the middle ground on Dez

[PDay8810]

oh and we WILL resign both Dez and Smith at some point.......

but those screaming Dez is a MUST resign player ...... will have no bitching rights when it comes to our cap situation and if we stay at best average in the .500 range because of it.

Seems fair to me. I don't bitch about the cap nor scream for Dez. You are right, Dez & Smith will be retained and Tony is under center even if we prop him up for the next two seasons. dead money is part of football. Sadly, we can't all be the NE Patriots...some of us have jerry jones.

What I don't get is what changed once Romo signed the contract jerry put in front of him? Everyone knew then we had Romo for minimum 3 years and likely 4 followed by a dead money hit. The math at his age never added up. The better Romo plays the more likely of restructure.

I'm no jerry fan but he does understand money and certainly cap manipulation. Bet that jerry and company knew full well the plan for the Smith's, Murray's and Dez Bryant's when they handed the contract to tony. It's the point of no return and playoff advancement remains the supreme goal.

 

[tw1st3d]

only other free agents really worth worrying about would be Selvie who is a Free agent and it will cost alot more than 400,000 to keep him around.

and Bruce Carter ..... which he he doesn't play better than he did last year .... He's not coming back anyway ... if he breaks out year? Then you have to figure where does he fit in the cap.

List of all our free agents next year ( think we have an option on Free)

Doug Free RT UFA DAL TBD 30 $6,520,000
Kyle Orton QB UFA DAL TBD 31 $4,377,500
Dez Bryant WR UFA DAL TBD 25 $3,148,500
Jeremy Parnell RT UFA DAL TBD 27 $1,833,333
DeMarco Murray RB UFA DAL TBD 26 $1,596,625
Bruce Carter OLB UFA DAL TBD 26 $1,544,645
Justin Durant OLB UFA DAL TBD 28 $1,450,000
Anthony Spencer DE UFA DAL TBD 30 $1,296,875
Nick Hayden DT UFA DAL TBD 28 $730,000
Amobi Okoye DT UFA DAL TBD 26 $730,000
George Selvie DE UFA DAL TBD 27 $730,000
Dwayne Harris WR UFA DAL TBD 26 $655,000
Tyler Clutts FB UFA DAL TBD 29 $645,000
Chris Jones P UFA DAL TBD 24 $645,000
Sterling Moore CB UFA DAL TBD 24 $645,000
Martez Wilson OLB UFA DAL TBD 25 $645,000
Cole Beasley WR RFA DAL TBD 25 $570,500
Lance Dunbar RB RFA DAL TBD 24 $570,000
Caleb Hanie QB UFA DAL TBD 28 $570,000
Orie Lemon ILB RFA DAL TBD 26 $570,000
Darrion Weems LT RFA DAL TBD 25 $570,000
Ron Leary G RFA DAL TBD 25 $495,000
Ben Bass DT RFA DAL TBD 24 $425,747
David Little WR RFA DAL TBD 26

 

[tw1st3d]

Doug Free RT UFA DAL TBD 30 $6,520,000
Kyle Orton QB UFA DAL TBD 31 $4,377,500
Dez Bryant WR UFA DAL TBD 25 $3,148,500
Jeremy Parnell RT UFA DAL TBD 27 $1,833,333
DeMarco Murray RB UFA DAL TBD 26 $1,596,625
Bruce Carter OLB UFA DAL TBD 26 $1,544,645
Justin Durant OLB UFA DAL TBD 28 $1,450,000
Anthony Spencer DE UFA DAL TBD 30 $1,296,875
Nick Hayden DT UFA DAL TBD 28 $730,000
Amobi Okoye DT UFA DAL TBD 26 $730,000
George Selvie DE UFA DAL TBD 27 $730,000
Dwayne Harris WR UFA DAL TBD 26 $655,000
Tyler Clutts FB UFA DAL TBD 29 $645,000
Chris Jones P UFA DAL TBD 24 $645,000
Sterling Moore CB UFA DAL TBD 24 $645,000
Martez Wilson OLB UFA DAL TBD 25 $645,000
Cole Beasley WR RFA DAL TBD 25 $570,500
Lance Dunbar RB RFA DAL TBD 24 $570,000
Caleb Hanie QB UFA DAL TBD 28 $570,000
Orie Lemon ILB RFA DAL TBD 26 $570,000
Darrion Weems LT RFA DAL TBD 25 $570,000
Ron Leary G RFA DAL TBD 25 $495,000
Ben Bass DT RFA DAL TBD 24 $425,747
David Little WR RFA DAL TBD 26

Actually a few more on there to worry about Dunbar if he can stay healthy Leary and Beasley ( I think we just drafted Harris replacement)

 

[snookdad]

No. It's not just the QB contract. It is the restructures too. Look at the QBs above and below Romo in total salary. Their total contracts are similar to Romo's, but their current and past year cap hits are all higher and usually much higher (unless they were on a smaller contract for those years). Romo's contract averages $18M a year, but his highest cap hit has been $11.8M. The other QBs near him have the following 2014 cap hits - $18.5, 15.8M, 20.4M, 17.5M, 16.7M, 18.9M, 18.4M and 14.8. that money doesn't go away when you restructure it just moves into a future year and adds to his already high cap hit in that year. Yes some of these guys may be restructured and come down at some point, but you can go back and check the same guys 2013 cap hit if you want and it shows the same picture as compared to Romo. 2013 Romo's cap hit was also $11.8M the others were from $13.6M to $20.9M. Jerry and Stephen manage the cap like two imbeciles IMO. I know, I know...we get under the cap...

So it isn't just the bad contract, but how much worse we made it by these restructures. Every player we can't afford isn't Dez's fault or Smith's fault it's the Romo contract AND just as important the way we've sold out our future years for our current years chasing a ring we weren't going to win anyway.

Restructures do hurt but my point is more aimed at most teams seeking to lock up a franchise cornerstone type player is going to struggle cap wise. I'm not going to cry about the cap anymore and Ive grown tired of the same negative rants made by others. If nothing else Jerry is a shrewd business man and he will continue to manipulate the cap some have been saying the sky is falling for 4 or 5 yrs regarding this every time JJ has found a way to persevere.

Looking at the model of most successful teams with GM's they build in the draft and they continually rotate roll players. I would rather point at the Saint's or the Seahawks or even the Seattle as my example and I believe over the next 2 or 3 yrs the Niners and the Hawks will fill the pinch of the salary cap due to the recent success they've both enjoyed. I don't however use the Patriots as an example because Tom Brady is a once in a lifetime type player coupled with one of the 5 best coaches ever so they can afford to plug and play players regardless of their level of play. So they can bring in the High dollar F/A at a cheaper rate and then release him when he smells himself and not miss a beat. 90% of the NFL doesn't have this luxury.

 

[snookdad]

The one player who hasn't been mentioned in all of this is Jason Witten where does he come out in all of this? I absolutely love him and hope he could be a Cowboy for life, but if cutting him makes this team better for the sake of the cap then so be it. I think if Ware can be released then anyone is cut-able if the players Future salary is not expected to be met by his future performance.

 

[snookdad]

we have our top 2 picks left to sign .... so it wont be 10 million

plus anyone we have to pick up during the year because of injuries .... ( which cost us around 8 million in total last year)

So not likely we will have any roll over money really worth talking about

BTW Murray is also a free agent

Murray, Dez, and Melton will cost 9 million if we keep him)
we took Smith's option so he wont be a free agent

If I'm cutting one of those guys then Melton has got to go, I think we can find his replacement and Romo's in the next 1 or 2 drafts. I think if we lose more than 9 or 10 games you have to draft a qb in the first round even if he has to sit a year to better absorb Romo's cap hit.

 

[tw1st3d]

Restructures do hurt but my point is more aimed at most teams seeking to lock up a franchise cornerstone type player is going to struggle cap wise. I'm not going to cry about the cap anymore and Ive grown tired of the same negative rants made by others. If nothing else Jerry is a shrewd business man and he will continue to manipulate the cap some have been saying the sky is falling for 4 or 5 yrs regarding this every time JJ has found a way to persevere.

Looking at the model of most successful teams with GM's they build in the draft and they continually rotate roll players. I would rather point at the Saint's or the Seahawks or even the Seattle as my example and I believe over the next 2 or 3 yrs the Niners and the Hawks will fill the pinch of the salary cap due to the recent success they've both enjoyed. I don't however use the Patriots as an example because Tom Brady is a once in a lifetime type player coupled with one of the 5 best coaches ever so they can afford to plug and play players regardless of their level of play. So they can bring in the High dollar F/A at a cheaper rate and then release him when he smells himself and not miss a beat. 90% of the NFL doesn't have this luxury.

I am sooooo glad you posted this .....
Name a Superstar receiver on either team? Or a Superstar QB on either ( seahawks and 49ers)

Both teams built through the trenches ..... neither built on a Superstar Qb or Wide Receiver .... Which has been my point all along

You basically backed my point without knowing it

 

[tw1st3d]

The one player who hasn't been mentioned in all of this is Jason Witten where does he come out in all of this? I absolutely love him and hope he could be a Cowboy for life, but if cutting him makes this team better for the sake of the cap then so be it. I think if Ware can be released then anyone is cut-able if the players Future salary is not expected to be met by his future performance.

Witten makes less than 10 million a year .... and that is with his own restructures .... Less than what top tightends demand now days..... So I dont get the point you are trying to make.

 

[tw1st3d]

If I'm cutting one of those guys then Melton has got to go, I think we can find his replacement and Romo's in the next 1 or 2 drafts. I think if we lose more than 9 or 10 games you have to draft a qb in the first round even if he has to sit a year to better absorb Romo's cap hit.

I think Melton is gone as well .... reguardless of how he does ... So we agree on that one

 

[tw1st3d]

Im not sure why people think I'm doom and gloom ... Im not ... Now if we were in a better division ..... errrrr

we have an offense that can get us 8-8 .... but the defense can us make us worse or a game better ......

But sorry if im not gonna jump on the we are gonna be the greatest bandwagon....... the defense isnt there .... and we did a pure crap job of helping it

 

[PDay8810]

Im not sure why people think I'm doom and gloom ... Im not ... Now if we were in a better division ..... errrrr

we have an offense that can get us 8-8 .... but the defense can us make us worse or a game better ......

But sorry if im not gonna jump on the we are gonna be the greatest bandwagon....... the defense isnt there .... and we did a pure crap job of helping it

who said they will be the greatest

 

[tw1st3d]

who said they will be the greatest

and who said they were bust?

Dont chunk words in my mouth if you dont expect them to come back at you


Tag you're it

 

[Manster7588]

Our 10M cap space in layman's terms. Dallas Cowboys' cap space not what you think - ESPN

It truth we have a lot less space.

 

[jarntt]

The one player who hasn't been mentioned in all of this is Jason Witten where does he come out in all of this? I absolutely love him and hope he could be a Cowboy for life, but if cutting him makes this team better for the sake of the cap then so be it. I think if Ware can be released then anyone is cut-able if the players Future salary is not expected to be met by his future performance.

I've kind of been saying this since salary caps have been instituted. Other than in extreme cases, once the value of a players contract exceeds his value as a player you need to consider letting him go and once it exceeds it by a lot you must let him go. NE of course comes to mind as a team that has done this consistently. Even the greatest players in the world can have the value of their contracts exceed their actual value. This is what the good teams do if they want to remain good for the long term. There is always another player around the corner and everyone is replaceable. It is also a reason to have level cap hits from your players and to not restructure and end up not being able to cut a guy once his play doesn't meet his contract for the sole reason that you've made him uncuttable by pushing dead money out in the latter years of the contract. I'll let Jurgen Klinsman say it for me because I thought of Jerry when I read this:

This always happens in America,” Klinsmann told me, waving his hands in the air. “Kobe Bryant, for example — why does he get a two-year contract extension for $50 million? Because of what he is going to do in the next two years for the Lakers? Of course not. Of course not. He gets it because of what he has done before. It makes no sense. Why do you pay for what has already happened?”

 

[jarntt]

Our 10M cap space in layman's terms. Dallas Cowboys' cap space not what you think - ESPN

It truth we have a lot less space.

The only reason we have that is because we restructured so much of Romo's contract. So we shouldn't use that money on additional players. We should use it to start absorbing the cap hit of Dez, Smith and maybe even Murray and protect future years. Look at what Chi did with Cutler. They needed cap space so they restructured like $5M of his contract. But we have to go ahead and restructure like $16M of Romo's. I will say that the smart thing was not restructuring Carr. As bad as restructures are, if you keep it to the guys you will have on the team for the long term it doesn't hurt you quite as much. Now we can cut Carr next year if his play doesn't get back to where he was a couple of years ago. But, if we restructured him we probably couldn't...Smart non-move on that one for the Jones boys IMO...

 

[tw1st3d]

The only reason we have that is because we restructured so much of Romo's contract. So we shouldn't use that money on additional players. We should use it to start absorbing the cap hit of Dez, Smith and maybe even Murray and protect future years. Look at what Chi did with Cutler. They needed cap space so they restructured like $5M of his contract. But we have to go ahead and restructure like $16M of Romo's. I will say that the smart thing was not restructuring Carr. As bad as restructures are, if you keep it to the guys you will have on the team for the long term it doesn't hurt you quite as much. Now we can cut Carr next year if his play doesn't get back to where he was a couple of years ago. But, if we restructured him we probably couldn't...Smart non-move on that one for the Jones boys IMO...

errrr we did restructure Carr ..... Last year

2013 Restructure Bonus: $13.585 million / 5 years ( meaning it's spread over 5 years to the tune of 2.7 million per year for 5 years starting with this year)

we could still cut him next year though ..... wouldn't save us any real money though ... about 560,000

 

[jarntt]

Thought it was clear, but I was talking about this year.

 

[snookdad]

Witten makes less than 10 million a year .... and that is with his own restructures .... Less than what top tightends demand now days..... So I dont get the point you are trying to make.

This was obviously a question

 

[snookdad]

I am sooooo glad you posted this .....
Name a Superstar receiver on either team? Or a Superstar QB on either ( seahawks and 49ers)

Both teams built through the trenches ..... neither built on a Superstar Qb or Wide Receiver .... Which has been my point all along

You basically backed my point without knowing it

I think that Kap and Wilson or both projected Superstars especially Wilson and will be paid as such. The 49ers brain trust made a very team friendly contract on him regardless of what the number say, but will they retain Davis (Superstar) when he's due? Crabtree (not a Superstar he is a prowbowl talent though)? What about Willis or Aldon Smith all who are due to get paid? Losing either player would be detrimental to that teams success. Same thing with Seattle having to pay: Thomas, Wilson, Lynch(who protects Wilson a great deal), and Sherman. Do you think Percy Harvin is going to demand a Superstar Contract in the next year are two? You know what happens when guys win the SB.

Again the point I'm trying to emphasize is we need to better concentrate our efforts on drafting better with the ability to sign one or two key F/A. As "bad as our cap has been" We have always been able to get the guys we've targeted. I don't disagree that building the trenches is key but that's not what we are debating. The issue to me is Salary Cap and paying players when they are due and properly building in the draft 1st. Regardless of the position if they are key to your teams success.

 

[Manster7588]

The only reason we have that is because we restructured so much of Romo's contract. So we shouldn't use that money on additional players. We should use it to start absorbing the cap hit of Dez, Smith and maybe even Murray and protect future years. Look at what Chi did with Cutler. They needed cap space so they restructured like $5M of his contract. But we have to go ahead and restructure like $16M of Romo's. I will say that the smart thing was not restructuring Carr. As bad as restructures are, if you keep it to the guys you will have on the team for the long term it doesn't hurt you quite as much. Now we can cut Carr next year if his play doesn't get back to where he was a couple of years ago. But, if we restructured him we probably couldn't...Smart non-move on that one for the Jones boys IMO...

Never said we should use the cap space to add contracts. I asked how much of the 10M could be rolled over hoping we wouldn't be forced to redo any current contracts and still sign Smith and Bryant.
The link I found simple tells us while we currently haven't 10M in space truth in Melton and Spencer are not counter as of yet because of the way their deals are structured.

With those two along with Martin and Lawrence still waiting to be signed we have between 2 and 3 mil in cap space.