Shazam! 2: Fury of the Gods (2023)

[MilkSpiller22]

Well, Superman and Batman are by far the most important characters, and it seems like they will also recast Wonder Woman, but it seems like they will keep Peacemaker, and if The Flash does well, I wouldn't be surprised if they kept Ezra Miller.

In the end, it all depends on what's succesful, and the universe overall was a mess full of financial flops.

i feel like Ezra is one of the reasons DC has failed so miserably... i doubt he will stay... They are using the flash movie to reboot... it would be weird to keep him on...

 

[calsnowskier]

Well, Superman and Batman are by far the most important characters, and it seems like they will also recast Wonder Woman, but it seems like they will keep Peacemaker, and if The Flash does well, I wouldn't be surprised if they kept Ezra Miller.

In the end, it all depends on what's succesful, and the universe overall was a mess full of financial flops.

I would think Miller would priority 1 on a recast project. But storyline wise, that could be tough given that he will be the cause of the reboot

 

[DarthVedder]

i feel like Ezra is one of the reasons DC has failed so miserably... i doubt he will stay... They are using the flash movie to reboot... it would be weird to keep him on...

I would think Miller would priority 1 on a recast project. But storyline wise, that could be tough given that he will be the cause of the reboot

There's some buzz claiming that The Flash is a great movie. Ezra Miller is a liability because of his personal life, but his Flash was fine on the Snyder cut. I know it's not likely because of all the baggage that the DCEU is carrying (and the genre overall is seeing declining numbers), but if The Flash turns out to be a major financial success (say close to 1B ww), WB would be pressured to keep Miller around.

 

[MilkSpiller22]

There's some buzz claiming that The Flash is a great movie. Ezra Miller is a liability because of his personal life, but his Flash was fine on the Snyder cut. I know it's not likely because of all the baggage that the DCEU is carrying (and the genre overall is seeing declining numbers), but if The Flash turns out to be a major financial success (say close to 1B ww), WB would be pressured to keep Miller around.

I still cant believe DC made the mistake of making a Black adam movie before introducing him in SHazam... i still want to know whose decision that was....

it is almost as bad as the fact that THOR has 4 movies.... Marvel might have made a mistake in casting for Thor... he is too big of a name, and became so hot... that they just kept on having to make movies with him... Thor should be nothing more than a side character... Kind of like aquaman.... Aquaman didnt deserve 2 movies...

 

[DarthVedder]

I still cant believe DC made the mistake of making a Black adam movie before introducing him in SHazam... i still want to know whose decision that was....

it is almost as bad as the fact that THOR has 4 movies.... Marvel might have made a mistake in casting for Thor... he is too big of a name, and became so hot... that they just kept on having to make movies with him... Thor should be nothing more than a side character... Kind of like aquaman.... Aquaman didnt deserve 2 movies...

There's a second Aquaman because the first one, for some reason, made a billion dollars. DC are a completely reactive company and, once BvS flopped, they were left without a plan and "franchise" runner. After that it was basically becoming dollar-value Marvel while throwing crap at the wall to see what sticks.

I hope Gunn has an actual plan and is allowed to follow it, but it seems like audiences are abandoning superhero movies and even Marvel are struggling.

 

[MilkSpiller22]

There's a second Aquaman because the first one, for some reason, made a billion dollars. DC are a completely reactive company and, once BvS flopped, they were left without a plan and "franchise" runner. After that it was basically becoming dollar-value Marvel while throwing crap at the wall to see what sticks.

I hope Gunn has an actual plan and is allowed to follow it, but it seems like audiences are abandoning superhero movies and even Marvel are struggling.

the problem with marvel is simple... it was their starting point... they started with Iron man, to grow the avengers... The problem with that is that they got A list(or actors that grew into A list). actors to play boring superheroes like Thor and Captain America... they were forced to highlight them, Again Thor should not have 4 movies.... that is such a joke...

the other problem they faced was that the X-Men were a seperate franchise, and they had to stay away from mutants... now they are trying to build them in, but it is not an easy task... and it is harder to ignore the previous X-men movies that ran during the same time as this franchise...

And then there is SONY that wants to own Spiderman, so they are constantly creating movies with Spiderman villains as its antihero... it makes everything so confusing... and sloppy because those movies have not been very good...


if they had the whole marvel universe they could have done so much better... and it would still feel fresh...

 

[calsnowskier]

I still cant believe DC made the mistake of making a Black adam movie before introducing him in SHazam... i still want to know whose decision that was....

it is almost as bad as the fact that THOR has 4 movies.... Marvel might have made a mistake in casting for Thor... he is too big of a name, and became so hot... that they just kept on having to make movies with him... Thor should be nothing more than a side character... Kind of like aquaman.... Aquaman didnt deserve 2 movies...

Hemsworth wasn’t a big name when he got Thor.

And Thor 3 was kinda a Hulk movie.

And Thor 4 was not a movie. It was garbage.

 

[calsnowskier]

the problem with marvel is simple... it was their starting point... they started with Iron man, to grow the avengers... The problem with that is that they got A list(or actors that grew into A list). actors to play boring superheroes like Thor and Captain America... they were forced to highlight them, Again Thor should not have 4 movies.... that is such a joke...

the other problem they faced was that the X-Men were a seperate franchise, and they had to stay away from mutants... now they are trying to build them in, but it is not an easy task... and it is harder to ignore the previous X-men movies that ran during the same time as this franchise...

And then there is SONY that wants to own Spiderman, so they are constantly creating movies with Spiderman villains as its antihero... it makes everything so confusing... and sloppy because those movies have not been very good...


if they had the whole marvel universe they could have done so much better... and it would still feel fresh...

They didn’t cast A-listers.

RDJ was a reclamation project when he was cast as Stark. He was just rebounding from rock bottom at the time. Hemsworth was a relative unknown at the time. Same with Evans. He had the history as Torch, but outside of that, he wasn’t really a known quantity (even today, outside of Rogers, he is FAR from an A-lister).

The MCU made their actors big because the movies were good (for what they were) and they got actors who weren’t too big (or too small) for the rolls. Smart movies, produced smartly.

 

[DarthVedder]

the problem with marvel is simple... it was their starting point... they started with Iron man, to grow the avengers... The problem with that is that they got A list(or actors that grew into A list). actors to play boring superheroes like Thor and Captain America... they were forced to highlight them, Again Thor should not have 4 movies.... that is such a joke...

the other problem they faced was that the X-Men were a seperate franchise, and they had to stay away from mutants... now they are trying to build them in, but it is not an easy task... and it is harder to ignore the previous X-men movies that ran during the same time as this franchise...

And then there is SONY that wants to own Spiderman, so they are constantly creating movies with Spiderman villains as its antihero... it makes everything so confusing... and sloppy because those movies have not been very good...


if they had the whole marvel universe they could have done so much better... and it would still feel fresh...

The starting point was good, which is proven by the fact that, based on the original core they created the most succesful movie franchise of all time. Marvel's current problems have nothing to do with RDJ, Evans or even Hemsworth. Their problems are:

1. Infinity War and Endgame wrapped up a great 20 movie arc, but after Endgame it felt like the story was over. Personally, I checked out after Endgame, and I don't feel like I have to watch the newer movies. After Endgame I've only watched the Spidermans (Loved No way home, didn't care for Far from home), Dr. Strange (It was alright but disappointing), and Thor 4 (unnecessary sequel and it was really bad).
2. They are spreading themselves too thin with too many movies and tv shows.
3. Quality is far from what it was, and humor is very low brow and overbearing. Also every movie is a setup instead of being its own contained story.
4. Multiverse stories are convoluted, confusing and difficult to follow, particularly when spread through several different movies and shows.

After Endgame, they should have started small again, with probably new characters telling a new story.

 

[MilkSpiller22]

Hemsworth wasn’t a big name when he got Thor.

And Thor 3 was kinda a Hulk movie.

And Thor 4 was not a movie. It was garbage.

Yea.. I said that they became one... just my post was very unclear... but they also groomed them into becoming big named...

but my point is still that in no way should Thor have 4 movies... its definitely a problem... its hard to get into the future of marvel if you are stuck giving these now A-list actors movies...

 

[MilkSpiller22]

The starting point was good, which is proven by the fact that, based on the original core they created the most succesful movie franchise of all time. Marvel's current problems have nothing to do with RDJ, Evans or even Hemsworth. Their problems are:

1. Infinity War and Endgame wrapped up a great 20 movie arc, but after Endgame it felt like the story was over. Personally, I checked out after Endgame, and I don't feel like I have to watch the newer movies. After Endgame I've only watched the Spidermans (Loved No way home, didn't care for Far from home), Dr. Strange (It was alright but disappointing), and Thor 4 (unnecessary sequel and it was really bad).
2. They are spreading themselves too thin with too many movies and tv shows.
3. Quality is far from what it was, and humor is very low brow and overbearing. Also every movie is a setup instead of being its own contained story.
4. Multiverse stories are convoluted, confusing and difficult to follow, particularly when spread through several different movies and shows.

After Endgame, they should have started small again, with probably new characters telling a new story.

I agree endgame concluded the arc... which makes it harder to go past it, because they need to create the new characters. while ending at least 3 of the original 6 avengers storylines...


but I don't think people fear the new movies... the problem is that they are slow burning the new characters by giving the old ones more screen time and using them as minor characters in the movies...

and I don't think the TV shows help grow these characters because tv characters will always feel lesser than a movie main character...

also, I don't think it helps that the most recent new characters they seem to want to grow are all young women... America Chavez, Ms Marvel, Iron heart... isn't squirrel girl supposed to be next??

 

[DarthVedder]

also, I don't think it helps that the most recent new characters they seem to want to grow are all young women... America Chavez, Ms Marvel, Iron heart... isn't squirrel girl supposed to be next??

I don't think there's a problem in having several young women... The problem is in the way these are implemented. I haven't watched it, but it seems like they did a good job with Ms. Marvel, but the other characters are too derivative and a bit of Mary Sues, which is kind of annoying and unrelatable.

 

[MilkSpiller22]

I don't think there's a problem in having several young women... The problem is in the way these are implemented. I haven't watched it, but it seems like they did a good job with Ms. Marvel, but the other characters are too derivative and a bit of Mary Sues, which is kind of annoying and unrelatable.

no its not a problem... but every new character is a young woman... that's great..

the new Hawkeye- young woman
the new Iron man- young woman( even though iron heart is NOT IRON MAN)
the new black panther- young woman

then America Chavez, Shehulk and Ms marvel are the other 3 most recent characters

I am all for Girl power, and to show young girls everywhere that they can do anything... but we got to also remember most comic book geeks are male...

yes, marvel is still dominated by male heroes... but showing that the future is female, just hurts the growth of the franchise IMO...

 

[BusSport]

DC / WB are such a right-hand-doesn't-know-what-left-hand-is-doing trainwreck, holy shit. They can't get out of their own way. This is DC self-spoiling Doomsday in the final trailer for Batman v Superman all over again. It's just such a contrast to Disney/Marvel's tightly-controlled, disciplined, everything-by-design marketing campaigns.

So Shazam 2 has been doing horrible pre-release tracking numbers, among the worst if not the absolute worst of any DCEU film so far. The film is basically dead-on-arrival because its sort-of-spinoff Black Adam was a box office failure and the next film, The Flash, is going to be rebooting the universe for James Gunn's new universe.

Out of desperation to sell tickets, some WB marketing executive (in a desperation last-minute decision, as seen by how Wonder Woman had been carefully kept out of the earlier trailers and promos) got the bright idea to spoil Wonder Woman's appearance in the film in a television spot to try to get people to go see the movie. The director didn't want this and is pissed at marketing spoiling the appearance. And hey, now a major movie surprise is ruined for the audience. Way to go, WB!

I watched Fury of the Gods on opening night and enjoyed it, but it is DOA: it has among the worst box office openings of any DCEU/MCU/SSU film, comparable to the films released during the pandemic before theaters fully reopened.

 

[calsnowskier]

I watched Fury of the Gods on opening night and enjoyed it, but it is DOA: it has among the worst box office openings of any DCEU/MCU/SSU film, comparable to the films released during the pandemic before theaters fully reopened.

Gotta think the reboot announcement had to affect the box office, but I have a hard time believing it was the sole reason for the flop. Bad word of mouth and super hero fatigue, I suspect, had more to do with it, and, of course, the horrible rep that the DCEU has.

 

[MilkSpiller22]

Gotta think the reboot announcement had to affect the box office, but I have a hard time believing it was the sole reason for the flop. Bad word of mouth and super hero fatigue, I suspect, had more to do with it, and, of course, the horrible rep that the DCEU has.

I don't think black Adam helped either.... really weird timing for that movie...

 

[Duffman]

Gotta think the reboot announcement had to affect the box office, but I have a hard time believing it was the sole reason for the flop. Bad word of mouth and super hero fatigue, I suspect, had more to do with it, and, of course, the horrible rep that the DCEU has.

It has an 88 audience score on Rotten tomatoes currently so word of mouth has been helping so far I’d say. Of course we’d have to see next week once more people see it to really judge.

 

[DarthVedder]

I don't know what has been more poorly managed, the DCEU or Disney Lucas Films?

 

[MilkSpiller22]

I don't know what has been more poorly managed, the DCEU or Disney Lucas Films?

How has disney lucas films mismanaged starwars?? i think you are getting disappoinment and mismanagement confused...

The fact that disney has turned it into a huge franchise is proof that it was not mismanaged...

 

[DarthVedder]

How has disney lucas films mismanaged starwars?? i think you are getting disappoinment and mismanagement confused...

The fact that disney has turned it into a huge franchise is proof that it was not mismanaged...

Disney purchased a huge franchise, which they have severely affected.

How many movies have they announced and then cancelled? Where's Rian Johnson's trilogy? D&D's trilogy? Patty Jenkins' movies? Remember that when they purchased Lucas Films, the stated goal was to build a cinematic universe and releasing at least one move per year.

They made the sequel trilogy without an overarching plan, which resulted in it being severely disjointed from one episode to the next, pissing off most of the fans, losing half of its audience from the first movie to the third, causing Solo to bomb, and basically destroying the cinematic universe. It's been what, 5 years since the last movie and there's nothing on the pipleline.

The shows haven't been that huge of a mess, but still they've released disappointing/dumb shows, a good one in Andor that basically nobody cared about, and now even The Mandalorian, their flagship show, is struggling and losing audience.

And since I said LucasFilm, not just Star Wars: How many rewrites and reshoots will Indy go through? I will still watch it since Indy is my favorite character of all time, but I'm concerned about getting a Frankenstein of a film.