Who will texas maybe Get in a Trade?

[jta4437]

That's quite a package... (no homo).

With that, i'd expect PHI to kick in a nice chunk....

Well thats the high end of my package expectations without having to give up the cream, minus Olt, who I think is Chris Davis 2.0 anyway but better plate discipline

I'm all for deaing from depth

 

[romeo212000]

No its irrelevant in the sense that at the time Smoak was a prime prospect, had to give him up for the services of Cliff Lee, he fucked us went to Philly, and now we're considering giving up prime prospects AGAIN (whether they pan out, once again NOT relevant), for the "privilege" of paying Lee's bloated backloaded contract (even if the Phillies subsidize it), point is a lot of Lee's money went to Darvish

He didn't fuck us. He just preferred to pitch in Philly. If they hadn't swooped in he would've signed with us. Instead, we got Beltre hardly anything to cry about. Don't think of it as giving up prospects for cliff Lee who fucked us. Think of it as giving up prospects for a legit ace (which we desperately need now that we're sans Colby) that we have control of for 3.5 years. This is business jta. Not personal. I'm sure JD understands that.

 

[romeo212000]

Well thats the high end of my package expectations without having to give up the cream, minus Olt, who I think is Chris Davis 2.0 anyway but better plate discipline

I'm all for deaing from depth

That would be a very tempting group for Philly I think and it wouldn't hurt our farm badly at all.

 

[jta4437]

Yep. Some are held in higher regard than others.....but generally proven player > prospect.

If you think short term, but you also have to consider value provided by younger players over the long term at a very reduced price

its all about value short and long term, everyone is just taking value in the short term in consideration, what value does Cliff Lee provide in 3-4 years?

Is he still a 3-4 WAR pitch for 25 million AAV, or does he regress into the 2-3 range

And in that same time, does Martin Perez vault into 3-5 WAR range at a price taf of less than 1 million AAV

 

[jta4437]

He didn't fuck us. He just preferred to pitch in Philly. If they hadn't swooped in he would've signed with us. Instead, we got Beltre hardly anything to cry about. Don't think of it as giving up prospects for cliff Lee who fucked us. Think of it as giving up prospects for a legit ace (which we desperately need now that we're sans Colby) that we have control of for 3.5 years. This is business jta. Not personal. I'm sure JD understands that.

ALso this idea that Cliff Lee is a TORP, which I do not, i think he's a good pitcher, but not a TORP

If he's a TORP than Colby Lewis is a TORP, which he is not, you look at the numbers and aside from HR/9 they are relatively similar

No I preferred getting A. Beltre and was glad to be done with Lee, I had no desire to pay a pitcher 25+ into his late 30s, especially someone who gets hurt significantly at least once a year

 

[jta4437]

Trust me, I'm all business, I don't take it personal at all, did it make me mad, yes, got Beltre, got over it,

But, I'm not for giving up prospects twice for the same pitcher b/c he chose to play elsewhere, he wanted it, let him sink with Philly

 

[romeo212000]

If you think short term, but you also have to consider value provided by younger players over the long term at a very reduced price

its all about value short and long term, everyone is just taking value in the short term in consideration, what value does Cliff Lee provide in 3-4 years?

Is he still a 3-4 WAR pitch for 25 million AAV, or does he regress into the 2-3 range

And in that same time, does Martin Perez vault into 3-5 WAR range at a price taf of less than 1 million AAV

Youre operating under the assumption that Texas would be paying all of his salary. I'm betting you my next paycheck JD would make Philly eat a big chunk of that.

As for your assessment of lee not being a TORP, we'll have to agree to disagree. And IMO Colby was in fact a playoff ace.

 

[jta4437]

Youre operating under the assumption that Texas would be paying all of his salary. I'm betting you my next paycheck JD would make Philly eat a big chunk of that.

As for your assessment of lee not being a TORP, we'll have to agree to disagree. And IMO Colby was in fact a playoff ace.

He pitches well in the playoffs, but he's still no TORP (lewis)

Was Lee a TORP, yes, but he's pretty obviously regressing, and only getting older and is injury prone, nothing major in a while but still injury prone, you don't have to blow out your elbow or shoulder to be injury prone

Even if Philly covers a big chunk, we're still looking at 20+, which I'm not ok with

I've made my pitch, I'm not against giving up talent for Lee it just has to be from a position of depth and what we're willing to give up, not necessarily on what Philly wants

 

[Hambombs]

ALso this idea that Cliff Lee is a TORP, which I do not, i think he's a good pitcher, but not a TORP

If he's a TORP than Colby Lewis is a TORP, which he is not, you look at the numbers and aside from HR/9 they are relatively similar

No I preferred getting A. Beltre and was glad to be done with Lee, I had no desire to pay a pitcher 25+ into his late 30s, especially someone who gets hurt significantly at least once a year

Lee had a very TOp of the rotation season the 2 years before this one. And i think he will improve Over the course of the season.

 

[fordman84]

No its irrelevant in the sense that at the time Smoak was a prime prospect, had to give him up for the services of Cliff Lee, he fucked us went to Philly, and now we're considering giving up prime prospects AGAIN (whether they pan out, once again NOT relevant), for the "privilege" of paying Lee's bloated backloaded contract (even if the Phillies subsidize it), point is a lot of Lee's money went to Darvish

Someone smarter than me (everyone?) remind me who we got with Lee comp picks.

Does knowing that help lessen the blow jta?

 

[jta4437]

Lee had a very TOp of the rotation season the 2 years before this one. And i think he will improve Over the course of the season.

You act like he's 25, 2 years ago are not relevant in discussing a pitcher thats about to be 34

Ask Michael Young, he arguably had a career year last year, now he's clueless, getting old sucks and in baseball it happens fast

 

[Hambombs]

I think he might be having a down season this year cause everybody on the phillies is doing pretty bad wi improve alot with texas IMO

 

[jta4437]

Kevin Matthews and Zach Cone, no that doesn't do much for me

Though Cone is having a decent 2nd season in the minors, last I saw

 

[Hambombs]

You act like he's 25, 2 years ago are not relevant in discussing a pitcher thats about to be 34

Ask Michael Young, he arguably had a career year last year, now he's clueless, getting old sucks and in baseball it happens fast

I think he will come back strong thats sex defense of andrus and beltre will be awesome

 

[jta4437]

I think he will come back strong thats sex defense of andrus and beltre will be awesome

sex defense? Not sure what that is exactly, but I'm sure anyone would like that.... maybe?

 

[Xx srs bsns xX]

Youre operating under the assumption that Texas would be paying all of his salary. I'm betting you my next paycheck JD would make Philly eat a big chunk of that.

As for your assessment of lee not being a TORP, we'll have to agree to disagree. And IMO Colby was in fact a playoff ace.

Define "big chunk". If Philly were to eat 50% or more of what he's owed, I'm sure they would probably just keep him. IMO, around 15-20million is all they would kick in. (if that). Which would put Lee down to roughly a 20M/per pitcher.

 

[Hambombs]

I think cliff lees command has been a little off this year thats why H/9 is his career high but theres really no drop off in velocity on his fastball and the stuff is still there indeed

 

[Xx srs bsns xX]

Sounds like Olt is the major snag in a deal for Lee. (ESPN radio)

That's really the only thing preventing a deal. (from PHI sources)

 

[fordman84]

Sounds like Olt is the major snag in a deal for Lee. (ESPN radio)

That's really the only thing preventing a deal. (from PHI sources)

That's good. If we can get Lee and hang on to Olt and Profar, that would be HUGE. Josh Johnson does nothing for me.

 

[fordman84]

MLBTR keeps talking that we are in talks for Broxton. ANyone know why? Don't we have Nathan and a decent setup guy in Adams?