So I guess we are drafting Brandon Scherff

[Sharkinva]

I wanted Williams in the draft b/c he is an OT. I liked him better b/c he was the better PASS blocker. I agree with you that Chester sucks. But the Skins dont agree with us and that is who is going to make the draft picks.

Now you just spinning. I showed you draft reports on Trent that specifically said he would need to improve on HIS PASS blocking at the next level and might have needed to be moved to RT.

Just fess up Dean.. you want a play maker and Scherff isnt exciting enough for you for us to take at five. There is no shame in admitting you want sexy over substance bro. I can understand it.

 

[deanpet21]

I would like an olineman at #5 but not Scherff. I think the guy is a guard but you don't take guards at #5. Siple as that.

 

[Sharkinva]

I would like an olineman at #5 but not Scherff. I think the guy is a guard but you don't take guards at #5. Siple as that.

So again sexy over substance. You would pass on the most versatile O-lineman and the best O-lineman in the draft because he MIGHT actually be a better guard than a tackle but could play either spot for us??

 

[redskinsfan]

OK simple question... how would taking Scherff not be with an eye towards the future?? I think its fairly obvious to all that even if he ONLY becomes a solid to above average starter at RG for say the next six years... that is a serious nod towards not only the present but also the FUTURE of this team as a whole. Or would you disagree??

Again I think the major hangup I am seeing is.. well he isnt a game changer, or he might only be a guard at the pro level.

All IM saying is at some point ACTUAL NEED has got to come into the equation. If you scratch the QBs, the RB because it would bea luxury pick, and the pass rushers because all have flags enough that would in most drafts make them second rounders... you come down to Scherff and Cooper. Admittedly the Cooper pick might look better on May 1st, but come September 30th when Chris Chester is doing his best matador movement and Cooper has 3 catches for 35 yards.... you will all start to second guess the wisdom of taking a pass catcher when we still cant pass block in any way shape or form from the right side of the line.

Here's the real issue with your thinking: if he does become a "solid to above average starter at RG" for the next coming years, we can get that type of guy in the third round. You really seem to be missing the issue of value. If that really happens, your pick is a huge bust and you risk passing up on someone that can turn into the next Justin Houston. That's why you have to evaluate value when selecting players.

 

[deanpet21]

lol. its debatable if he even is the best olineman in the draft. I think you are going to be very pissed on draft day. We should video chat. I want to see your face on draft night. lol.

 

[Sharkinva]

Here's the real issue with your thinking: if he does become a "solid to above average starter at RG" for the next coming years, we can get that type of guy in the third round. You really seem to be missing the issue of value. If that really happens, your pick is a huge bust and you risk passing up on someone that can turn into the next Justin Houston. That's why you have to evaluate value when selecting players.

We havent been able to get that guy in the third round in Nine years. I know every one is drinking the McCool-aid at the moment. But when some one recently shows you a plan that works and worked rather fucking well... why keep doing what has FAILED miserably??

Oh wait, because its more exciting your way.

 

[Sharkinva]

lol. its debatable if he even is the best olineman in the draft. I think you are going to be very pissed on draft day. We should video chat. I want to see your face on draft night. lol.

You just make sure you got my $50. Because while our new GM might look at what has recently worked and still want to go the exciting route, you and i both know he wont make it past pick ten.

 

[deanpet21]

im not betting with you. I think he goes to the Giants at #9. Would you do top 8?

 

[redskinsfan]

We havent been able to get that guy in the third round in Nine years. I know every one is drinking the McCool-aid at the moment. But when some one recently shows you a plan that works and worked rather fucking well... why keep doing what has FAILED miserably??

Oh wait, because its more exciting your way.

Dude, you just posed a hypothetical that destroys your drafting theory. A number 5 overall pick for someone who's just a "solid guard"? Really?! Yeah, he'll set us for the future at that position, but I'll put my trust -- at least for now -- with McCloughan to get a "solid guard" in later rounds. This is Al Davis-like thinking, e.g., acknowledging you need a kicker but then drafting one with a first rounder. To be sure, Janikowski has done really well for them. But don't tell me they couldn't get a kicker that could meet their needs outside the draft entirely and use the 17th overall pick on someone that's worthy of it.

Let's put this is some perspective: you get a gift certificate to select any car for free. Instead of choosing a Bentley, Lambo, or Bugatti, you take the car with the Civic body with Fast and Furious painting on it. Why? Because that car will do you just fine. Yeah, it very well might, but don't tell me you didn't blow a golden opportunity by passing up on other, more clearly superior products than the one you took.

 

[Sharkinva]

lol. its debatable if he even is the best olineman in the draft. I think you are going to be very pissed on draft day. We should video chat. I want to see your face on draft night. lol.

According to who. He was the Outland award winner. This is given to the BEST college offensive lineman yearly. thats not under debate.

 

[redskinsfan]

im not betting with you. I think he goes to the Giants at #9. Would you do top 8?

That is the very highest I've seen Scherff go. And if he does go that high, it's out of pure desperation. I've seen at least one other draft where he's fallen out of the top 15. I think both are outliers and his value sits around 10 to 15. Taking someone at that position with the five pick is nuts. It's like a bunch of people I heard saying that we needed a safety (which was true until about yesterday), so let's just draft Landon Collins. Well, Collins value is about where Scherff's is and if we all agree that taking him at #5, why not the same with Scherff?

 

[redskinsfan]

According to who. He was the Outland award winner. This is given to the BEST college offensive lineman yearly. thats not under debate.

That's a media award, it's not one given by pro scouts or pro talent evaluators. What about Jackson Jeffcoat? He won the Ted Hendricks award? But he wasn't even drafted. Or we can cite to other Heisman winners. After all, that's given to the best college player period, right? So, why didn't anyone take Eric Crouch first overall?

 

[Sharkinva]

Dude, you just posed a hypothetical that destroys your drafting theory. A number 5 overall pick for someone who's just a "solid guard"? Really?! Yeah, he'll set us for the future at that position, but I'll put my trust -- at least for now -- with McCloughan to get a "solid guard" in later rounds. This is Al Davis-like thinking, e.g., acknowledging you need a kicker but then drafting one with a first rounder. To be sure, Janikowski has done really well for them. But don't tell me they couldn't get a kicker that could meet their needs outside the draft entirely and use the 17th overall pick on someone that's worthy of it.

Let's put this is some perspective: you get a gift certificate to select any car for free. Instead of choosing a Bentley, Lambo, or Bugatti, you take the car with the Civic body with Fast and Furious painting on it. Why? Because that car will do you just fine. Yeah, it very well might, but don't tell me you didn't blow a golden opportunity by passing up on other, more clearly superior products than the one you took.

You just said it best.. you would take the sexy choice over the smart choice because it looks better up front.

And for the record my thinking is the worst we get out of Scherff is a solid guard. We havent even been able to find that. But reality is I think he will make a good RT or a great OG. either of which we can use alot more than another Orakpo or Arrington or simply a trade down because its more exciting to have more picks on draft day.

 

[Sharkinva]

That is the very highest I've seen Scherff go. And if he does go that high, it's out of pure desperation. I've seen at least one other draft where he's fallen out of the top 15. I think both are outliers and his value sits around 10 to 15. Taking someone at that position with the five pick is nuts. It's like a bunch of people I heard saying that we needed a safety (which was true until about yesterday), so let's just draft Landon Collins. Well, Collins value is about where Scherff's is and if we all agree that taking him at #5, why not the same with Scherff?

2015 NFL Mock Drafts - Rob Rang - CBSSports.com NFLDraftScout.com

 

[redskinsfan]

You just said it best.. you would take the sexy choice over the smart choice because it looks better up front.

And for the record my thinking is the worst we get out of Scherff is a solid guard. We havent even been able to find that. But reality is I think he will make a good RT or a great OG. either of which we can use alot more than another Orakpo or Arrington or simply a trade down because its more exciting to have more picks on draft day.

You're right about one thing: Scherff isn't a sexy pick. But you're wrong on another, more important point: he's isn't the right pick for number five overall. What you keep missing is that sometimes the "sexy" pick is the right selection. And in this case, it is.

 

[redskinsfan]

2015 NFL Mock Drafts - Rob Rang - CBSSports.com NFLDraftScout.com

Rob Rang is a nutjob. Listen to him on 106.7. I can also show you one where Scherff is pegged at #18. Both of those are outliers. The consensus is that Scherff's value lies between 10 to 15.

 

[Sharkinva]

That's a media award, it's not one given by pro scouts or pro talent evaluators. What about Jackson Jeffcoat? He won the Ted Hendricks award? But he wasn't even drafted. Or we can cite to other Heisman winners. After all, that's given to the best college player period, right? So, why didn't anyone take Eric Crouch first overall?

So wait a media award doesnt count, but a bunch of media mock drafts saying they think he is no better than 9th counts?? We havent actually see where Scouts rate any of these players. Especially where the redskins scouts have them.

bottom line we are debating our own opinions here. Apparently the majority of the boards wants a sexy pick or a trade down, a few of us want a pick that will be better for the team on the field and not just the day after the draft.

 

[redskinsfan]

2015 NFL Mock Drafts - Rob Rang - CBSSports.com NFLDraftScout.com

In Charles Davis' mock draft, Scherff slides all the way to 18. Like I said before, this draft is the other extreme to Rob Rang. What needs to be cited is the consensus on Scherff. And that does not help you in this debate.

You are so hooked on aversion to sexy picks. As a lifelong Redskins fan, I know how you feel. But we need to make the right pick. And sometimes that's going to be a sexy or one two.

2015 NFL Mock Drafts : Mock draft 3.0: Gurley goes to Falcons

 

[redskinsfan]

So wait a media award doesnt count, but a bunch of media mock drafts saying they think he is no better than 9th counts?? We havent actually see where Scouts rate any of these players. Especially where the redskins scouts have them.

bottom line we are debating our own opinions here. Apparently the majority of the boards wants a sexy pick or a trade down, a few of us want a pick that will be better for the team on the field and not just the day after the draft.

Okay, Shark, why don't you try responding to my point about other media awards. Each year, the Ted Hendricks award is given to the best d-lineman in college. Last year, that was Jackson Jeffcoat. If you're advising a team in need of a d-lineman in the first round, do you tell them to take Jeffcoat?

 

[Sharkinva]

Rob Rang is a nutjob. Listen to him on 106.7. I can also show you one where Scherff is pegged at #18. Both of those are outliers. The consensus is that Scherff's value lies between 10 to 15.

And you dont think ALL these mock draft have more to do with team need than player value? Or as i have asked numerous times and no one will answer.. is Jamies Winston the best player in this draft?? If you say no, then you are admitting draft order and "value" are nothing more than media spin as well.