THE PAC 12 THREAD v.5

[socaljim242]

I read an article today predicting that both Juju and Adoree will leave for the NFL. Although, the author did point out that Adoree is likely to be a 2nd day selection. He said that the injury he suffered in the Rose Bowl and his lack of interest in track this year seem to indicate he will leave.

Imo, the only reason for Adoree to not declare would be if the NFL is looking to draft him to play offense. He may decide to come back for a bigger role on offense next year to showcase those talents. His lack of interest in track could be to dedicate himself entirely to football and improve his stock for the next draft.

However, I think he leaves.

According to the article, Juju has made comments that sound like he's looking to leave, which is strange because the only quotes I've seen attributed to him say that he will follow Adoree's lead. He looks to be a 1st round pick and there really isn't much reason for him to come back. He's battled injuries this year and last. There isn't really much left for him to develop or prove at the college level.

I think he leaves. If you're going to battle injuries, might as well get paid for it.

Damien Mama should stay. If he declares, he'll be a late pick and he needs more time in the weight room to slim down some more and raise his stock.

Chris Hawkins should also stay. He would be a very late pick or possibly even go undrafted. He can help himself by returning and having a solid season next year.

Now watch Adoree and Juju stay while Hawkins and Mama declare. lol

Juju I wish would stay but it's just for selfish reasons. We keep losing the best WR as a JR seems like every year, Woods, Lee, Ahlghor. But he's been hit with nagging injuries so I think it's time for him to go. Adoree is lined up to become a college football all time great if he comes back. I think he would benifit from a Hesiman type season and get into the first round next year. I think he would be a weapon as a slot type receiver in the pros as well as kickoff and punt return more than at CB I think.
I think USC loses the long snapper this year. I dont know if you saw his youtube video he made while he was getting recruited but its pretty cool. I don't recall any bad snaps on feild goals and punts this year and he was money on that last second field goal in the Rose Bowl. Just as much pressure on him .

 

[Olyduck]

It's just hard to recapture the Magic. It's the same as USC fans wishing Pete would come back. Things don't always go like you think they will. Time to move on.

2nd bites at the apple rarely work out. In his first stint at USC, John Robinson went 67-14-2. Won a national championship, 3 PAC titles outright, 3 Rose Bowls and had a Heisman Trophy winner. His teams never finished ranked lower than #15 in the nation.

In his 2nd stint, he went 37-21-2 with 0 National Championships, 2 shared PAC titles and 1 Rose Bowl win. His teams never finished higher than 12th and went 12-11 in his last 2 seasons.

As @socaljim242 pointed out, it's very difficult to recapture that magic. The game changes and teams are more prepared for what that particular coach brings.

Im talking about saying other teams figured it out. that might be partly true but they figured it out when it was different. after chip. after Alliotti. how long could Chip have kept going had he stayed vs how long Helfrich carried it.
if you hadn't figured it out by now I didn't want chip back when OD thought it was gonna happen the first time.

 

[socaljim242]

Im talking about saying other teams figured it out. that might be partly true but they figured it out when it was different. after chip. after Alliotti. how long could Chip have kept going had he stayed vs how long Helfrich carried it.
if you hadn't figured it out by now I didn't want chip back when OD thought it was gonna happen the first time.

Nothing goes on forever. The wishbone was running wild till linebackers got quicker and teams figured out they just had to funnel the play towards the middle. With Chips teams there was a learning curve but it became the norm to ad safeties or smaller linebackers who could cover as well as stop the run. The fact is most big schools still recruited bigger players while Oregon was getting smaller and faster. Once pros started playing more spread type offenses then players with speed and quickness were being recruited rather than just size then players like USCs Su'a Cravens were placed in as linebackers rather than saftey. It was just a matter of time before teams played Chips teams better.
Paul Westhead tried this in basketball and it worked till teams figured out how to play his teams.

 

[trojanfan12]

Im talking about saying other teams figured it out. that might be partly true but they figured it out when it was different. after chip. after Alliotti. how long could Chip have kept going had he stayed vs how long Helfrich carried it.
if you hadn't figured it out by now I didn't want chip back when OD thought it was gonna happen the first time.

Honestly, I doubt Chip could have sustained it that much longer. Teams were starting to figure it out. That's a big part of the reason Oregon was never able to finish their seasons with NC's.

I'm not saying things would have gotten as bad as they were this year under Chip, but every offensive or defensive innovation that teams come up with, eventually gets figured out.

I know you didn't want Chip to come back, most sane and rational Ducks fans didn't. I think partially because they didn't think he could recapture the magic as easily as OD thinks he could and also because he had brought NCAA scrutiny on the program and hiring him back would bring that scrutiny back.

 

[TheDayMan]

when was Washington on sanctions? I always attributed it to Willingham

Willingham/Hedges

 

[OregonDucks]

meh sort of. Its hard to say what would have happened if Chip stayed and Alliotti leaving hurt the defense too. Kelly might have made a better hire than Helfrich promoting Pellum.

I give the defenses rise during Chip's days to Jerry Azzinaro who was a monster D-Line coach.

It isn't a coincidence that Oregon's defense got good when Azzinaro joined the staff. Alliotti was a headache for most of his time at Oregon and he only started to look good when Chip was promoted to HC, which was when Azzinaro was hired as well.

 

[WizardHawk]

Willingham/Hedges

More Hedges IMO. She minced no words in having more focus on women's sports and the title 9 crap than care about either the mens basketball or football programs. Sure, she was there when the stadium reno project was started, but her coaches and how she handled them were awful.

 

[Olyduck]

More Hedges IMO. She minced no words in having more focus on women's sports and the title 9 crap than care about either the mens basketball or football programs. Sure, she was there when the stadium reno project was started, but her coaches and how she handled them were awful.

to be fair haven't their been more UW national championships for womens sports than mens in the last 20, 15, 10 years?

 

[Olyduck]

to be fair haven't their been more UW national championships for womens sports than mens in the last 20, 15, 10 years?

I looked it up UW has no Mens team NCAA titles. 7 womens titles.

 

[WizardHawk]

to be fair haven't their been more UW national championships for womens sports than mens in the last 20, 15, 10 years?

Maybe, but who the hell cares? I've always been clear that I couldn't care less about championships in any sport outside of football and basketball. They just don't interest me in any way. I mean good on them? But they killed the bread and butter for the entire athletic department funding. If you are THAT much into women's sports then why on earth wouldn't you push to keep the football at the highest possible level knowing it funds that other garbage?

 

[963BUSC]

I was reading through the predictions for the Rose Bowl by Penn State fans. I'm surprised at how many of them would have nailed it if Penn State had converted that last third down with around 2 minutes to play.

I read a lot of shoot out predictions with SC jumps ahead to a two touchdown lead, Penn State comes back to make it a 1 TD game at half time and then pulls ahead by a couple of touch downs in the third quarter. Both teams trade TD's in the fourth quarter seemed to be the most common. They really have a lot of knowledgeable fans. Glad they were off by a couple of minutes.

 

[wazzu31]

I looked it up UW has no Mens team NCAA titles. 7 womens titles.

And all the fans that attending those women's events wouldn't fill up the Mistake by the Lake...women sports are intermural athletics with nicer uniforms.

 

[963BUSC]

And all the fans that attending those women's events wouldn't fill up the Mistake by the Lake...women sports are intermural athletics with nicer uniforms.

I don't mind watching these ladies play at all.

 

[WizardHawk]

Watching them play and caring about titles are two different things. Who doesn't like watching some ladies volleyball. Just doesn't matter if they bring in titles to me. Like I think our ladies golf team won a title? And I couldn't give a shit less. It's golf ffs.

That's the only legacy Hedges brought to UW. Killed the football program but improved ladies sports. Fuck that bitch.

 

[WizardHawk]

We had discussions last year about head coaching desirability ranking in the Pac. Did any of this years results change your views on that list? Saw quite a few rank Oregon fairly high not just because of Nike money, but because of the hot hand and now that they are ice cold does that drop the desirability at all? Stanford moving at all? Did Colorado go up above some of the other lower teams now?

I mean we can all agree USC is the top and no one else is ever going to really challenge them. Well, outside of maybe OD anyway.

If every job in the Pac were open at the same time, which ones would fill in what order?

USC - Obvious, not debatable.
UW - Sure, homer pick but the home of the greatest setting in college football/High academics/In major city with lots to do/Program on the rise with a lot of talent already there/AD fully committed to supporting football.

Harder after that for me. Stanford has built a hell of a program but has real academic restrictions that challenge their ability to fully recruit. UCLA has a massive disadvantage from being so close to USC and are known as a basketball school. Utah has a lot going for it with a rabid fan base, salt lake city isn't small town USA, and has a rich history.

I'd still have to put Oregon 3rd probably, for now. Nike money, still top facilities with way over the top extras, and a recent history of some success. They have to get back to winning or their stock will continue to fall.

Utah
UCLA
Stanford

Arizona State - Might be worth putting higher if they had more success and better athletes right now to take over
Colorado - Not a lot of direct competition for local recruits and has the history, but been down for too long
Arizona - Basketball school
Cal - Not much fan support even when winning
Oregon State - Small town competing with big brother across the state for scraps in recruting
WSU - Even smaller and more remote also competing not only with UW, but Boise State for recruits.

What you got.

 

[socaljim242]

We had discussions last year about head coaching desirability ranking in the Pac. Did any of this years results change your views on that list? Saw quite a few rank Oregon fairly high not just because of Nike money, but because of the hot hand and now that they are ice cold does that drop the desirability at all? Stanford moving at all? Did Colorado go up above some of the other lower teams now?

I mean we can all agree USC is the top and no one else is ever going to really challenge them. Well, outside of maybe OD anyway.

If every job in the Pac were open at the same time, which ones would fill in what order?

USC - Obvious, not debatable.
UW - Sure, homer pick but the home of the greatest setting in college football/High academics/In major city with lots to do/Program on the rise with a lot of talent already there/AD fully committed to supporting football.

Harder after that for me. Stanford has built a hell of a program but has real academic restrictions that challenge their ability to fully recruit. UCLA has a massive disadvantage from being so close to USC and are known as a basketball school. Utah has a lot going for it with a rabid fan base, salt lake city isn't small town USA, and has a rich history.

I'd still have to put Oregon 3rd probably, for now. Nike money, still top facilities with way over the top extras, and a recent history of some success. They have to get back to winning or their stock will continue to fall.

Utah
UCLA
Stanford

Arizona State - Might be worth putting higher if they had more success and better athletes right now to take over
Colorado - Not a lot of direct competition for local recruits and has the history, but been down for too long
Arizona - Basketball school
Cal - Not much fan support even when winning
Oregon State - Small town competing with big brother across the state for scraps in recruting
WSU - Even smaller and more remote also competing not only with UW, but Boise State for recruits.

What you got.

Pretty much nailed it. Id put Stanford up higher than UCLA now. With Harbaugh recently and Shaw talked about as possible NFL material I think it's got a higher profile than UCLA at the moment.

 

[WizardHawk]

Pretty much nailed it. Id put Stanford up higher than UCLA now. With Harbaugh recently and Shaw talked about as possible NFL material I think it's got a higher profile than UCLA at the moment.

I always struggle with Stanford because of the academics requirements and what downside that might have to incoming HC candidates. I mean they also have the opposite draw at times. We might have lost a kid that was a verbal to us after Stanford offered because of that added level of education so it can help them at times. I wouldn't argue if someone put them above Utah.

 

[socaljim242]

I was reading through the predictions for the Rose Bowl by Penn State fans. I'm surprised at how many of them would have nailed it if Penn State had converted that last third down with around 2 minutes to play.

I read a lot of shoot out predictions with SC jumps ahead to a two touchdown lead, Penn State comes back to make it a 1 TD game at half time and then pulls ahead by a couple of touch downs in the third quarter. Both teams trade TD's in the fourth quarter seemed to be the most common. They really have a lot of knowledgeable fans. Glad they were off by a couple of minutes.

One thing though. If you read Penn State boards after the game they all think that Penn State lost it in the fourth quarter by playing not to lose.I see USC finally got some plays and stops on defense and Darnold went ten for ten with Penn State defenders all over and around him.The Wrs were money too. Not only was Darnolds passes right where they needed to be the WRs were where they were supposed to be. The Penn State QB seemed to be chucking it up all night and hoping his WR would come down with it. To me thats why they lost. You can't live on that all day. The better coached offense played the best in the fourth.

 

[socaljim242]

I always struggle with Stanford because of the academics requirements and what downside that might have to incoming HC candidates. I mean they also have the opposite draw at times. We might have lost a kid that was a verbal to us after Stanford offered because of that added level of education so it can help them at times. I wouldn't argue if someone put them above Utah.

Yeah they do have their requirements which limits the pool of players they can take but they also are one of the few schools a good player who is really wanting better academics can go and still play big boy football.

 

[wazzu31]

I don't mind watching these ladies play at all.

Mostly definitely would watch on tv, but not spending money on them. I took my kids to a Storm game and it was the last time I ever spend a cent on that crap.