yanks sign gardner to 4 yr 52 mil

[StanMarsh51]

LOL this is a terrible deal for the Yankees, great job by Gardner robbing them of 52M.

Gardner in his last 3 full seasons has averaged a 5.2 WAR

Granderson in his last 3 full seasons has averaged a 4.3 WAR


Do you think Granderson was a bad deal for the Mets?

 

[Johnnydollaz89]

Gardner in his last 3 full seasons has averaged a 5.2 WAR

Granderson in his last 3 full seasons has averaged a 4.3 WAR


Do you think Granderson was a bad deal for the Mets?

I'm sorry, I don't know all these advance stats, nor do I care for them in all honesty. All jibberish to me.

But, has Gardner come close to 30HR's in a season, answer me that?

Don't sit here and bash Grandy, when you probably enjoyed him as a Yankee, if you're a fan.

 

[StanMarsh51]

I'm sorry, I don't know all these advance stats, nor do I care for them in all honesty. All jibberish to me.

But, has Gardner come close to 30HR's in a season, answer me that?

Don't sit here and bash Grandy, when you probably enjoyed him as a Yankee, if you're a fan.

So HR's are the main thing you look at when comparing players?

So I guess Mark Reynolds has had a better career than Ichiro...after all, when has Ichiro ever hit 30 home runs, right?

 

[Johnnydollaz89]

So HR's are the main thing you look at when comparing players?

So I guess Mark Reynolds has had a better career than Ichiro...after all, when has Ichiro ever hit 30 home runs, right?

No, i'm just saying, we mainly paid Grandy to provide some power and protection in the lineup for Wright. If Granderson gives me 25-30 HR's for the next 4 years, yes I am very pleased with his contract.

 

[StanMarsh51]

No, i'm just saying, we mainly paid Grandy to provide some power and protection in the lineup for Wright. If Granderson gives me 25-30 HR's for the next 4 years, yes I am very pleased with his contract.

That's great, but trying to argue that Granderson is a better player and/or has a better contract than Gardner simply because he hits more home runs is about as flawed an argument as you can make.

You're a Mets fan, so I'll use a Mets player from yesteryear as the example...Tino Martinez wasn't a better player than John Olerud because Tino hit a lot more home runs. Olerud did everything outside of hitting home runs as good as or better than Tino, just as Gardner does everything outside of hitting home runs better than Granderson.

Home runs are a very small part of the overall equation, as even for a good home run hitter, they usually make up around 5% of a player's plate appearances...what about the other 95% of the time he isn't hitting a home run?

 

[Johnnydollaz89]

That's great, but trying to argue that Granderson is a better player and/or has a better contract than Gardner simply because he hits more home runs is about as flawed an argument as you can make.

You're a Mets fan, so I'll use a Mets player from yesteryear as the example...Tino Martinez wasn't a better player than John Olerud because Tino hit a lot more home runs. Olerud did everything outside of hitting home runs as good as or better than Tino, just as Gardner does everything outside of hitting home runs better than Granderson.

But you're the one who made the contract comparison, not me. We're not signing Garnder to play the OF as well as he does, nor are we paying Granderson to do that, we're paying him for the power and protection in the lineup, so I don't see how or why it's even in comparison here.

I'm just speaking in terms of OUR needs, that's it. You're making it more than what it is by bringing up WAR, which like I said, I don't know nor care about. Nothing against you or knowing semantics better than I do, I just don't really care for it. All I care about is Granderson producing for us.

 

[StanMarsh51]

But you're the one who made the contract comparison, not me. We're not signing Garnder to play the OF as well as he does, nor are we paying Granderson to do that, we're paying him for the power and protection in the lineup, so I don't see how or why it's even in comparison here.

I'm just speaking in terms of OUR needs, that's it. You're making it more than what it is by bringing up WAR, which like I said, I don't know nor care about. Nothing against you or knowing semantics better than I do, I just don't really care for it. All I care about is Granderson producing for us.

But you don't think Gardner will 'produce' for the Yankees that you would call it a horrible deal? Based on what? Because he doesn't hit home runs?

 

[navamind]

Jealous of Brett Garnder? LOL Lagares is a better player than Gardner.

LOL

There's more to evaluating a baseball player than home runs.

 

[StanMarsh51]

Jealous of Brett Garnder? LOL Lagares is a better player than Gardner.

You thinking this makes it known to the board that you're clueless.

For starters, Gardner's major league OBP is 30 points higher than Lagares' minor league OBP.

 

[Johnnydollaz89]

But you don't think Gardner will 'produce' for the Yankees that you would call it a horrible deal? Based on what? Because he doesn't hit home runs?

13M a season for what? To play the field, you're acting like the guy is Babe Ruth at the plate. Did I miss something where Garnder bats .350 a year?!

 

[Johnnydollaz89]

You thinking this makes it known to the board that you're clueless.

For starters, Gardner's major league OBP is 30 points higher than Lagares' minor league OBP.

I would take Lagares' glove over Gardner's any day of the week.

 

[navamind]

13M a season for what? To play the field, you're acting like the guy is Babe Ruth at the plate. Did I miss something where Garnder bats .350 a year?!

What the fuck are you talking about?

 

[Johnnydollaz89]

LOL

There's more to evaluating a baseball player than home runs.

When did I say it was ONLY about home runs? When comparing Grandy to Gardner for the prices they got, we're paying Granderson for his power, Yankees are not paying Gardner for that. They're paying for his glove.

 

[CSD]

Jealous of Brett Garnder? LOL Lagares is a better player than Gardner.

Better in what way? Fielding, hitting, running? Please enlighten us with his one year of major league experience.

Gardner in his last 3 full seasons has averaged a 5.2 WAR

Granderson in his last 3 full seasons has averaged a 4.3 WAR

Do you think Granderson was a bad deal for the Mets?

Granderson licked his chops with the short porch in right. It was no surprise he hit as many HR's as he did. He doesn't have that advantage at Citi Field. Grandy also strikes out ALOT! He's also coming off a hand injury, hopefully for the Mets sake he produces just as much if not more. For now, they picked up the Yankees sloppy seconds. I do love Grandy though, he's one classy dude. Well respected.

I'm sorry, I don't know all these advance stats, nor do I care for them in all honesty. All jibberish to me.

But, has Gardner come close to 30HR's in a season, answer me that?

Don't sit here and bash Grandy, when you probably enjoyed him as a Yankee, if you're a fan.

Gardner, like Jeter, isn't a power hitter. Never will be. His other skills as a ball player compensate for it. Using HR's to rank a player's overall ability is silly.

 

[StanMarsh51]

I would take Lagares' glove over Gardner's any day of the week.

Gardner's considered one of the best defensive outfielders in all of baseball....

Gold Glove voters miss on Brett Gardner - Yankees Blog - ESPN New York

Gardner's career FRAA is +84, so he's been very good over his career.


The gap in offense makes up for any gap in defense there is.

 

[StanMarsh51]

When did I say it was ONLY about home runs? When comparing Grandy to Gardner for the prices they got, we're paying Granderson for his power, Yankees are not paying Gardner for that. They're paying for his glove.

It's not like he's got a near .360 OBP the past 4 years or can steal 30+ bases (including multiple seasons of 45+ steals)....he does none of that.

 

[navamind]

I would take Lagares' glove over Gardner's any day of the week.

They're both damn good defenders and I wouldn't be surprised if Lagares was the better defender. But Gardner's also a *much* better hitter. Lagares batted .242/.281/.352 with an OPS+ of 80 in his first rookie season. Only stole 6 bases and was caught stealing 3 times. His minor league stats are very "meh" too (career .282/.322/.405, 100 stolen bases (caught 49 times) in 625 games in the minors). It's not like he's really young for those levels either. He's turning 25 soon.

Meanwhile, Gardner has a career line of .268/.352/.381 with a 97 OPS+ and has 161 stolen bases (caught 38 times) in 620 MLB games. Gardner's coming off a season where he batted .273/.344/.416 with an OPS+ of 108 and 24 stolen bases (caught 8 times).

Gardner's not a great offensive player by any means, but he gets on base and he's one of the better baserunners in the majors. Saying they're paying just for his glove is silly.

 

[Johnnydollaz89]

Gardner's considered one of the best defensive outfielders in all of baseball....

Gold Glove voters miss on Brett Gardner - Yankees Blog - ESPN New York

Gardner's career FRAA is +84, so he's been very good over his career.


The gap in offense makes up for any gap in defense there is.

If I knew how to go into these advance stats with you, I would, but I don't and i'm not ashamed of it. I know I saw somewhere on MLB Network when talking about CF's that Lagares, even with how many games he played, was in the top 5 of for CF's in multiple categories, including assists and some other stuff I forget. If I can find it, I will gladly share it with you all.

 

[StanMarsh51]

If I knew how to go into these advance stats with you, I would, but I don't and i'm not ashamed of it. I know I saw somewhere on MLB Network when talking about CF's that Lagares, even with how many games he played, was in the top 5 of for CF's in multiple categories, including assists and some other stuff I forget. If I can find it, I will gladly share it with you all.

Lagares was excellent in the field in 2013 (+30 FRAA, which is really elite). But he couldn't hit a lick, and that's what hurts his value and why he's not better than Gardner.

Given that offense is worth more than defense, would you rather have the guy who's great on defense but bad on offese, or the guy who's very good on defense and pretty solid at offense? The gap in offense is worth more than the gap in defense.

 

[navamind]

If I knew how to go into these advance stats with you, I would, but I don't and i'm not ashamed of it. I know I saw somewhere on MLB Network when talking about CF's that Lagares, even with how many games he played, was in the top 5 of for CF's in multiple categories, including assists and some other stuff I forget. If I can find it, I will gladly share it with you all.

https://www.baseballprospectus.com/glossary/index.php?search=FRAA

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