Vance Joseph Appreciation Thread

[megalodon30]

All valid points. This was the most embarrassing game I can remember in my life

I’ll take getting blown out and allowing 70 in week 3 of the regular season over getting embarrassed in the Super Bowl, but it’s still a hard pill to swallow.

 

[LGM]

Where is the LGM appreciation thread?

I left you last week. You were supposed to start it. DUH.

 

[Draft Crazy]

I left you last week. You were supposed to start it. DUH.

I think you need to change your avatar...

 

[listopencil]

Full Disclosure: I switched to graveyard shifts and I have to modify my sleep schedule if I want to watch games in real time. This was the first early game of the year, so I was going to be able to watch the entire thing. I went to bed after just a few series of downs because of how the Defense was playing. I made the correct choice.

 

[SpiritOf77]

With Vance as their DC, the Cardinals never had more than 13 INTs in one season .. This despite the fact that the Cardinals averaged 16 INTs per season over the previous 23 years

Vance's first season as DC ( 2019/20 ) in AZ saw the Cards rank 28th in D, giving up an average 27.6 PPG .... The next three seasons the Cards were 14th, 11th and then 31st in defense, respectively ..

So coming off a season in which his defense ranked 31st in the NFL, I have a hard time believing that Vance was Sean Payton's first choice ...

For the sake of discussion, I am going to address the elephant in the room ..

I don't think Sean Payton should be blamed for the decision to hire Vance ... I just cannot see Sean Payton - a coaching perfectionist - pounding the table for a DC that headed the 31st ranked defense in the NFL , esp considering this was a clean slate and start of a new era ....

Here's where things get potentially uncomfortable

Ejiro Evero declined the HC position for the final two games in Denver last season .. Was this Evero's way of saying "so long" to the Broncos overall ?? ... My hunch is that Evero wanted out of Denver, and it was not so much a decision by Payton and the Broncos to get rid of him ...

So in this scenario, we have Evero leaving the Broncos, perhaps in hopes of landing a HC gig in AZ or Indy .. or perhaps just wanting out after Hackett was fired ...

The Broncos were recently up for sale, with a number of African American candidates in the running .. There was a lot of talk about this, including Roger Goodell, who, when asked about the Bronco ownership, said this:

“We would love to see a diverse owner of the team, whether that's a person of color, a female, or a Black man. We think that would be a really positive step for us and something we've encouraged and one of the reasons why we've reached out to find candidates."

So a highly successful DC in Evero leaves Denver with a DC vacancy .... As we know, the Broncos were purchased by a White family, and Sean Payton is hired as the HC ..

While the goal in the NFL is to win games and win championships, it would be a bit misguided to think that, in today's climate of scrutiny, the Broncos weren't under a bit of pressure - or at least cognizant - of replacing Evero with another African American ..

How is this going to look having a excellent black DC in Evero leave, and be replaced by Rex Ryan ??

I am in no way piling on Vance .. But anyone who knows the NFL, knows Vance has not been a great defensive coordinator ... I just don't think Sean Payton should be crucified for Vance's hiring, and I can imagine that, if Vance was more of an equity hire than Payton's first choice, it must be incredibly frustrating for him ..

And that from here on out, the Bronco brass better listen to Sean Payton if, indeed, the best man for the job doesn't address the PR pressure of equity hiring ...

The Broncos need to win some games .. I was rooting for Vance this second time around, but I don't think anyone ever thought he was the best chance at continuing the tradition of great defense here in Denver ..

 

[SpringStein]

@SpiritOf77 - it’s well known that Evero and Hackett were extremely close personally and Evero did not like it that Hackett was let go during the season. He declined to be the Interim HC and was out of here due to his relationship with Hackett and the way he was treated.

There’s been several articles, both in the DPO and The Athletic this past week that Payton’s first choice was Vic. Vic would have joined Payton anywhere other than Denver where he deemed it was too close (just one year) from his firing here.

 

[SpiritOf77]

@SpiritOf77 - it’s well known that Evero and Hackett were extremely close personally and Evero did not like it that Hackett was let go during the season. He declined to be the Interim HC and was out of here due to his relationship with Hackett and the way he was treated.

There’s been several articles, both in the DPO and The Athletic this past week that Payton’s first choice was Vic. Vic would have joined Payton anywhere other than Denver where he deemed it was too close (just one year) from his firing here.

I can believe that .. But in regards to Evero, he had the opportunity to be an NFL HC for two games, and turned it down .. Loyalty is great, however, he may never have that chance again ( although I think he will despite a underwhelming start in Carolina ) ...

So Evero and Fangio were never options ... That really has nothing to do with my point, as the optics would have been bad had we replaced a successful black DC with a white DC ... but Rex Ryan was available, and he has actually coached great defenses in this league .. Not recently, granted, but he has a much much better resume that Vance, and Rex was a HC too .. Which, looking at the Jets before and since, he did an admirable job with ..

The was also the Brian Flores cloud hanging over the Broncos, which was ridiculous considering Flores' glowing quotes after that meeting, however, the mere mention of any racial component in a negative light is not what new ownership wants ... In 2023, it is probably the last thing they want ...

Was Vance Joseph really the best candidate available ?? ... The answer is simple : just look at the past three games

I just hope Sean Payton has the freedom to get what he wants ... If not. I shudder to think what would happen if he leaves ... You think it is bad now, but at least there is hope with one of the best HC in the NFL ... If Payton leaves, we're ******

 

[SpiritOf77]

If Vance is fired or steps down, we might have a rising star already on the staff

https://www.si.com/nfl/broncos/news/broncos-christian-parker-selected-coach-accelerator-program

 

[Duffman]

We literally gain nothing by keeping Vance Joseph at this point. You think anyone in the locker room respects him at this point to where they’re gonna listen to anything he says if he tries to coach them?

if Vance isn’t fired, and they have another garbage performance next week on Defense, he may not make it out of the stadium, Denver was lucky today wasn’t a home game.

 

[Draft Crazy]

We literally gain nothing by keeping Vance Joseph at this point. You think anyone in the locker room respects him at this point to where they’re gonna listen to anything he says if he tries to coach them?

if Vance isn’t fired, and they have another garbage performance next week on Defense, he may not make it out of the stadium, Denver was lucky today wasn’t a home game.

Agree. I think the damage is done with Vance. Can't keep him. Might be a little different if he inherited a bad defense but he didn't. He made a good defense a bad defense. It was embarrassing and once again we are the joke of the NFL along with the Bears. Let's move on from him, no reason to hang onto him.

 

[megalodon30]

VJ not fired. Bet the Bears and the over this weekend.

 

[Mountain Bronco]

While they should fire him, they won't this week. I worry that Sean is a yappy dog, with no actual bite.

 

[coloradobuff]

Tank for Caleb is the mission here!

 

[Draft Crazy]

Let's see if Vance can account for Fields running today. The one thing we need to stop.

 

[megalodon30]

Let's see if Vance can account for Fields running today. The one thing we need to stop.

Can’t even account for his arm.

It’s no longer a matter of if VJ gets fired but when…

 

[Draft Crazy]

Can’t even account for his arm.

It’s no longer a matter of if VJ gets fired but when…

Probably not happening after a win but probably should.

Joseph is a problem but he also can't go out and tackle and cover. Combination of both right now. Coaching and players not stepping up.

Bonitto, Cooper and Turner-Yel showed a lot of heart today. Turner-Yell has been thrown into a bad situation on a bad defense but the guy played well today. He is hot and cold right now but he has gained valuable experience going forward. Key for him is to continue to get better and take advantage of this opportunity for his career going forward.

 

[nflbronco]

Easiest team on Denver's schedule. Packers are only before bye win I see.

 

[Draft Crazy]

Games aren't won on paper. One week at a time..

 

[megalodon30]

Probably not happening after a win but probably should.

Joseph is a problem but he also can't go out and tackle and cover. Combination of both right now. Coaching and players not stepping up.

Bonitto, Cooper and Turner-Yel showed a lot of heart today. Turner-Yell has been thrown into a bad situation on a bad defense but the guy played well today. He is hot and cold right now but he has gained valuable experience going forward. Key for him is to continue to get better and take advantage of this opportunity for his career going forward.

Definitely not when his D tied the game and made the pick to end it. Still not an impressive performance against one of the worst offenses in the NFL.

Nate Hackett licking his lips next week…

 

[Mountain Bronco]

Probably not happening after a win but probably should.

Joseph is a problem but he also can't go out and tackle and cover. Combination of both right now. Coaching and players not stepping up.

Bonitto, Cooper and Turner-Yel showed a lot of heart today. Turner-Yell has been thrown into a bad situation on a bad defense but the guy played well today. He is hot and cold right now but he has gained valuable experience going forward. Key for him is to continue to get better and take advantage of this opportunity for his career going forward.

I thought Bonitto and Cooper played amazing in the 4th quarter, but where is that to start the game? After having a rough week Turner-Yel got better today which is all you can ask for with a young player tossed into a tough situation. His recognition and run stop late in game was huge to get this win.

VJ's scheme is baffling and it looks like the players are confused a lot. You could see Sean in VJ's ear a lot on the sideline during the game. I think VJ knows he is on the hot seat. Zach Wilson looked pretty good last night and the Jets have a lot of speed on offense so this Jets game could be a tough one next week.