This conference champion getting an automatic bid

[Ron G]

In that scenario, Oregon would almost-certainly take home all of the math-based championships, like Colley Matrix. They would have a vastly better resume, as previously detailed, so unless the game was 50-0 Notre Dame or something, yes, I believe 15-1 Oregon would deserve at least a share of the title.

Otherwise, they would be the only team in history, as far as I know, to win 15 or more games in a season and not win a championship -- and they'd have done it against the toughest schedule by far.

I got to thinking about this particular post of yours. A few years ago, did you make a chase for Gonzaga's basketball team that went undefeated and won 5 tournament games but lost the championship. Do you think they should be sharing the National Championship?

 

[dtgold88]

I got to thinking about this particular post of yours. A few years ago, did you make a chase for Gonzaga's basketball team that went undefeated and won 5 tournament games but lost the championship. Do you think they should be sharing the National Championship?

Probably a number of teams who should have shared titles under his "logic". Hell, likely some individuals, as well, as why not give tennis players shared titles if they have a far tougher route to the Final but lose to someone with an easier path?

 

[uga8766]

This is not "me thinking" that -- again, for the nth time, the NCAA officially recognizes a dozen different championship selectors, and a bunch of them consider the entire season, not just the last game.

If you don't like this, fine -- take your dispute up with the NCAA and/or the owners of those selection mechanisms. But your continued inability to process this information is borderline cognitive dissonance.

The NCAA doesn't "officially recognize" any D1 FBS champion. They keep a list of major selectors in the books, but don't endorse any of them.

 

[tc1]

You keep talking about Florida state from last year as some convoluted excuse for why you want to crown Oregon with the championship even if they lose.

No, I don't keep talking about Florida State -- but a couple other people keep bringing them up, particularly in context of "What the regular season is for".

Look, the NCAA FINALLY changed formats to allow a true playoffs and championship, and you want to now discuss flaws from the older format that they just scrapped as an excuse for ignoring the current one. I think you just like to argue.

No, the NCAA did not change the format. As repeatedly explained, ad nauseum by now, the NCCA has a dozen different official methods of selecting a national champion in the Football Bowl Subdivision, and only one is the Playoff. Also interesting to note that they didn't change the name of the Subdivision. It is not specifically not called the "Football Playoff Subdivision".

 

[tc1]

By the way, math-based championships for teams that did not win a championship of the field are only of interest to the fans of that team.

Take your dispute up with the NCAA -- who recognizes several of those math-based systems as official selectors of the National Champion ( there words, not mine ) and records those titles in their official record book.

You may not like that. In which case, lobby the NCAA to bend to your will. But denying the reality of the situation is Trumpian cognitive dissonance. Much like believing that the US economy is a bad state when unemployment recently hit a 50-year low, the stock market has broken all manner of records, and real wages are higher than they've been in many decades.

If Oregon wins out, they will rank with the best teams of all time, if not they will enter the dust bowl of history with the rest of the also rans. If Oregon loses, ten years from now only the fans of the winner and of Oregon will remember who lost '24-'25 championship.

Again, simply put, no. Oregon is very likely, maybe even assured, of being recorded in the NCAA's official record book as one of the 2024-25 National Champions.

Exactly like one can look up 2016 and find that Alabama won the Colley Matrix national championship that season, despite losing to Clemson in their final game. Again, you may not like that. You may disagree that the NCAA should consider that Tide team a national champion. It may hurt your feelings that there isn't one undisputed champion. But as far as the NCAA is considered, that is the situation. Sorry for your loss.

 

[Picklerick 2.0]

No, I don't keep talking about Florida State -- but a couple other people keep bringing them up, particularly in context of "What the regular season is for".



No, the NCAA did not change the format. As repeatedly explained, ad nauseum by now, the NCCA has a dozen different official methods of selecting a national champion in the Football Bowl Subdivision, and only one is the Playoff. Also interesting to note that they didn't change the name of the Subdivision. It is not specifically not called the "Football Playoff Subdivision".

You reek of an alt, I just can't put my finger on whom.

 

[tc1]

I got to thinking about this particular post of yours. A few years ago, did you make a chase for Gonzaga's basketball team that went undefeated and won 5 tournament games but lost the championship. Do you think they should be sharing the National Championship?

No, because there is no precedent in NCAA basketball to award a championship to anyone other than the victor at the Final Four.

This is for very good reasons -- among them, in basketball, every team has a chance to win the title after the regular season concludes. Whatever polls have occurred are completely and utterly meaningless, because every team plays in their conference tourney, and every conference tourney winner plays in the Big Dance. A few teams get a second shot with an at-large bid, but every team can win the title, if they embark on a ~10 game winning streak at the right time.

NCAA football, on the other hand, is a completely different animal for a raft of reasons. I would've thought you'd know this.

 

[dtgold88]

No, I don't keep talking about Florida State -- but a couple other people keep bringing them up, particularly in context of "What the regular season is for".



No, the NCAA did not change the format. As repeatedly explained, ad nauseum by now, the NCCA has a dozen different official methods of selecting a national champion in the Football Bowl Subdivision, and only one is the Playoff. Also interesting to note that they didn't change the name of the Subdivision. It is not specifically not called the "Football Playoff Subdivision".

at this point I just hope you are messing with us. If so, congrats as you had me. If not? Just wow.

 

[dtgold88]

No, because there is no precedent in NCAA basketball to award a championship to anyone other than the victor at the Final Four.

This is for very good reasons -- among them, in basketball, every team has a chance to win the title after the regular season concludes. Whatever polls have occurred are completely and utterly meaningless, because every team plays in their conference tourney, and every conference tourney winner plays in the Big Dance. A few teams get a second shot with an at-large bid, but every team can win the title, if they embark on a ~10 game winning streak at the right time.

NCAA football, on the other hand, is a completely different animal for a raft of reasons. I would've thought you'd know this.

I would have thought you'd know one of those reasons is football not exactly a sport you could have a tourney with every team in each conference after the season as cannot exactly play on consecutive days, let alone 3-4 days in a row. Or are you thinking they should play until February or March?

again, are you being serious with your cries?

 

[Ron G]

No, because there is no precedent in NCAA basketball to award a championship to anyone other than the victor at the Final Four.

This is for very good reasons -- among them, in basketball, every team has a chance to win the title after the regular season concludes. Whatever polls have occurred are completely and utterly meaningless, because every team plays in their conference tourney, and every conference tourney winner plays in the Big Dance. A few teams get a second shot with an at-large bid, but every team can win the title, if they embark on a ~10 game winning streak at the right time.

NCAA football, on the other hand, is a completely different animal for a raft of reasons. I would've thought you'd know this.

But the final point is that nobody cares about the other polls after the playoff is concluded. Just as virtually no one (except the school and the family) can name who won the Best Player, MVP or any other individual award if that person did not win the Heisman Trophy. Who won the Defensive Player of the Year in 2014, (or ','16'17'18'19' etc.)

 

[tc1]

I would have thought you'd know one of those reasons is football not exactly a sport you could have a tourney with every team in each conference after the season as cannot exactly play on consecutive days, let alone 3-4 days in a row. Or are you thinking they should play until February or March?

As I literally just wrote "NCAA football, on the other hand, is a completely different animal for a raft of reasons."

As previously suggested, please read before commenting. If some words are unknown to you, look them up first.

 

[tc1]

But the final point is that nobody cares about the other polls after the playoff is concluded.

For wildly-varying definitions of "nobody". The NCAA cares enough to record those other champions in their record book. It's official: NCAA recognizes UCF's national championship in record book

Just as virtually no one (except the school and the family) can name who won the Best Player, MVP or any other individual award if that person did not win the Heisman Trophy. Who won the Defensive Player of the Year in 2014, (or ','16'17'18'19' etc.)

That's an entirely different can of worms, since those are different awards. We were discussing National Championship teams, which is the same award.

 

[Ron G]

For wildly-varying definitions of "nobody". The NCAA cares enough to record those other champions in their record book. It's official: NCAA recognizes UCF's national championship in record book



That's an entirely different can of worms, since those are different awards. We were discussing National Championship teams, which is the same award.

The AP and Coaches polls only have a national championship because they say they do. Any organization can claim to announce a championship and if it is a team different than the playoff winner, that team can hang the banner. Won't mean anything but they could hang it. Not sure Oregon would be hanging a banner if they lose in the playoffs and the AP voted them as co-champions (won't happen).

 

[tc1]

Any organization can claim to announce a championship and if it is a team different than the playoff winner, that team can hang the banner.

Yes, but only a dozen are (currently) recognized by the NCAA and recorded in their official record book. And those dozen do not always award the winner of the last game -- which has been my point all along.