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Uh-oh HaroldSeattle!!!!

Schmoopy1000

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Well declined a trade from Carolina where Carolina only wanted to pay I think around $6M of the $18M. So that isn't unreasonable by the Browns. Like I have been saying all along they have been waiting out the market, they still have a couple months at worst. If an injury happens or teams realize they don't have a good QB room then maybe the Browns get a little more desperate and cover half his salary. That would fine for both sides at this point.
I get what the browns are doing.
I was responding to why other teams are willing to wait, other than just thinking he sucks. Some may actually like him. Plenty of reasons to wait.
 

Shanemansj13

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I get what the browns are doing.
I was responding to why other teams are willing to wait, other than just thinking he sucks. Some may actually like him. Plenty of reasons to wait.
Yeah he definitely has a bigger market than what we've seen so far but the truth is there really aren't that many QB needy teams. I'm not sure I've ever seen it like this, at least I can't remember. Both sides are still playing hardball.

I think the Giants are a team that could wind up with him. Jones in his final year, new HC. Give him a shot, if not they start over in 2023.
 

wilwhite

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It doesn't matter if Baker is better the relationship is shot. Baker not only won't re-sign which is already obvious, he won't play another down for the Browns.
People were saying the same thing about Rodgers and the Packers.

The Browns would do it because they'll win more games with Mayfield than with Brissett, unless his head is completely unscrewed.

Mayfield would do it because he needs to play this year, otherwise his next contract will be garbage.

It's like a divorced couple staying in the same house because it makes sense financially.

(By the way, I really think if Seattle is leaking this, it's to drive down the price for Garoppolo.)
 

Clayton

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well more to it than just his salary.
what are the browns asking for in a trade? Do teams think he will eventually get cut? If so as a GM you would get fired for trading for him. Not only you keep your draft capital, but you can sign him most likely for a cheap price. Since he is already getting 18+ mil from browns. Or just wait for the browns to sell him for pennies on the dollar vs. trading right now. Plenty of reasons not to move on him right now even if you would like him.
He is a QB. No GM will get fired for grabbing a starting QB for mid range money and/or mid round picks
 

Schmoopy1000

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He is a QB. No GM will get fired for grabbing a starting QB for mid range money and/or mid round picks
If they were thinking long term sure.
A one year lets see what you got is a bit different.
 

ducky

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He is a QB. No GM will get fired for grabbing a starting QB for mid range money and/or mid round picks

NFL is a zero sum game. Rostering Baker means making a cuts elsewhere. It is why the Browns eating most of his $18m hit is so necessary for a trade to happen.

....and after last year, not sure anyone is looking at Baker as a starter. When a locker room thinks that OBJ is the good guy in a feud, you really have to question whether you even want Baker as your possible team leader.

At this point in the offseason, I would be shocked if the Browns didnt have to eat $11m of that cap hit to get him off the roster. Baker's comp right now is Teddy B who just got a $6.5m deal in Miami.

And even with that, the draft pick return that the Browns will get will have to be minimal. But does need to be high enough to justify the Browns missing out on the comp pick that Baker would get them if they just told him to stay at home this year.

All those things really make a deal like this hard to come to agreement on.
 

Clayton

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....and after last year, not sure anyone is looking at Baker as a starter. When a locker room thinks that OBJ is the good guy in a feud, you really have to question whether you even want Baker as your possible team leader.
This right here is the bullseye imo. NFL teams will work around the other stuff but I think Baker has questions on the field and in the locker room.

I do think part of Baker's issue is the idea that the Browns are loaded with talent. There was this idea with the Broncos, too, and it got a pretty good coach fired in Denver because their offense always stunk. That perception with Denver is reinforced by Wilson picking the Broncos. I think the Browns are in the same tier so everyone is pointing their fingers at Baker as the issue.
 

NWPATSFAN

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It doesn't matter if Baker is better the relationship is shot. Baker not only won't re-sign which is already obvious, he won't play another down for the Browns.
So Baker is going to back up Brissett? Get the popcorn out.
 

seattlefan75

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This right here is the bullseye imo. NFL teams will work around the other stuff but I think Baker has questions on the field and in the locker room.

I do think part of Baker's issue is the idea that the Browns are loaded with talent. There was this idea with the Broncos, too, and it got a pretty good coach fired in Denver because their offense always stunk. That perception with Denver is reinforced by Wilson picking the Broncos. I think the Browns are in the same tier so everyone is pointing their fingers at Baker as the issue.


Yeah that was my thing was baker in that he had a loaded offense with 2 pro bowl RBs, 2 pro bowl WRs, and good offensive line one of the best defensive lineman in the league and couldnt manage those assets. Then meanwhile they have to watch their division rival Joe Burrow in his 2nd year coming off a major injury with a rookie WR completely tear up the league and make it all the way to a super bowl.
 

NWPATSFAN

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Yeah that was my thing was baker in that he had a loaded offense with 2 pro bowl RBs, 2 pro bowl WRs, and good offensive line one of the best defensive lineman in the league and couldnt manage those assets. Then meanwhile they have to watch their division rival Joe Burrow in his 2nd year coming off a major injury with a rookie WR completely tear up the league and make it all the way to a super bowl.
Shhhh, don't let @dtgold88 here you say that.

Take cover, Tornado 88 coming in
 

ducky

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This right here is the bullseye imo. NFL teams will work around the other stuff but I think Baker has questions on the field and in the locker room.

I do think part of Baker's issue is the idea that the Browns are loaded with talent. There was this idea with the Broncos, too, and it got a pretty good coach fired in Denver because their offense always stunk. That perception with Denver is reinforced by Wilson picking the Broncos. I think the Browns are in the same tier so everyone is pointing their fingers at Baker as the issue.

It's just a shame that no one could have seen EXACTLY how this would play out for the Browns when they idiotically traded for OBJ in the first place....

OBJ trade rumors
 

PDay8810

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If Mayfield plays, he'll outperform expectations. Not that that says much. He could be a middle-of-the-pack QB.
I can't see Mayfield playing another down for Cleveland, even with the money on the table. Mayfield currently remains blinded with hate and will be the very last one to see his NFL destiny.
 

Shanemansj13

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People were saying the same thing about Rodgers and the Packers.

The Browns would do it because they'll win more games with Mayfield than with Brissett, unless his head is completely unscrewed.

Mayfield would do it because he needs to play this year, otherwise his next contract will be garbage.

It's like a divorced couple staying in the same house because it makes sense financially.

(By the way, I really think if Seattle is leaking this, it's to drive down the price for Garoppolo.)
Rodgers and Packers are a totally different situation. They drafted a QB and from all that we know, those were rumors. Plus Rodgers has played his entire career with GB, a future HOFr and one of the best QB's in the NFL and NFL history. Much different situation. All the Browns have to do if push comes to shove is just cover most of Baker's salary. Getting $6-$7M of his salary back is better than nothing, it would not work on the field. That relationship is done.
 

Shanemansj13

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NFL is a zero sum game. Rostering Baker means making a cuts elsewhere. It is why the Browns eating most of his $18m hit is so necessary for a trade to happen.

....and after last year, not sure anyone is looking at Baker as a starter. When a locker room thinks that OBJ is the good guy in a feud, you really have to question whether you even want Baker as your possible team leader.

At this point in the offseason, I would be shocked if the Browns didnt have to eat $11m of that cap hit to get him off the roster. Baker's comp right now is Teddy B who just got a $6.5m deal in Miami.

And even with that, the draft pick return that the Browns will get will have to be minimal. But does need to be high enough to justify the Browns missing out on the comp pick that Baker would get them if they just told him to stay at home this year.

All those things really make a deal like this hard to come to agreement on.
Making one cut isn't a big deal. Most teams roster players that never see the field or don't intend to unless a barrage of injuries anyway. There are a handful of teams have are in dicey situations and have no QB for the future. The whole point is paying less for a guy that potentially could get another contract, if your job is on the line no reason not to take the risk at that low price.
I don't think Teddy is a good comp, that is guy that can't stay on the field. If he could, he would be getting $10M+. Sure Mayfield only has the one year but that's as good as a QB on a one year contract. Mayfield's value has gone done which means he will get less money regardless of pretty much every situation barring a miracle.

Like I have said for months now, this is a game of hardball and it's a money issue. More than a handful of teams would pick up Baker now we just have to wait and see, who gets desperate with their QB situation and how much are they will to pay. It sounds like Carolina wants to pay around $6-$7M for Mayfield and the Browns declined. At worst that's what they would get. If they can get a late round pick and a team to cover $9-$10M of his $18M I think that wouldn't be a bad option but the whole point is there was no reason to rush...they know they have the $6-$7M now unless Carolina just completely changes their mind, not likely.
 
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HaroldSeattle

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now unless Carolina just completely changes their mind, not likely.
Then the Panthers would be carrying 3 QBs as I don't see them cutting Darnold or Corral. You never know but seems unlikely carrying 3 QBs appeals to them. The time to trade Mayfield was before teams addressed their QB corp. Now best they can hope for is injuries create a market for him between now and the start of the season, but QBs are protected like fine china in the off season, wearing red jersey indicating no hitting them allowed in practice and hardly playing in preseason games.
 

Shanemansj13

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Then the Panthers would be carrying 3 QBs as I don't see them cutting Darnold or Corral. You never know but seems unlikely carrying 3 QBs appeals to them. The time to trade Mayfield was before teams addressed their QB corp. Now best they can hope for is injuries create a market for him between now and the start of the season, but QBs are protected like fine china in the off season, wearing red jersey indicating no hitting them allowed in practice and hardly playing in preseason games.
Yeah doesn't seem ideal but I do think other teams like the Giants could be interested too. But another case is they go into training camp and preseason and their projected starter looks awful. I mean for example we saw how bad Darnold was after his great 4 game stretch. Do you really want that for the entire season? Who knows but like you said, injuries will be a big part of it for sure.
 

PolarVortex

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Meanwhile... Russell Wilson reportedly wants a 5 year $250M contract.

tumblr_ljkahzoZ671qanb21o1_500.gif
I hope he gets it. Just puts more pressure on filling the roster with the remaining payroll within the cap threshold. The more money he gets, the more losses Denver will endure. Funny how that works.
 

HaroldSeattle

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Yeah doesn't seem ideal but I do think other teams like the Giants could be interested too. But another case is they go into training camp and preseason and their projected starter looks awful. I mean for example we saw how bad Darnold was after his great 4 game stretch. Do you really want that for the entire season? Who knows but like you said, injuries will be a big part of it for sure.
Giants only have 6 million in cap space and I believe this is Daniel Jones final contract year. Makes sense to just ride out this season and address it next season probably through the draft. They got Tyrod Taylor as a back up who likely is good enough for a team going no where this season.
 

PolarVortex

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I can't see Mayfield playing another down for Cleveland, even with the money on the table. Mayfield currently remains blinded with hate and will be the very last one to see his NFL destiny.
As long as he keeps making those nifty Progressive insurance commercials, I don't care.
 

CrashDavisSports

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I am not a fan of Baker and just don't think he is good enough to start for any team in the NFL other than a stop gap (it seems most teams agree with me because $18M is a steal if you think a guy is a starter) but I would pursue him if I didn't have a decent QB or was looking for a really good backup. I think trading for him and his contract vs pursuing him if cut are two drastically different things. I've said all along any team that trades for his cap hit is dumb because he isn't worth it. But I also think that any team without a decent QB or is looking for a good backup that doesn't at least kick the tires is also dumb. I'm not sure he would start in Seattle but I don't see how adding him at less than $10M per would be a bad thing for them
I think most teams have their guys, and the ones that don't, are punishing Cleveland for ruining the market I think. So you want any compensation, you will eat most the money. I think Mayfield is a good QB. Bengals can't beat him even with Burrow and Chase. He also had over an 80% completion percentage last year prior to him messing his shoulder up and trying to play through it.
 
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