The NBA rookies Thread

[trojanfan12]

Nothing to worry about though. Pretty good company on that list. Ok, so I have no idea who any of those guys are.

I don't care about his FG% in a 12 game sample. That is a pretty meaningless stat. What does have meaning is the fact that many questioned his shooting form/ability before he was even drafted and the early results seem to indicate that he can't shoot.

The good news is that Lonzo is extremely coordinated. In time, he can certainly overcome this. But, he probably should spend his first NBA off season relearning how to shoot.

Hell, I will volunteer to spend the summer working with him for a small price $100K would do it. I have fixed more broken jump shots than his.

Exactly. He could get away with that long, weird windup that he has in college. But in the NBA, players get there to contest shots a lot quicker which means he has to shoot it quicker. I think he knows that and is trying to use the same motion, only faster. At least that's what it looks like to me.

I think he needs to have that shot completely broken down and re-taught, step by step, as if he were a freshman in high school.

 

[mr.hockey4242]

Not really. His passing is spot on, he keeps the offense moving, he's been playing surprisingly good team defense, his handles are fine, and he's only averaging 2.5 turnovers per game.

His shot needs work and lots of it. But for people to act like he's a bust because he can't shoot is an overreaction because of his Dad.

Chances are that he will never be a great shooter. That's fine. The Lakers don't need him to be a great shooter, but they do need him to develop a shot that is good enough that opponents can't just play off of him. Fortunately, he's 19 and only 11 games into his career. So he has time.

I quoted your post directly related to his shot. Which you quoted a stat directly related to his shot.

His shooting goes beyond struggling. It's historically bad.

 

[trojanfan12]

I quoted your post directly related to his shot. Which you quoted a stat directly related to his shot.

His shooting goes beyond struggling. It's historically bad.

12 games into his career, it's struggling. A couple of seasons into his career and still having the same issues, then it goes beyond struggling.

 

[Sparhawk]

Through December 2016, Ingram was only hitting 34.7% of his field goals.
He wound up at 40% by the end of the season.

The speed of the game has not affected his defense or passing.
If he hasn't been getting his shot blocked routinely, then it's possibly more mental than physical.

 

[Mecca of the “B” Team]

Can I just point out a couple of things that I think play a big part in Lonzo's struggles?

1. Obviously, he is struggling with his shot. There is no debating that. But, anyone who thought he was really the next Magic Johnson has never seen him play. Nothing in his past suggested he was going to be a scorer. If you got caught up in the Lavar hype, shame on you for not being better informed.

2. Brook Lopez has been a major disappointment. He is scoring 5 ppg fewer than he did on a shitbird Nets team. Yes, his minutes are down. But, that's because he has been AWFUL on the boards, which is normal, and he's slow as fuck.

Brook was supposed to lead this team in scoring, which would open the floor up for Lonzo and Ingram, who has also been slow to develop.

If you draft a pass first, second, third and then maaaaaaaaaaaybe you'll shoot later pg and you don't give him players that can score, you shouldn't be surprised when he struggles.

 

[trojanfan12]

Can I just point out a couple of things that I think play a big part in Lonzo's struggles?

1. Obviously, he is struggling with his shot. There is no debating that. But, anyone who thought he was really the next Magic Johnson has never seen him play. Nothing in his past suggested he was going to be a scorer. If you got caught up in the Lavar hype, shame on you for not being better informed.

2. Brook Lopez has been a major disappointment. He is scoring 5 ppg fewer than he did on a shitbird Nets team. Yes, his minutes are down. But, that's because he has been AWFUL on the boards, which is normal, and he's slow as fuck.

Brook was supposed to lead this team in scoring, which would open the floor up for Lonzo and Ingram, who has also been slow to develop.

If you draft a pass first, second, third and then maaaaaaaaaaaybe you'll shoot later pg and you don't give him players that can score, you shouldn't be surprised when he struggles.

Agree about Lonzo. Dude definitely needs to work on his shot, but his shooting and scoring are not why the Lakers drafted him.

To be fair to Brook, I think some of the lack of production is the way the Lakers offense is set up. The balance is pretty impressive. They have 7 players averaging in double figures and the range is only something like 10.6 ppg to 15.8 ppg.

The thing that concerns me right now is that, while his 3 point shooting percentage is up 2%, his overall field goal percentage is down 6% compared to his career (44.4% to 50.4%). Some of that can be explained by the fact that the 3 is new to him, so he's shooting a lot more of them...but it doesn't explain the full 6% drop.

 

[LogicMan]

The situation needs to be rectified. He canot be a pass first success if no one respects his offense. This was Rondo's problem and he could cover it as he had HOF players around him. His shot did get beter over time, but its clear he was never going to be the man. If Lonzo does not get a reasonable jump shot then people will just play off him, protect the scoring and passing lanes and let him do the slow wind.

 

[LogicMan]

I would suggest they limit his minutes and correct the mechanics now. he can pass, we know that. But if this does not improve he will be compared with the all time busts pretty quickly

 

[trojanfan12]

The situation needs to be rectified. He canot be a pass first success if no one respects his offense. This was Rondo's problem and he could cover it as he had HOF players around him. His shot did get beter over time, but its clear he was never going to be the man. If Lonzo does not get a reasonable jump shot then people will just play off him, protect the scoring and passing lanes and let him do the slow wind.

Agree that the shot needs to be rectified. As I've said, he doesn't need to become a great shooter, he doesn't even need to become a good shooter. He just needs to have a shot that's good enough that players can't play off of him.

Neither Magic nor Kidd ever became great shooters, but they got to where they were good enough that you had to account for them.

I would suggest they limit his minutes and correct the mechanics now. he can pass, we know that. But if this does not improve he will be compared with the all time busts pretty quickly

Don't really agree here. I wouldn't limit his minutes, I'd have him working on his shot as often as possible and encourage him to shoot during games. The Lakers aren't worried about playoffs or winning a lot of games this season. It would be better to let him develop and make his mistakes/miss his shots now, than to be going through it in a couple of seasons when the expectations are higher.

As for being compared to busts, if he is, it would be because of his Dad's mouth. Outside of his shooting, there isn't a lot to complain about re: his game.

As long as he passes the way he does, he's not likely to have a problem finding good players who want to play with him.

 

[LogicMan]

I think your right. His dad s mouth has been an issue. But I also think Magic has marketed the kid as the next great Laker and the cornerstone of the franchise. So naturally people will want to micro watch him and challenge the hype around him. It would suck to have to start career under the looking glass, and he will

 

[flyerhawk]

It's way too early to call any rookie a bust.

But if he can't significantly improve his shooting percentage he will never be more than a role player who can't be on the floor at crunch time.

 

[Mecca of the “B” Team]

The situation needs to be rectified. He canot be a pass first success if no one respects his offense. This was Rondo's problem and he could cover it as he had HOF players around him. His shot did get beter over time, but its clear he was never going to be the man. If Lonzo does not get a reasonable jump shot then people will just play off him, protect the scoring and passing lanes and let him do the slow wind.

Yep.

Most possessions, the Lakers are playing 4 against 5 because everyone knows Lonzo won't, and can't, shoot.

 

[wildturkey]

Lonzo should just shoot all his shots granny style. I'd bet that would be an improvement

 

[trojanfan12]

I think your right. His dad s mouth has been an issue. But I also think Magic has marketed the kid as the next great Laker and the cornerstone of the franchise. So naturally people will want to micro watch him and challenge the hype around him. It would suck to have to start career under the looking glass, and he will

I don't think Magic hyping him really has any impact. He just did what every organization does when they get a high draft pick, especially a rebuilding one.

Players aren't saying that they're bringing a little something extra for him because of what Magic said.

Agree though, having your career scrutinized this much at the start, has got to suck.

 

[trojanfan12]

Lonzo should just shoot all his shots granny style. I'd bet that would be an improvement

Why not?

Worked for Rick Barry on free throws.

 

[flyerhawk]

Yep.

Most possessions, the Lakers are playing 4 against 5 because everyone knows Lonzo won't, and can't, shoot.

Well he is shooting. That's the problem.

 

[trojanfan12]

Well he is shooting. That's the problem.

It's a catch-22. His shot isn't going to get better if he doesn't shoot. But opponents know he can't shoot, so they play off of him.

Fortunately for him, the Lakers are more interested in player development than wins this season, so he gets to keep shooting without worrying too much about the cost. So it's not too much of a problem. Especially if he continues doing the other things well.

Now, in a couple of seasons, when the Lakers are actually serious playoff contenders, if he's still shooting like this...it will be a problem.

 

[flyerhawk]

It's a catch-22. His shot isn't going to get better if he doesn't shoot. But opponents know he can't shoot, so they play off of him.

Fortunately for him, the Lakers are more interested in player development than wins this season, so he gets to keep shooting without worrying too much about the cost. So it's not too much of a problem. Especially if he continues doing the other things well.

Now, in a couple of seasons, when the Lakers are actually serious playoff contenders, if he's still shooting like this...it will be a problem.

Yeah I agree with you.

No reason at all for the Lakers to panic.

 

[Mecca of the “B” Team]

Is Wednesday the day for Lakers vs. 76ers?

I remember all the convos about who has the best young talent.

I think Minny and Utah were the consensus.

* not so much minus Hayward *

But, people were split on the Lakers and 76ers.

......and the Celtics have leapfrogged a ton of teams, Olidipo and Sabonis, Turner look good too.

 

[tlance]

It's a catch-22. His shot isn't going to get better if he doesn't shoot. But opponents know he can't shoot, so they play off of him.

Fortunately for him, the Lakers are more interested in player development than wins this season, so he gets to keep shooting without worrying too much about the cost. So it's not too much of a problem. Especially if he continues doing the other things well.

Now, in a couple of seasons, when the Lakers are actually serious playoff contenders, if he's still shooting like this...it will be a problem.

He doesn't need game reps though. He needs to change his form. That happens when he is on a court by himself.