Saban & Bielema behind the kill uptempo offense rule

[trojanfan12]

No they don't.

The other team will just hurry to the line and snap the ball without the defense in place. If that is what you call good football then you are an idiot.

I haven't seen USC struggle with substitutions on defense (other than lacking players), LSU doesn't seem to struggle with them.

 

[4down20]

The defense already has the chance to substitute. They just have to prepared and be quick about it.

Not they aren't allowed to substitute except for a few seconds between plays. If they substitute and don't make it out there in time, then what happens? The offense is allowed a free play without a defense playing. That is fucked up.

The 40 second play clock starts when the previous play is finished. This gives the defense a guaranteed 10 seconds from the end of the previous play to the start of the next to make these subs. That's it.

It's going to pass, and you can all keep on crying about it.

 

[4down20]

Let's see if you can grasp this. The defense is not on a clock to get a play run, now are they? O COURSE the offense is dictating the tempo, the game tempo and clock are entirely dependent on THEM.

This discussion has nothing to do with tempo. No team gets the ball off under normal circumstances in less than 10 seconds. Do you even realize that the 40 second play clock starts at the END of the previous play, not when the ball is set like when under the 25 second play clock?

 

[starbigd]

Not they aren't allowed to substitute except for a few seconds between plays. If they substitute and don't make it out there in time, then what happens? The offense is allowed a free play without a defense playing. That is fucked up.

The 40 second play clock starts when the previous play is finished. This gives the defense a guaranteed 10 seconds from the end of the previous play to the start of the next to make these subs. That's it.

It's going to pass, and you can all keep on crying about it.

It's actually quite doubtful that it passes.....and no, the offense CANNOT run a play if the defense has not subbed in.

 

[4down20]

It's actually quite doubtful that it passes.....and no, the offense CANNOT run a play if the defense has not subbed in.

It'll pass. They rarely don't pass and anyone who actually understands the 40 second play clock will understand why it's not going to slow teams down at all.

 

[starbigd]

It'll pass. They rarely don't pass and anyone who actually understands the 40 second play clock will understand why it's not going to slow teams down at all.

Well, you are one of the FEW who believe it will pass. It has virtually no support outside of Saban.

 

[Bamabino]

This is clearly not something the bammers can figure out.

I suppose then every announcer that covered a game with a HHNU team was making shit up when he told everyone the defense could only sub if the offense did.

 

[charlie42s]

This discussion has nothing to do with tempo. No team gets the ball off under normal circumstances in less than 10 seconds. ...

'normal' meaning when the offense is not HUNH?

 

[starbigd]

I suppose then every announcer that covered a game with a HHNU team was making shit up when told everyone the defense could only sub if the offense did.

THAT is true. And it shouldn't be a problem if you have a competent DC.

 

[4down20]

'normal' meaning when the offense is not HUNH?

There is no HUNH team that regularly gets the ball off in less than 10 seconds on the playclock. Your claims of Baylor and Texas Tech were BS. They do get them off within 10 seconds of the ball being set, but we aren't on a 25 second playclock, it's a 40 second playclock and that clock starts when the previous play is over. Even though the 40 second playclock has a higher number, it was implemented in order to speed up the game over the 25 second clock - think on that.

 

[charlie42s]

I suppose then every announcer that covered a game with a HHNU team was making shit up when told everyone the defense could only sub if the offense did.

Defense can always substitute at any time. However, the play clock is not stopped. If the offense does not substitute, meaning the ball can be snapped at any time.

Only when the offense substitutes is the play clock stopped and no play can start until the defense completes its substitution.

 

[4down20]

Well, you are one of the FEW who believe it will pass. It has virtually no support outside of Saban.

I'm also one of the FEW who seems to understand what the rule really is and how the playclock actually works.

 

[4down20]

Defense can always substitute at any time. However, the play clock is not stopped. If the offense does not substitute, meaning the ball can be snapped at any time.

Which means the defense is forced to defend the entire time and can't substitute.

 

[LawDawg]

Per NCAA rules, if the offense substitutes, the defense is given time to bring in substitutes.

What's not to understand?

As you indicate, the only time the D is guaranteed to be able to substitute is when the O does. I want them to have the absolute right to decide when they sub all the time, not just when the O does. Currently, the O can control that by getting to the LOS to take their signals. Don't want that to continue.

 

[charlie42s]

There is no HUNH team that regularly gets the ball off in less than 10 seconds on the playclock. Your claims of Baylor and Texas Tech were BS. They do get them off within 10 seconds of the ball being set, but we aren't on a 25 second playclock, it's a 40 second playclock and that clock starts when the previous play is over. Even though the 40 second playclock has a higher number, it was implemented in order to speed up the game over the 25 second clock - think on that.

Once again, 'regularly' is an interesting. In two minutes drills, it is common for HUNH offenses to get the play off in 5 seconds.
Offenses that 'regularly' run HUNH could get the ball snapped in 5 or so seconds, but instead use the time to allow the offensive coaches to see the defensive lineup and change the play from the sideline if they deem it. It is the defense's fault if they don't disguise or change what def. play they intend to run.

 

[4down20]

Once again, 'regularly' is an interesting. In two minutes drills, it is common for HUNH offenses to get the play off in 5 seconds.
Offenses that 'regularly' run HUNH could get the ball snapped in 5 or so seconds, but instead use the time to allow the offensive coaches to see the defensive lineup and change the play from the sideline if they deem it. It is the defense's fault if they don't disguise or change what def. play they intend to run.

What part of the clock STARTS AT THE END OF THE PREVIOUS PLAY do you not understand? The play they get off so quick is usually a ball spike.

 

[charlie42s]

Which means the defense is forced to defend the entire time and can't substitute.

... defenses are supposed to defend, that's why they are the defense. Defenses can always call a time out to substitute.

 

[4down20]

... defenses are supposed to defend, that's why they are the defense. Defenses can always call a time out to substitute.

What the fuck are you talking about? This is about being able to substitute players. Defenses defend? Wow, powerful stuff there!

 

[charlie42s]

What part of the clock STARTS AT THE END OF THE PREVIOUS PLAY do you not understand? The play they get off so quick is usually a ball spike.

Untrue. I've seen teams run 3 plays in 15 seconds in 2 minute drill offense and so have you.

 

[LawDawg]

The defense is given that opportunity also. There is a huge difference. Defenses are complaining that it is too hard to make substitutions, because the offense is far more organized and concise in their management. There is no rule inhibiting the defense from making substitutions. This rule will inhibit the offense from snapping prior to 11 seconds by rule. Notice the difference. One inhibits by skill and preparation, the other by legislative mandate. Not hard to figure out why people think this is terrible.

By rule, yes. But the O has found a way to keep that from happening. If this wasn't true, then we wouldn't be having this discussion.

Sorry, but running to the LOS to take signals does, in fact, inhibit the D from using their skill and preparation. Again, if this was not the case, we would not be having this discussion. The legislative mandate is designed to close a loophole in the rules. I think that is a good thing. You don't. We disagree.