The PAC12 THREAD v.2

[RegentDenali]

Oregon LB Tyrell Robinson has been granted a release from the school. He's the twin brother of Tyree Robinson who still remains at UofO as of now.

Tyrell was credited with 12 tackles as a true freshman.

Tyree was a redshirt last year and projected to get playing time in the Ducks backfield this fall as a safety.


The twins were heavily recruited by USC and Washington as well before they signed with Oregon as part of the 2013 class.

 

[mcnabb7542]

Oregon LB Tyrell Robinson has been granted a release from the school. He's the twin brother of Tyree Robinson who still remains at UofO as of now.

Tyrell was credited with 12 tackles as a true freshman.

Tyree was a redshirt last year and projected to get playing time in the Ducks backfield this fall as a safety.


The twins were heavily recruited by USC and Washington as well before they signed with Oregon as part of the 2013 class.

Huh, it didn't give a reason as to why he was leaving?

 

[RegentDenali]

Huh, it didn't give a reason as to why he was leaving?

No reason was provided yet. He'd most likely have to sit a year if he transfers to another PAC school.

 

[963BUSC]

No reason was provided yet. He'd most likely have to sit a year if he transfers to another PAC school.

I thought it 2 was years to another PAC school and 1 year outside of the PAC unless he got a waiver?

 

[Olyduck]

since he is true right now, he still has a redshirt year. so he could transfer and still have 3 years

 

[Olyduck]

word is he got in some trouble. most likely academic since there hasnt been bigger news. some say he was kind of lazy as well so he wasnt working as hard as those around him. I dont know how much is true but thats the rumors.

 

[RegentDenali]

I thought it 2 was years to another PAC school and 1 year outside of the PAC unless he got a waiver?

One year is the transfer rule. Not two.

Wherever he goes, he'll have to sit out the 2014 season and probably spring 2015 camp, but he would be available to play in fall camp and 2015 season for wherever he transfers, PAC or another conf.

The only scenarios where you can transfer an play the same year is for a "family hardship" case and the NCAA rules on it on a case by case basis. Like say a parent gets sick or dies, and the athlete asks to move back closer to home.

 

[WizardHawk]

Report: Pac-12 coaches ?bemoaned' Huskies' aggressive recruiting in 2013 | Husky Football Blog | Seattle Times

Virtually all major programs host a summer camp, and historically those are a nice way for a program’s assistant coaches to earn a little extra money while also instructing and scouting area talent. But some coaches see the summer camps turning into a “new arms race among high-resource schools.”

There are no NCAA limits on what a football program can pay an on-field guest coach at a summer camp. (Per NCAA rules, basketball coaches aren’t allowed to work a camp if they have a connection to a prospect.)

Washington, under then-coach Steve Sarkisian, paid a total of $32,588.60 to its 29-person coaching staff for its Rising Stars camp in 2013, an average of $1,123.74 per coach, according to the report.

Florida State paid 141 camp coaches nearly $71,000; Ohio State paid 147 coaches more than $50,000 combined; Oregon paid $3,000 for 20 coaches, an average of $150 per coach.

According to the report, some Pac-12 coaches “privately bemoaned Washington’s aggressive approach to summer recruiting in 2013, but a Washington spokesman said the school is unaware of any formal Pac-12 complaints filed to the school.”



So most bigger programs are paying crazy good money for highschool coaches to assist in their camps and bring their best kids with them. Oregon too broke after paying recruiting services to afford it?

Seriously, now that Sark has gone where he belongs I'm sure we won't see anything that far gone again from Petersen. Still, this is just another example of how teams with money to burn find ways of taking advantages over the schools that barely get by.

Anyone see any real problem with this? Shady but OK? Should be stopped? You make the call.

 

[4down20]

Report: Pac-12 coaches ?bemoaned' Huskies' aggressive recruiting in 2013 | Husky Football Blog | Seattle Times

Virtually all major programs host a summer camp, and historically those are a nice way for a program’s assistant coaches to earn a little extra money while also instructing and scouting area talent. But some coaches see the summer camps turning into a “new arms race among high-resource schools.”

There are no NCAA limits on what a football program can pay an on-field guest coach at a summer camp. (Per NCAA rules, basketball coaches aren’t allowed to work a camp if they have a connection to a prospect.)

Washington, under then-coach Steve Sarkisian, paid a total of $32,588.60 to its 29-person coaching staff for its Rising Stars camp in 2013, an average of $1,123.74 per coach, according to the report.

Florida State paid 141 camp coaches nearly $71,000; Ohio State paid 147 coaches more than $50,000 combined; Oregon paid $3,000 for 20 coaches, an average of $150 per coach.

According to the report, some Pac-12 coaches “privately bemoaned Washington’s aggressive approach to summer recruiting in 2013, but a Washington spokesman said the school is unaware of any formal Pac-12 complaints filed to the school.”



So most bigger programs are paying crazy good money for highschool coaches to assist in their camps and bring their best kids with them. Oregon too broke after paying recruiting services to afford it?

Seriously, now that Sark has gone where he belongs I'm sure we won't see anything that far gone again from Petersen. Still, this is just another example of how teams with money to burn find ways of taking advantages over the schools that barely get by.

Anyone see any real problem with this? Shady but OK? Should be stopped? You make the call.

 

[socaljim242]

Report: Pac-12 coaches ?bemoaned' Huskies' aggressive recruiting in 2013 | Husky Football Blog | Seattle Times

Virtually all major programs host a summer camp, and historically those are a nice way for a program’s assistant coaches to earn a little extra money while also instructing and scouting area talent. But some coaches see the summer camps turning into a “new arms race among high-resource schools.”

There are no NCAA limits on what a football program can pay an on-field guest coach at a summer camp. (Per NCAA rules, basketball coaches aren’t allowed to work a camp if they have a connection to a prospect.)

Washington, under then-coach Steve Sarkisian, paid a total of $32,588.60 to its 29-person coaching staff for its Rising Stars camp in 2013, an average of $1,123.74 per coach, according to the report.

Florida State paid 141 camp coaches nearly $71,000; Ohio State paid 147 coaches more than $50,000 combined; Oregon paid $3,000 for 20 coaches, an average of $150 per coach.

According to the report, some Pac-12 coaches “privately bemoaned Washington’s aggressive approach to summer recruiting in 2013, but a Washington spokesman said the school is unaware of any formal Pac-12 complaints filed to the school.”



So most bigger programs are paying crazy good money for highschool coaches to assist in their camps and bring their best kids with them. Oregon too broke after paying recruiting services to afford it?

Seriously, now that Sark has gone where he belongs I'm sure we won't see anything that far gone again from Petersen. Still, this is just another example of how teams with money to burn find ways of taking advantages over the schools that barely get by.

Anyone see any real problem with this? Shady but OK? Should be stopped? You make the call.

It's hard to determine whats "shady". People get paid in different ways and can be paid in other ways ( we all know that). If Oregon had 20 coaches and washingtom had 29 coaches what are TOSU and Florida State doing different that they need 147 and 141 coaches? if it's for the same amount of camps then the washington and Oregon coaches are doing much more. Which tells me maybe washinton is actually doing things correctly and paying the coaches fairly and Oregon is trying to look clean by paying them little which personally makes them look like they are hiding something. I hear Notre Dame is now starting to do satellite camps in other states. So look for a Bama camp to be in Los Angeles in the near future and a USC camp in Florida as long as there's big money to be made schools and coaches will push the envelope.

 

[mcnabb7542]

word is he got in some trouble. most likely academic since there hasnt been bigger news. some say he was kind of lazy as well so he wasnt working as hard as those around him. I dont know how much is true but thats the rumors.

I know it's rumors but if it's true he better go try out for Division II nobody is gonna put up with that....

 

[trojanfan12]

Report: Pac-12 coaches ?bemoaned' Huskies' aggressive recruiting in 2013 | Husky Football Blog | Seattle Times

Virtually all major programs host a summer camp, and historically those are a nice way for a program’s assistant coaches to earn a little extra money while also instructing and scouting area talent. But some coaches see the summer camps turning into a “new arms race among high-resource schools.”

There are no NCAA limits on what a football program can pay an on-field guest coach at a summer camp. (Per NCAA rules, basketball coaches aren’t allowed to work a camp if they have a connection to a prospect.)

Washington, under then-coach Steve Sarkisian, paid a total of $32,588.60 to its 29-person coaching staff for its Rising Stars camp in 2013, an average of $1,123.74 per coach, according to the report.

Florida State paid 141 camp coaches nearly $71,000; Ohio State paid 147 coaches more than $50,000 combined; Oregon paid $3,000 for 20 coaches, an average of $150 per coach.

According to the report, some Pac-12 coaches “privately bemoaned Washington’s aggressive approach to summer recruiting in 2013, but a Washington spokesman said the school is unaware of any formal Pac-12 complaints filed to the school.”



So most bigger programs are paying crazy good money for highschool coaches to assist in their camps and bring their best kids with them. Oregon too broke after paying recruiting services to afford it?

Seriously, now that Sark has gone where he belongs I'm sure we won't see anything that far gone again from Petersen. Still, this is just another example of how teams with money to burn find ways of taking advantages over the schools that barely get by.

Anyone see any real problem with this? Shady but OK? Should be stopped? You make the call.

I don't mind the camps. It can be good for the players to get the extra exposure. However, I'd like to see a "salary cap" of sorts to limit how much a school can pay coaches. Just to throw a number out there, set a limit at $30k and then the program can decide if the want to pay fewer coaches more money or vice versa.

 

[Olyduck]

One year is the transfer rule. Not two.

Wherever he goes, he'll have to sit out the 2014 season and probably spring 2015 camp, but he would be available to play in fall camp and 2015 season for wherever he transfers, PAC or another conf.

The only scenarios where you can transfer an play the same year is for a "family hardship" case and the NCAA rules on it on a case by case basis. Like say a parent gets sick or dies, and the athlete asks to move back closer to home.

You are all kinds of wrong on this.
NCAA rules are 1 year out. Unless as you said they get a waiver but there are other waivers besides family hardship. Medical hardships are also possible. Graduate from a school and go to a masters program if your original school didnt offer it. Your school drops football. your school drops your declared major.

Pac has different rules for intraconference transfers. Unless granted a waiver from the confernece (unsure if it is the conference or just both schools involved) then they must sit out an extra year. there are other exemptions but I dont want to outline all of them.

 

[WizardHawk]

It's hard to determine whats "shady". People get paid in different ways and can be paid in other ways ( we all know that). If Oregon had 20 coaches and washingtom had 29 coaches what are TOSU and Florida State doing different that they need 147 and 141 coaches? if it's for the same amount of camps then the washington and Oregon coaches are doing much more. Which tells me maybe washinton is actually doing things correctly and paying the coaches fairly and Oregon is trying to look clean by paying them little which personally makes them look like they are hiding something. I hear Notre Dame is now starting to do satellite camps in other states. So look for a Bama camp to be in Los Angeles in the near future and a USC camp in Florida as long as there's big money to be made schools and coaches will push the envelope.

Or they just don't feel the need to pay large sums to get the kids they are interested (via their HS coaches) on campus. Last I checked Oregon doesn't have any problems getting kids to visit and accept offers.

I'd be interested to know what they paid for coaches at camps prior to the investigation into their program.

Doesn't surprise me that the Pac coaches were raising their eyebrows over Sark's perhaps a little overboard pay/use of that camp system. Lots of bitching among the schools and always has been. Kind of the hallmark of the Pac to be honest.

I don't really have anything against it to be honest. Anyone wishing for some sort of cap or other way of controlling it are ignoring how the body that governs those things has already botched up badly everything they are in charge of overseeing. Why on earth would we want to add more to their plate?

The schools with the riches are always going to have more ways of taking advantage of it over those that don't. What's really wrong with that? It isn't an even or fair playing field and never has been in the entire history of college football. Stop trying to reach that and accept that there will always be a divide and yet we all still enjoy the product as is.

Want to fix college football? You won't make it better by adding more regulations and attempting to level the financial playing field. Start by giving us real football back. Quit making this more and more similar to flag football every year. That's where you start.

 

[trojanfan12]

I agree that the playing field isn't even and never has been, but that doesn't mean you don't even it out where you can.


For example, a program like USC is pretty much always going to attract more talented players than a school like Utah because of "built in advantages". Nothing wrong with that advantage, it's kids making choices based on traditions, history, location, number of hot chicks, etc., etc. There isn't much that can be done about that.


However, by capping how much a program can spend on these camps, it keeps a school like USC from adding to it's "built in advantages".

I also agree about bringing back "real football". I'm all for player safety, but some of the rule changes are pretty ridiculous and I can see where they can actually lead to more injury.

 

[WizardHawk]

I agree that the playing field isn't even and never has been, but that doesn't mean you don't even it out where you can.


For example, a program like USC is pretty much always going to attract more talented players than a school like Utah because of "built in advantages". Nothing wrong with that advantage, it's kids making choices based on traditions, history, location, number of hot chicks, etc., etc. There isn't much that can be done about that.


However, by capping how much a program can spend on these camps, it keeps a school like USC from adding to it's "built in advantages".

I also agree about bringing back "real football". I'm all for player safety, but some of the rule changes are pretty ridiculous and I can see where they can actually lead to more injury.

I'm not saying have no rules at all, but the purpose of many of them is to help the lower tier teams cope with their severe disadvantage. WSU will never have the money or attraction of USC and no regulations will ever come close to balancing that out. But WSU will always have a massive advantage over middle Tennessee or even their neighbor, Idaho.

The so-called power 5 should break off and have a new governing set of rules that reflects a much much higher floor than those lower tier mid majors. Keep the scholarship caps and the basic recruiting rules, but allow things like these camps and even more compensation for players.

I just don't think we need more regulations when the NCAA can't fairly deal with the ones they are already in charge of.

 

[Olyduck]

You are all kinds of wrong on this.
NCAA rules are 1 year out. Unless as you said they get a waiver but there are other waivers besides family hardship. Medical hardships are also possible. Graduate from a school and go to a masters program if your original school didnt offer it. Your school drops football. your school drops your declared major.

Pac has different rules for intraconference transfers. Unless granted a waiver from the confernece (unsure if it is the conference or just both schools involved) then they must sit out an extra year. there are other exemptions but I dont want to outline all of them.

On top of all that, if the rumors are true and there are some academic issues it will also be a matter of going where he qualifies.

 

[WizardHawk]

On top of all that, if the rumors are true and there are some academic issues it will also be a matter of going where he qualifies.

Right, so he's on his way to WSU then?

 

[963BUSC]

One year is the transfer rule. Not two.

Wherever he goes, he'll have to sit out the 2014 season and probably spring 2015 camp, but he would be available to play in fall camp and 2015 season for wherever he transfers, PAC or another conf.

The only scenarios where you can transfer an play the same year is for a "family hardship" case and the NCAA rules on it on a case by case basis. Like say a parent gets sick or dies, and the athlete asks to move back closer to home.

The PAC 12 has an additional 1 year penalty if transferring between two Pac 12 schools which may be applied before serving the 1 year penalty for the NCAA. At least that's my reading of the rules.

If you intend to transfer directly from one Pac-12 school to another and have​

previously attended or participated in practice there you may be subject to the​

Pac-12 Intra-Conference Transfer Rule. This rule’s penalty requires that you ful​

​

​

​

!ll​

one academic year of residence and lose one season of competition in all sports​

before being eligible to compete. You also may not receive athletically related​

​

​

​

!nancial​

aid during this period of ineligibility.

....

​

If a more stringent Pac-12 rule applies to your case, its penalties and requirements will be applied before (and sometimes concurrently with) restrictions that result from the application of NCAA rules.​

​

​

​

http://compliance.pac-10.org/thetools/4yrtrans.pdf​

 

[RegentDenali]

You are all kinds of wrong on this.
NCAA rules are 1 year out. Unless as you said they get a waiver but there are other waivers besides family hardship. Medical hardships are also possible. Graduate from a school and go to a masters program if your original school didnt offer it. Your school drops football. your school drops your declared major.

Pac has different rules for intraconference transfers. Unless granted a waiver from the confernece (unsure if it is the conference or just both schools involved) then they must sit out an extra year. there are other exemptions but I dont want to outline all of them.

Yes, there are other scenarios for transfer waivers besides family hardship and should of worded that better, but that's the primary one attempted.

That being said, yes, the PAC does add another layer of penalties with its own intra conf transfer rules, but I thought that when the PAC says you have to sit out a year, it was reenforcing the NCAA 1 year sitout, not adding an additional year on top of it.

Where the PAC intra conf transfer rules is harsh is what it takes away with financial aid and eligiblity.

”If you intend to transfer directly from one Pac-12 school to another and have previously attended or participated in practice there you may be subject to the Pac-12 Intra-Conference Transfer Rule. This rule’s penalty requires that you fulfill one academic year of residence and lose one season of competition in all sports before being eligible to compete. You also may not receive athletically related financial aid during this period of ineligibility.”

An exception is that a transferring student-athlete may apply for a reduction of the penalty, including elimination of the ban on athletically related financial aid. But that must be approved by nine of the 12 Pac-12 faculty representatives, and it seems likely to be many would not want to encourage intra-conference transfers.