Will Kaepernick Ever Be as Disciplined as Wilson?

[jakedog56]

Niners fans had the pleasure of seeing Deion up close in his prime in a Niners jersey and to call "they never threw to his side of the field" crap is frankly ignorant because it is absolutely TRUE! He truly shut down an entire side of the field with the passing game. Eric Davis got a ton better because he got thrown at A LOT! Also, as bad as Deion was at tackling, he was the best ever once he did catch the INT. He was a pick-6 threat every time you decided to throw his way.

You may not agree with the "Greatest CB Ever" title, but you cannot dispute how dominant he truly was. He was the best cover corner I have ever seen, and it isn't even close. Maybe you feel differently but ultimately I don't feel you can dispute that QBs avoided throwing in his direction if they could.

Please read what I said again. I readily stated that he was an all-time great CB and I also stated that some opponents did avoid throwing to his side of the field but only for about 2 years of his career and not every opponent did.

Also again, he didn't finish in the top 20 in INTs

While stats do not tell the whole story, they do provide important information. Check out this analysis.

Greatest NFL Cornerbacks of All Time from Greatest-Players.com

They take into consideration INTs, TDs, Sacks, add them together and divide by games. Note that Sanders is only listed #10 on this list and that many of the players played in an era where sacks were not kept as stats (if these had been considered then #13 -19 on this list all had a good chance to pass Sanders!). In addition, tackles are not considered here either and this stat would have only hurt Sanders.

All in all, I feel that people that rank Sanders as the best CB of all time are products of generations that were biased by the hype and ignorant of players of previous generations like Night Train Lane and Dick LeBeau.

Based on this, I think that admitting to Sanders being about top-5 in generous. He is one of the all time greats, just not THE greatest.

Also, LMAO at 9ers fans being all pissy about Sherman and calling him a jerk (and far worse) but at the same time they get all gushy over one of the more arrogant d-bags to play the sport in the self-hype machine Sanders in his horrible suits with coke dribbling out of his nose. I guess it is ok if he was a 9er and it happened in the past.

 

[ATL96Steeler]

I don't see either of these guys every week, but I've seen enough to make this comment.

Kaep...It largely depends on what Harbaugh wants him to do...he was able to reel in the mistakes by A, Smith by simplifying the reads...Option 1, or check it down....with Kaep I think he can do something similar...option 1, check it down, or run it. Will he have the discipline to go option 1, option 2, option 3? Or, because he can run so well, will he pull it down and run it if option 1, or 2 is not open?

Wilson...take nothing away from his game, but he doesn't have the physical pkg that Kaep does. IMO he has to be more disciplined, read the defenses, etc. The margin for error is just not as great with Wilson.

 

[blstoker]

Kaep...It largely depends on what Harbaugh wants him to do...he was able to reel in the mistakes by A, Smith by simplifying the reads...Option 1, or check it down....with Kaep I think he can do something similar...option 1, check it down, or run it. Will he have the discipline to go option 1, option 2, option 3? Or, because he can run so well, will he pull it down and run it if option 1, or 2 is not open?

The one thing I will disagree with is that Alex Smith was replaced because of mistakes. The guy was completing 70% of his passes and had a QB rating of 104.1 when he was benched. He was 19-5 as a starter under Harbaugh and had only turned the ball over a total of 10 times in 25 starts. You can argue that the decision was a good one or not, or even if the team would have made the SB with Smith or not, but Smith was getting the job done.

 

[dredinis21]

Please read what I said again. I readily stated that he was an all-time great CB and I also stated that some opponents did avoid throwing to his side of the field but only for about 2 years of his career and not every opponent did.

Also again, he didn't finish in the top 20 in INTs

While stats do not tell the whole story, they do provide important information. Check out this analysis.

Greatest NFL Cornerbacks of All Time from Greatest-Players.com

They take into consideration INTs, TDs, Sacks, add them together and divide by games. Note that Sanders is only listed #10 on this list and that many of the players played in an era where sacks were not kept as stats (if these had been considered then #13 -19 on this list all had a good chance to pass Sanders!). In addition, tackles are not considered here either and this stat would have only hurt Sanders.

All in all, I feel that people that rank Sanders as the best CB of all time are products of generations that were biased by the hype and ignorant of players of previous generations like Night Train Lane and Dick LeBeau.

Based on this, I think that admitting to Sanders being about top-5 in generous. He is one of the all time greats, just not THE greatest.

Also, LMAO at 9ers fans being all pissy about Sherman and calling him a jerk (and far worse) but at the same time they get all gushy over one of the more arrogant d-bags to play the sport in the self-hype machine Sanders in his horrible suits with coke dribbling out of his nose. I guess it is ok if he was a 9er and it happened in the past.

I read what you said and you are frankly full of shit. You disputed him as THE greatest by discounting his ability to shut down an entire side of the field based on attempts to the WR he covers and I basically told you that you can't do that. I never claimed he was THE greatest of all time, just that he was the best I had ever seen. I gush about Deion's ability because he showed to be a true difference maker throughout his career. I never said anything about Deion's attitude at all. I am talking between the lines. I have not been able to locate this data (but still looking) but I can almost guarantee that the amount of times the ball was targeted towards him on average is significantly less then the average CB then and now. You act as if INT are the only stat worth mentioning in a CB because it supports your ball-licking of Sherman. I contend that no CB in the last 20+ years has had the impact on a game like Deion.

This takes nothing away from Sherman, who I already said was a great player. And you may be right on LeBeau and Lane, but I was not old enough to watch them play so I cannot comment on them. All I can say is what I have already stated, which was that Deion was the best CB I had ever watched play.

BTW, all you need to know in terms of the link you provided being bullshit is that DeAngelo Hall is ranked the 6th best CB ever. lol Yup, sounds legit.

 

[dredinis21]

The one thing I will disagree with is that Alex Smith was replaced because of mistakes. The guy was completing 70% of his passes and had a QB rating of 104.1 when he was benched. He was 19-5 as a starter under Harbaugh and had only turned the ball over a total of 10 times in 25 starts. You can argue that the decision was a good one or not, or even if the team would have made the SB with Smith or not, but Smith was getting the job done.

You are right in that Smith was not replaced based on mistakes, he was replaced because offensively he hindered our offense. His 70% completion is based on him constantly checking down. It was rare to see Smith throw downfield past 10-15 yards. Kaep showed the ability and willingness to look downfield while minimally turning the ball over. Harbaugh knew that Kaep gave the Niners a better chance at a more complete, more potent offense...and he proved it.

 

[ATL96Steeler]

The one thing I will disagree with is that Alex Smith was replaced because of mistakes. The guy was completing 70% of his passes and had a QB rating of 104.1 when he was benched. He was 19-5 as a starter under Harbaugh and had only turned the ball over a total of 10 times in 25 starts. You can argue that the decision was a good one or not, or even if the team would have made the SB with Smith or not, but Smith was getting the job done.

I didn't say that's why Smith was replaced, but you bring up a good points.

Turnovers were at the core of it imo but not directly...we all know that Smith was nothing more than a turnover machine under the 2 previous HCs in SF. Harbaugh made the game more simple...his completion % skyrocketed, turnovers plummeted as you mentioned.

But...he was not really pushing the ball down field (imo out of fear of the turnover)...went down with the concussion...in comes Kaep...more confident, more willing to go down field with the football...Alex Smith probably was a better QB than Kaep LY, but do you really make leaps and bounds this many years into your career?

Not often...I think Harbaugh knew that Smith was near his ceiling. The up side potential I think made it easy to stick with Kaep as the starter.

 

[Rvnight18]

can we put this whole kaep doesn't work hard like Wilson or kaep isn't a leader crap to rest yet?

 

[SonnyCID]

can we put this whole kaep doesn't work hard like Wilson or kaep isn't a leader crap to rest yet?

It will probably last as long as the "Wilson's too short" crap.

 

[Rvnight18]

It will probably last as long as the "Wilson's too short" crap.

That shit needs to stop as well. Both are lies. Loved Wilson coming out of college, just can't cheer for him because he plays for the hawks. I mean, did you see all those passes hitting the o-lineman in their asses because he is so short? Ohh wait... he had what 32 TD passes? Height means jack shit

 

[jerseyhawksfan79]

I believe that we could be seeing 2 future Top 5 QB's for the next decade. Both guys work there asses off, very athletic, and have tremendous field vision. I hate Kaep, but I do respect his play.

 

[jakedog56]

[/B]
I read what you said and you are frankly full of shit. You disputed him as THE greatest by discounting his ability to shut down an entire side of the field based on attempts to the WR he covers and I basically told you that you can't do that. I never claimed he was THE greatest of all time, just that he was the best I had ever seen. I gush about Deion's ability because he showed to be a true difference maker throughout his career. I never said anything about Deion's attitude at all. I am talking between the lines. I have not been able to locate this data (but still looking) but I can almost guarantee that the amount of times the ball was targeted towards him on average is significantly less then the average CB then and now. You act as if INT are the only stat worth mentioning in a CB because it supports your ball-licking of Sherman. I contend that no CB in the last 20+ years has had the impact on a game like Deion.

This takes nothing away from Sherman, who I already said was a great player. And you may be right on LeBeau and Lane, but I was not old enough to watch them play so I cannot comment on them. All I can say is what I have already stated, which was that Deion was the best CB I had ever watched play.

BTW, all you need to know in terms of the link you provided being bullshit is that DeAngelo Hall is ranked the 6th best CB ever. lol Yup, sounds legit.

I never discounted his ability to be a shut down corner. I even stated that HE WAS ONE OF THE ALL-TIME GREATS but apparently that isn't good enough for you 9ers trolls. What I discounted was his ability to do this throughout his entire career. He had a 2-3 year window where he peaked and even then it was not as if he never had balls thrown his way at all during those years.

I even admitted that the stats in the link do not tell the whole story (they never do) but that there is information to garnered from them if you are willing to look closely at them. Sorry that on a per game basis Sanders does not hold up as well as others when you look at those specific numbers. Deal with it.

I am also not old enough to have seen the likes of Lane, Boyd, etc. but I have read about them and watched them on films (what there is available). They were also quiet impressive in their abilities and could actually tackle and hit.

You really need to develop a thicker skin. This isn't the 9er board. If I went over there and started saying how Justin Smith is good (or in the other posters case, rant on and on about how much he hates Sherman), but Cortez Kennedy was so much better I wouldn't expect people to sit there and agree with me and not defend their player. I certainly wouldn't start calling the "local" posters names and telling them they were "full of shit". This isn't the ESPN boards.

 

[STBR 27]

can we put this whole kaep doesn't work hard like Wilson or kaep isn't a leader crap to rest yet?

Stopping wearing hats from other NFL teams because it matches his underwear would be a pretty good start to showing that he is a leader.

 

[Rvnight18]

Or that he lead his team to a superbowl. Glad you think a hat is what makes you a leader. High standards you have.

 

[DunceKaep]

I'm glad you think the "hat thing" is no big deal.
Discount it all you want, but it WAS a foolish thing to do.

Kaep is a fine player, he has more athletic ability than Wilson, I can say that, but to suggest that he prepares as hard as Wilson is laughable.

 

[yossarian]

I'm glad you think the "hat thing" is no big deal.
Discount it all you want, but it WAS a foolish thing to do.

Kaep is a fine player, he has more athletic ability than Wilson, I can say that, but to suggest that he prepares as hard as Wilson is laughable.

You should really learn more about other players before you start comparing them.

49ers' Kaepernick is an uplifting presence - 49ers - The Sacramento Bee

Kaepernick shuns spotlight to start offseason work | ProFootballTalk

Kaepernick prepares just as hard as Wilson.

 

[Scooby-Doo]

As an unbiased fan (hating both teams) I would take Kaep over Wilson in a second. It wouldn't surprise me if Wilson went downhill from his rookie year. Not saying it will happen, just saying I wouldn't be surprised.

 

[JDM]

I guarantee you no one on that roster gives two shits that he wore a dolphins hat.

 

[blstoker]

I guarantee you no one on that roster gives two shits that he wore a dolphins hat.

They don't have to for it to become a distraction. Enough media attention on something makes it a distraction. Like the time that Russell Wilson wore that Patriots hat because it made his socks look better. Oh yeah, smart NFL QBs realize that they are the face of their respective franchises, and every other team is a rival.

Personally, I find that a Seahawks/Mariners/WSU hat goes with everything I would wear a hat with. Kaep just basically told the entire league that his outfit is more important to him than the scarlet and gold. He could have just as easily worn a Marlins cap and gotten the same color scheme, and then nobody would be talking about it.

 

[SonnyCID]

I guarantee you no one on that roster gives two shits that he wore a dolphins hat.

Maybe not two, but Bowman appeared to at least give one shit.

NaVorro Bowman calls Kaepernick's Dolphins hat 'a huge mistake' - CBSSports.com

 

[yossarian]

It is true that Bowman called him out on it, but I think that enough has been written about how seriously Kaepernick approaches the game, his preparation, and his devotion to the team, that it is not a big deal. His team knows he's committed to the 49ers, if it was another qb, there might be more questions.