Too soon discussion on the 2018 draft

[SteelersPride]

Baker fn mayfield

 

[FirebreathingMonkey]

For the Seahawks I really like picking RB penny, Seattle's number one pick (at the time Seattle was in desperate need of an RB and still had massive Oline questions), but as the year has gone on, he's never on the field and the few times he is he's looked slow to me. No burst and goes down too easily.

 

[Rockinkuwait]

Favorite move was probably the Colts trading down, even if it ultimately included a guard.

I am usually against G at that high. But there was quite a few former GM's calling him the highest rated player they'd graded in years. And with the Colts need, and the low chance of that busting, it sounded ok, though wouldn't have argued against standing pat for Chubb either.

 

[Lake Shore Drive]

I think when it's all said and done and they evaluate the boom & busts of the '18 draft, Darius Leonard will have emerged as the pick of the draft. Can't really say it was a steal for the Colts, being he was the 2nd round, 36th overall pick. But he's had a season well worthy of ROY honors. Imagine, they grabbed Quinton Nelson with their 1st pick, then Leonard with the second. I'll have to have some Colt fans come in and evaluate their other selections. But in terms of talent, if all they came out of it all were these two major hits, I'd still call that one hell of a draft.

 

[Rockinkuwait]

For the Seahawks I really like picking RB penny, Seattle's number one pick (at the time Seattle was in desperate need of an RB and still had massive Oline questions), but as the year has gone on, he's never on the field and the few times he is he's looked slow to me. No burst and goes down too easily.

I am not sure about the goes down easy bit, I've only seen him a few games, but 3rd in the league in yards after contact (behind Chubb and Henry), so there's hope I guess. 6 yards a carry his last 10 games isn't anything to sneeze at either. And has the longer runs (per carry only Wilson has 10 yard runs more often), so there's some hope. But yeah I can see the lack of play time/dinged up part. I guess if you want to see the half glass full, maybe the explosive start like Thomas Rawls isn't always the best.

But taking an early shot on a punter seems to be working out. And gotta love Flowers as a value... at least in run support. Hope he can grow into more than LB in a safety's body.

 

[DHoey]

I thought the Browns should have taken Barkley at 1 and Chubb at 4 and figure out the QB later. Seems like both their picks have worked out so it's hard to say which combo would have been better.

 

[Rockinkuwait]

I think when it's all said and done and they evaluate the boom & busts of the '18 draft, Darius Leonard will have emerged as the pick of the draft. Can't really say it was a steal for the Colts, being he was the 2nd round, 36th overall pick. But he's had a season well worthy of ROY honors. Imagine, they grabbed Quinton Nelson with their 1st pick, then Leonard with the second. I'll have to have some Colt fans come in and evaluate their other selections. But in terms of talent, if all they came out of it all were these two major hits, I'd still call that one hell of a draft.

I think that has a shot at being one of those "we took a big step towards greatness today" kind of drafts. A-la the 2012 Seahawks, or 96 Ravens or even 10 Steelers/04 Chargers.

Their other big one isn't playing superb, but their tackle Smith has been a big improvement. Went from 72 hurries at those two positions (LG and RT) last year to 34 so far this year (pressures, hits, and sacks at that position cut about in half as well). 3 for 3 really.

Outside of that Turay's gotten a little pressure on QB's. Lewis got some hits on Dak a couple weeks ago. Should be D line rotational guys if not solid starters.

Both their 7th round LB's are getting some time and can play the run at least. Again rotational to solid starter.

Hines has 60 catches out of the backfield, and Wilkins is averaging 5.6 a carry as their 2nd leading rusher.

That makes 9 rookies that have started games this year. And while some of the defensive guys may only be rotational guys, that's a lot of playing time for a 9-10 win team.

Damn, I think that gets a too early A+ so far.

 

[rmilia1]

I know it's wayyyyyy too early to make any sort of final judgement on the draft. And it will be years before something is proven right or wrong. But has anyone's views changed or they are wavering on their pre-draft thoughts?

For example there was a strong belief with some that the Browns should take Barkley #1 and they can still get Rosen, Darnold, or Allen instead of Mayfield. Even with Barkley's play, I'm wondering if people still like that idea today?

Or one I had, which was I wasn't fond of the Barkley pick. (RB early, expensive and short careers). Of course if Mayfield ends up being the only true franchise QB of the class, then it's Barkley vs. Nelson, Chubb, or Ward, which isn't as big of a difference.

So with the caveat that yes, we know plenty of players have turned around awful seasons and great rookie seasons have followed with poor play, which draft thoughts are you wavering on now?


And what's your favorite move?

I am liking that Colts trade down a lot right now. Line is looking a million times better for Luck with Nelson and Smith in there (the return from the Jets). Also added a pass rusher who showed a bit of promise vs. the Cowboys, and a solid big RB that's been good in the rotation. And of course you could wonder, if they didn't have back to back picks in the 2nd round, do they address the O-line and never pick up Leonard who leads the league in tackles? Oh, and they still have an early 2nd rounder next year.

I'm Iot entirely sure that the Browns wouldn't have gotten Barkley AND Mayfield had they gone Barkley at 1. The Giants would've gone QB had Barkley been gone but there's no guarantee they go Mayfield there and the Jets ( reportedly ) liked multiple guys more than Mayfield .

Imagine if the Giants had gone Darnold, the Jets took Allen and the Browns had gotten Barkley AND Baker?? Lol.

 

[Across The Field]

Weeden was the worry, just an odd guy, who was older, but there were guys that loved him.

I remember originally I was hoping they'd end up with Richardson, Tannehill, Fleener, and Upshaw with those picks and thought that would be a really cool haul.

But I kinda liked Weeden a bit... Had the size, the throwing motion was good, footwork like all QB's had some issues but looked fine enough. Accuracy was praised, touch was talked about as a strength, enough arm strength to make NFL throws and threw solid on the run. Stepped up in the pocket on the backside rush like you want. The real issue in game was his decision making at times (and scheme, injury history and age of course).

Anyways, I'll gladly take my lumps on him... and that entire draft lol.

I remember being on the 4 letter network boards around that time talking about how big a bust he'd be, and you brought up the reasons everyone gave why I was wrong, however there were two major red flags:

1. Awful completion percentage against the blitz despite the fact that his offense was built around quick passes
2. More passes deflected at the line than any other QB in the draft despite being 6'3"

Being 28 was the nail in the coffin. Amazing how tons of random fans knew he'd be a bust but the Browns millionaire front office staff didn't. Yikes.

 

[NWPATSFAN]

Kinda not on topic, but what you are describing sounds a lot like the Bledsoe/Brady controversy, especially after Bledsoe got them the win in the AFC championship game. Rich people problems. If Foles is a two time SB champ, that's not a worry for me with both being under contract for 2019.

Well please feel free to take that to one of the many threads on that topic instead about what the World Champion Eagles are up to after their backup beat Tom Brady in the biggest game of the year. This one's more about the draft.

Proving the arrogance of a Philthy fan. They introduce SB and then claim for it to be off topic
sorry but this is no where like the Bledsoe Brady switch.

Good luck with keeping them both on the roster in 19. That finacially is stupid, will cause more controversy and runs the risk of losing both in 2020 FA. In Howie we trust

 

[NWPATSFAN]

Why take it one step at a time? This is my fantasy, not yours.

So you finally understand the difference between fantasy and reality.
How bout you focus on making the playoffs first, Skippy?

 

[Rockinkuwait]

Proving the arrogance of a Philthy fan. They introduce SB and then claim for it to be off topic
sorry but this is no where like the Bledsoe Brady switch.

Good luck with keeping them both on the roster in 19. That finacially is stupid, will cause more controversy and runs the risk of losing both in 2020 FA. In Howie we trust

Nope, just not so insecure that I'm rushing to every single thread, even those that have NOTHING to do with the Pats losing to the Eagles and bringing that up wherever you can. We get it. You can't stand that Brady couldn't beat a backup. It's ok. Play on your troll threads for that ok kiddo?


Could you please quit trolling this thread? Asking politely AGAIN.

 

[Rockinkuwait]

I'm Iot entirely sure that the Browns wouldn't have gotten Barkley AND Mayfield had they gone Barkley at 1. The Giants would've gone QB had Barkley been gone but there's no guarantee they go Mayfield there and the Jets ( reportedly ) liked multiple guys more than Mayfield .

Imagine if the Giants had gone Darnold, the Jets took Allen and the Browns had gotten Barkley AND Baker?? Lol.

Could be possible. But not many had Allen over Mayfield, so not sure the jets would have had him there. Or the Giants. Is Barkley worth the risk your franchise QB is Allen instead of Mayfield? Especially for a top 10 running team with Duke and Jarvis running the screen/short route game?

I guess for me that would be too much risk trying to get cute with the draft.

 

[Rockinkuwait]

I remember being on the 4 letter network boards around that time talking about how big a bust he'd be, and you brought up the reasons everyone gave why I was wrong, however there were two major red flags:

1. Awful completion percentage against the blitz despite the fact that his offense was built around quick passes
2. More passes deflected at the line than any other QB in the draft despite being 6'3"

Being 28 was the nail in the coffin. Amazing how tons of random fans knew he'd be a bust but the Browns millionaire front office staff didn't. Yikes.

Well, it's interesting how little really separates those guys. I mean Aaron Rodgers and Kyle Boller's scouting reports were practically the same thing. It's crazy how something that does in one QB, the next guy scouted with that same perceived fault can be a huge success.

And as far as the fans, well many find their darlings. Tebow was my favorite college athlete ever (Gator fan). Even beat out Wuerfful and Fred Taylor. But I had next to no belief he'd be successful in the NFL. And I know plenty of fellow gator fans that to this day still swear he'd win MVP if only given a shot even though he couldn't outplay a 3rd string QB at the end.

Leaf was hyped up by the fans as much as Manning. Was it because Leaf was the guy who led that Wash St team to it's first rose bowl in over 60 years, and Manning played for a Vols team that couldn't beat the Gators once and there's a lot more dislike towards SEC teams (at best a fan likes one and hates the rest), where Wash St was a cinderella?

It's kinda a crapshoot. Even while the media scouts mostly picked Manning over Leaf, it wasn't complete and many who did pick Peyton said Leaf would be their choice on the one who could be elite, but Peyton was more ready now. It's why I don't even guess on busts and booms as rookies, because not much was a tell tale sign between a top 5 all time QB and a bottom of the barrel starter all time. If I do any kind of "I want player X" it's position fit and media scout reviews.

But yes, Weeden was not good and didn't help a horrible situation.

 

[dbldwn711]

Nope, just not so insecure that I'm rushing to every single thread, even those that have NOTHING to do with the Pats losing to the Eagles and bringing that up wherever you can. We get it. You can't stand that Brady couldn't beat a backup. It's ok. Play on your troll threads for that ok kiddo?


Could you please quit trolling this thread? Asking politely AGAIN.

Fuuuuuuccccckkkkk yoooooouuuuu

 

[rmilia1]

Could be possible. But not many had Allen over Mayfield, so not sure the jets would have had him there. Or the Giants. Is Barkley worth the risk your franchise QB is Allen instead of Mayfield? Especially for a top 10 running team with Duke and Jarvis running the screen/short route game?

I guess for me that would be too much risk trying to get cute with the draft.

You're probably right but my point was that the QBS in the draft were all considered pretty equal . The top 3 all had their turn as consensus number 1 picks before the draft so it's impossible to say where the Giants and Jets had then graded so there was a chance Mayfield would've been there at 4. Conversely , as soon as Cleveland took Mayfield , there was no chance Barkley was going to be there at 4.

 

[Rockinkuwait]

You're probably right but my point was that the QBS in the draft were all considered pretty equal . The top 3 all had their turn as consensus number 1 picks before the draft so it's impossible to say where the Giants and Jets had then graded so there was a chance Mayfield would've been there at 4. Conversely , as soon as Cleveland took Mayfield , there was no chance Barkley was going to be there at 4.

True. Just shows you sometimes how tough it is to judge a QB off of maybe 10 games vs. a solid college defense. It's why I don't really debate players before the draft. I'll make a case for positions needing filled and that's about it. If the best of the best can't see much of a difference between Peyton and Leaf coming out of college, there's no way I will.

And getting Chubb who when it comes to running the football is top 3 in the league this year in my book, makes that a fine situation. Plus allowed them to get a corner who's top 10ish as a rookie (and pass D went from dead last in QB rating allowed to 4th best).

 

[mcnabb7542]

Not too late to discuss the 2019 draft if you're a Philly fan. It will give you something to do after Sunday.

Dude were going to the playoffs.....

 

[Southieinnc]

I know it's wayyyyyy too early to make any sort of final judgement on the draft. And it will be years before something is proven right or wrong. But has anyone's views changed or they are wavering on their pre-draft thoughts?

For example there was a strong belief with some that the Browns should take Barkley #1 and they can still get Rosen, Darnold, or Allen instead of Mayfield. Even with Barkley's play, I'm wondering if people still like that idea today?

Or one I had, which was I wasn't fond of the Barkley pick. (RB early, expensive and short careers). Of course if Mayfield ends up being the only true franchise QB of the class, then it's Barkley vs. Nelson, Chubb, or Ward, which isn't as big of a difference.

So with the caveat that yes, we know plenty of players have turned around awful seasons and great rookie seasons have followed with poor play, which draft thoughts are you wavering on now?


And what's your favorite move?

I am liking that Colts trade down a lot right now. Line is looking a million times better for Luck with Nelson and Smith in there (the return from the Jets). Also added a pass rusher who showed a bit of promise vs. the Cowboys, and a solid big RB that's been good in the rotation. And of course you could wonder, if they didn't have back to back picks in the 2nd round, do they address the O-line and never pick up Leonard who leads the league in tackles? Oh, and they still have an early 2nd rounder next year.

Not too soon for the Eagles!
You only have another 49 years to get it together!!!!!

 

[NWPATSFAN]

Stopp

Nope, just not so insecure that I'm rushing to every single thread, even those that have NOTHING to do with the Pats losing to the Eagles and bringing that up wherever you can. We get it. You can't stand that Brady couldn't beat a backup. It's ok. Play on your troll threads for that ok kiddo?


Could you please quit trolling this thread? Asking politely AGAIN.

Stopped reading after a Philthy fan called another fan base insecure.
You can't make this up.