Disturbance in the Force

[MilkSpiller22]

JMO, but we should maximize the originals at 7years(units), and maximize all others at 6...

what this does:

1. allows all non original owners to one day be equal
2. Keeps the originals valued larger than everyone else
3. it will be quicker to give a newer owner an actual voice in the voting system....

 

[averagejoe]

Also @averagejoe - perhaps it would be a very good idea to post the rules and regulations established over the years and put them on the MBBRL thread for all to see.

Done. See the thread: MBBRL Constitution

If you know of any other situations to include, let me know.

@canesandfinsfanatic
Was looking for the calculation to establish the MBBRL Power Rankings. (Thought it may be worth putting it in with the rules.) I tried several different searches, but couldn't find it - officially. I'm sure you may know?

 

[Barilko]

i see the constant demand for rule change is still happening
when if ever will it be understood that we don't need change

I have had enough and said enough

The league is fine leave it alone

 

[averagejoe]

JMO, but we should maximize the originals at 7years(units), and maximize all others at 6...

what this does:

1. allows all non original owners to one day be equal
2. Keeps the originals valued larger than everyone else
3. it will be quicker to give a newer owner an actual voice in the voting system....

Milk, I appreciate that you're an out-of-the-box thinker. I do.
Maybe I'm bias since I'm one of the originals, but let me put this idea of yours in perspective...

Tomorrow when you get to work, your boss has a meeting, and tells all of the employees that starting January 2nd, there will only be 2 kinds of employees. A group that have been there the longest. And then the group that have been there the shortest. Then he says, essentially, seniority doesn't mean anything - you all NOW have equal time with the company.

Do you think there would be any complaints? Because this is essentially what you're proposing.

 

[MilkSpiller22]

Milk, I appreciate that you're an out-of-the-box thinker. I do.
Maybe I'm bias since I'm one of the originals, but let me put this idea of yours in perspective...

Tomorrow when you get to work, your boss has a meeting, and tells all of the employees that starting January 2nd, there will only be 2 kinds of employees. A group that have been there the longest. And then the group that have been there the shortest. Then he says, essentially, seniority doesn't mean anything - you all NOW have equal time with the company.

Do you think there would be any complaints?

no, but a league that prides itself for letting new blood in, should not constantly tell the new blood that they are not equal to nor never will be to the more seniority owners... If you want to take the power away from the people and give it to a select few then fine, but don't masquerade it with a democratic process...

 

[averagejoe]

You may see us as these crusty old inflexible geezers hellbent on tradition.
But we voted you in, didn't we?

 

[Barilko]

Milk I sent a few pms stating I'll be quiet and see how it plays out but Joe.s reply has me speaking once more

Well said Joe

Milk I too appreciate your out of the norm and sometimes rather interesting ideas

Just let me say that I believe the few elder statesmen are not against democracy or change

But I feel that many are against change in this league
It is obvious that I'm against it in this league it has nothing to do with being elder or undemocratic

As I have stated oh so many times. Save the change for your own leagues
The MBBRRL is fine already

As for a voting process
The only thing we ever vote on is a new entry and maybe an oblivion exit
So there is no need to balance some vote process that we rarely use at least that is how I feel

Again believe me I use Milkian rules in my league. But since day one in this league I knew this was/isn't the place for change.

 

[TREFF]

man life has hit and i havent been as active and ive missed a ton, and dont have time to review it all

but @TREFF you did a great job, if you wanna step back, please do, you should have that right, but please stay and play as well

For now I'm only shutting the door on the commish job. That's not even debatable. I'll weigh in on issues, and we'll see where the league ends up, and if it appears to be back on tracK, I'll hang around

 

[TREFF]

Milk, I'll just say this about your proposal..you're welcome to walk if you don't like the way the leagues foundation is setup. Period

Now how about we address the real issues and start fixing them...like finding someone to take my old job

 

[MilkSpiller22]

Milk I sent a few pms stating I'll be quiet and see how it plays out but Joe.s reply has me speaking once more

Well said Joe

Milk I too appreciate your out of the norm and sometimes rather interesting ideas

Just let me say that I believe the few elder statesmen are not against democracy or change

But I feel that many are against change in this league
It is obvious that I'm against it in this league it has nothing to do with being elder or undemocratic

As I have stated oh so many times. Save the change for your own leagues
The MBBRRL is fine already

As for a voting process
The only thing we ever vote on is a new entry and maybe an oblivion exit
So there is no need to balance some vote process that we rarely use at least that is how I feel

Again believe me I use Milkian rules in my league. But since day one in this league I knew this was/isn't the place for change.

thats fine, but aren't we changing this rule from what we have always done?? so if we are changing the rule then why can't we talk about HOW to change it... I get it was in the original work of Will white but we never actually followed it... but now we are because what??

all i have said is that to take it purely from years played is not fair, especially if you want(or at least need) new owners...

 

[Barilko]

I hate foul language and you can note that I certainly don't
But wtf are you talking about

The whole point is we aren't changing rules
and that is why we dug back to get and then post the original rules
so all the rules could be followed as their were more instances of our rules not being honoured this year

In case you didn't notice I have repeatedly stated I do not want new owners
I want a rock solid 24 if we need new owners because our 24 is slipping then all the more reason that the original rock solid members decide who we let in

 

[Bandit]

thats fine, but aren't we changing this rule from what we have always done?? so if we are changing the rule then why can't we talk about HOW to change it... I get it was in the original work of Will white but we never actually followed it... but now we are because what??

all i have said is that to take it purely from years played is not fair, especially if you want(or at least need) new owners...

We are not changing the rule at all. Nothing that we have ever had a poll on has been a close enough vote for this to matter. The only things we've voted on recently (and I went back and checked the results) were:

Playoff #1 seed choosing his opponent passed 15-5

The draft order being chosen and division determined by draft spot passed 17-3-2-1 (there were four options)

Decimal point scoring passed 23-1

Now the reason I know that those were the last three is that I proposed all three of those changes and they have all passed within the last year. You say that the old guard is unwilling to change, but I say we've made more changes this year than in any other year. Am I seen as a radical because I proposed these changes? I don't think so, but maybe I'm wrong. Besides, Wil didn't state that every vote should carry the weight of the years you've been in the league, only the votes for the nominations of new candidates and oblivion because that is where the founders have the most at stake. Normal decisions like whether or not to use decimal point scoring effects everybody equally whether you have been in the league one year or ten, which is why there's no "weight" added to those votes for years in the league.

Here is the best way I can try and explain this. If you started your own company seven years ago in New York and then your business was so successful that you opened a second location five years ago in Los Angeles. This year you are trying to decide whether to open a third location in Miami. Do you think the people that you just hired should have the same vote on opening that third location that you and the people that have been with you for all seven years do? No, because the people that have been with you the whole time have more at stake than somebody that you hired a month ago. It's common sense.

Mic drop!!

 

[Chef99]

I get it was in the original work of Will white but we never actually followed it... but now we are because what??

Not entirely true, we kept following it until things started to slip. Thing is, Wil used to constantly post and reinforce (reinvigorate? I dunno, something like that) the importance of the spirit and tradition of the league.

When he took his leave, that went bye-bye. If you wanna get on the "crusty elder statesmen" for anything, there ya go.

Anyway, let's put someone in charge and get this show on the road.

 

[tlance]

thats fine, but aren't we changing this rule from what we have always done?? so if we are changing the rule then why can't we talk about HOW to change it... I get it was in the original work of Will white but we never actually followed it... but now we are because what??

all i have said is that to take it purely from years played is not fair, especially if you want(or at least need) new owners...

Let me also say this. I think it is important that everybody hears it.

Milk, you are very important to this league. You have many ideas and are not afraid to question the way things are done. That is highly valuable in any organization. We may not always (or often) agree, but that is okay. Keep doing what you do.

For everybody else, I think Milk sometimes gets misunderstood. His love
For this league is clear and unquestioned, yet I think some people tend to take his inquisitions a bit personally because it seems like he is trying to blow things up, or that he does not respect the tradition. He does. He is not afraid to speak up when he thinks things can be improved. We should not stifle that. At the same time Milk, know that most of the time we are likely to disagree when you bring up potential change ideas.

Do not take Milk's comments of context! He is one of our most active posters and wants the same thing we all do: the best possible league. He just has different views on how to get there.

 

[Chef99]

Let me also say this. I think it is important that everybody hears it.

Milk, you are very important to this league. You have many ideas and are not afraid to question the way things are done. That is highly valuable in any organization. We may not always (or often) agree, but that is okay. Keep doing what you do.

For everybody else, I think Milk sometimes gets misunderstood. His love
For this league is clear and unquestioned, yet I think some people tend to take his inquisitions a bit personally because it seems like he is trying to blow things up, or that he does not respect the tradition. He does. He is not afraid to speak up when he thinks things can be improved. We should not stifle that. At the same time Milk, know that most of the time we are likely to disagree when you bring up potential change ideas.

Do not take Milk's comments of context! He is one of our most active posters and wants the same thing we all do: the best possible league. He just has different views on how to get there.

Meh. Milk's alright. I'd like him even better if he'd show up in our dynasty baseball league.

 

[MilkSpiller22]

Meh. Milk's alright. I'd like him even better if he'd show up in our dynasty baseball league.

Im there... hard during the football season to think baseball but I am always there in the backround looking in... almost done picking my 20 keepers...I think...

 

[MilkSpiller22]

We are not changing the rule at all. Nothing that we have ever had a poll on has been a close enough vote for this to matter. The only things we've voted on recently (and I went back and checked the results) were:

Playoff #1 seed choosing his opponent passed 15-5

The draft order being chosen and division determined by draft spot passed 17-3-2-1 (there were four options)

Decimal point scoring passed 23-1

Now the reason I know that those were the last three is that I proposed all three of those changes and they have all passed within the last year. You say that the old guard is unwilling to change, but I say we've made more changes this year than in any other year. Am I seen as a radical because I proposed these changes? I don't think so, but maybe I'm wrong. Besides, Wil didn't state that every vote should carry the weight of the years you've been in the league, only the votes for the nominations of new candidates and oblivion because that is where the founders have the most at stake. Normal decisions like whether or not to use decimal point scoring effects everybody equally whether you have been in the league one year or ten, which is why there's no "weight" added to those votes for years in the league.

Here is the best way I can try and explain this. If you started your own company seven years ago in New York and then your business was so successful that you opened a second location five years ago in Los Angeles. This year you are trying to decide whether to open a third location in Miami. Do you think the people that you just hired should have the same vote on opening that third location that you and the people that have been with you for all seven years do? No, because the people that have been with you the whole time have more at stake than somebody that you hired a month ago. It's common sense.

Mic drop!!

Don't think I ever actually said that I don't think the "old guard is unwilling to change"... Might have inferred it, and to that I do apologize...

I do see that I backed myself into a corner such that anytime I open my mouth it looks and sounds like I am questioning rules and wanting new ones put in... But I don't think I ever asked for a rule change in the MBBRL main league... if I am mistaken then I again apologize...

But here, I do think since we never enforced this rule that this rule could or should be up for debate... and all I have ever said about this rule in particular is that I don't think it is fair to go solely by years played...

If the point of this rule is to give the elder classmen more of a voice then I would MUCH rather you guys decide without even a vote from the rest of the league... and I have no problem with this...

I just have trouble seeing any new member taking him/her years to even be a respectable fraction of the rest of us... We are getting at least one new owner this year, and you would think that this will not be the last time we get a new owner... Just think we need to think about our future members in these rules...

 

[TREFF]

Well regardless, I don't think now is the time to argue about Milk, or debate some of his more outlandish suggestions. The idea was brought up, it gained no traction, no support, it's time to move on, lots of pressing issues to determine

 

[Ram Tough]

I am all for the majority

 

[Barilko]

Moved from the rules page
Well a certain some one dropped a D picked up a player then played without a D and had all 6 on the bench on a bye
That for me is extreme
Tlance you are certainly right as well when you post the other side of the argument yet 6 on a bye is way to extreme certainly 1 of the 6 could have been dropped without long term impact

and that week he lost by 1.9 to our eventual number 1 seed who may have deserved to be 2

and if the person who did that chimes in and questions why I didn't use his name it is because most in the discussion already know who we are talking of and why risk the potential of what may be deemed slander any further for those who do not know
and finally it may yet prove not to be a glaring error when all is said and done if the majority determines it so