker. Going for it there is INSANE! There is no possible benefit other than to help the other team, and that is exactly what happened. Campbell has shown he is terrible as an in game coach, and that was the cherry on top. Seriously, this isn't that fricking hard but he makes it so much worse. That dumb ass move sealed the game, you can't do that type of stupid shit.

Actually it would have been just about 50 yards and you dont try the FG unless it is at the end of the half. The winds at Foxboro are crazy. That was one of the few times I agree with going for it. Something like 0-6 on 4th this game should temper a lot of this foolishness though. NFL analytics are no better either. Cost the Raiders the game last night. Common sense tells you to kick the extra point for the tie with less than 5 minutes to go. Just because 50.1% of the time the stats say go for the win does not mean that all situations are created equal. That was just retarded.

 

[Old Lion]

While Jackson was back at left guard, Stenberg was given the start at right guard because Evan Brown has a sprained ankle. Stenberg was reportedly such a mess in pass protection that they benched him at halftime and put Brown in with a bum ankle.

I would have put Skipper in. Stenberg is PS material still.

 

[Mebert]

I would have put Skipper in. Stenberg is PS material still.

If we never passed he would be an all star!

 

[Gulf of Brazil]

Actually, it would have been just about 50 yards and you don't try the FG unless it is at the end of the half. The winds at Foxboro are crazy.

Agree.

That was one of the few times I agree with going for it.

Disagree and not because of the end result. Lions at NE 32 and Reynolds just lost 7 yards the play before. You either take a delay of game penalty and pooch punt or you take the ball completely out of Goff's hands. Goff was already showing signs of frustration and mental fatigue and if he doesn't have the frame of mind to shake off the mental instability in his game, then he's prone to mistakes.

Even if the pooch punt goes into the end zone, it's a better alternative than wishing or hoping that 4th and 9 will be successful.

 

[Gulf of Brazil]

Stenberg is PS material still.

Stenberg is now tPaul territory and the latter can kick the former's tires all day long for another team.

Stenberg missed his assignment on that 4th and 1 from our 45-yard line.

Brown had no business coming in to replace Stenberg while playing with a gimpy ankle and therefore Skipper should've been playing RG. I doubt that minor mistake would've made a difference in the game.

 

[Gulf of Brazil]

Something like 0-6 on 4th this game should temper a lot of this foolishness though.

Campbell is too much of an ego maniac to take heed of your words.

It's one thing to believe in your team and attempt to show confidence in your offense. It's a complete disaster when the HC fails by gambling at one of the most inappropriate times - i.e, 4th and 1 from your own 45 and 4th and 9 at your opponent's 32 all the while going up against the best defensive mind in all of football and on their turf.

 

[Gulf of Brazil]

If Goff cannot change his mental acuity while under duress, then he's finished. Give him a relatively clean pocket and he can shine. Defense collapses the pocket and our O-Line caves, Goff will underperform.

 

[Gulf of Brazil]

According to Football Outsiders, the Lions’ success rate in power situations (third/fourth and short or goal-line situations) is just 53 percent, which ranks 28th in the NFL.

BB_72: Lions are 3/6 when it's 4th and 1 and run the ball. 0/2 for Sunday when running on 4th and 1.

It's worse than that when Lions pass on 4th and 1, 4th and 2, 4th and 3, 4th and 4.

 

[Gulf of Brazil]

I honestly don't think it matters all that much this year. The team is too young and inexperienced plus even if Levi O and J. Paschal were healthy from training camp on, I'm not convinced the record wouldn't be the same with them on the field.

Last year, the Lions ranked 30th in Football Outsiders’ Adjusted Games Lost, which essentially means they suffered the third-most injuries of any team. This year, they’re well on their way to being a bottom-five team again:

 

[Gulf of Brazil]

Detroit generated just two pressures on Sunday. Two. The Lions, a team who forced 31 pressures in Week 2 versus the Washington Commanders and hadn’t had less than 10 pressures in a game had just two pressures against the Patriots. According to Pro Football Focus, New England had allowed 32 pressures through their first four weeks of football.

On the flip side, this was easily the worst performance of the season by the offensive line. Detroit’s offensive front is their identity, and it’s so critical to the success of the Lions offense at large. On Sunday against the Patriots, the offensive line allowed a season-high 16 pressures—14 of which were allowed by Taylor Decker (5), Jonah Jackson (4), Penei Sewell (3), and Frank Ragnow (2).

 

[Gulf of Brazil]

From Pride of Detroit article

This is a stat I cooked up after looking at Goff’s performance, so it isn’t exactly a stat tracked by PFF, but using their pressure and depth of throw numbers, this is the percentage of Goff’s drop backs that resulted in a completion: 48.7 percent. It’s his lowest mark of the year and a number that illustrates just how incapable the offense was of moving the ball through the air.

Goff is beyond reproach when it comes to a subsection of Lions fans, and that’s fine. I understand rooting for a player through thick and thin. However, this was the game that illustrates the problem with Goff when things go sideways: his limitations athletically only exacerbate the issue. He struggles to rise above when he’s put into tough situations. When Goff is faced with pressure, and this is something he’s looked to improve on from a year ago, he can make things worse by making a poor decision. Whether that’s trying to loop out of pressure by taking steps in the wrong direction or trying to fit a throw into a window he shouldn’t be, Goff had his worst game of the year against New England—and that shouldn’t be a surprise to anyone who watched it on Sunday.

 

[Zwalt]

Actually it would have been just about 50 yards and you dont try the FG unless it is at the end of the half. The winds at Foxboro are crazy. That was one of the few times I agree with going for it. Something like 0-6 on 4th this game should temper a lot of this foolishness though. NFL analytics are no better either. Cost the Raiders the game last night. Common sense tells you to kick the extra point for the tie with less than 5 minutes to go. Just because 50.1% of the time the stats say go for the win does not mean that all situations are created equal. That was just retarded.

You don't like trying the field goal there, then punt. Going for it on 4th and 9 that early in the game was atrocious. You have a minimal chance of success and more than likely give a short field to a rookie QB. Analytics be damned, with the game situation and personnel, going for it is wrong.