RR the break down , a tragic lesson of overhype

[duke1861]

The problem with this staff is they pass on high end talent and always reach, thinking they’re the smartest ppl in the roomHamilton was a phenomenal prospect who fell into our lap at 11 and we traded downThe year before, Christian Darrisaw was on the board at 19, a Virginia born player who played college ball right down the street at Tech. We reached for a 1 year starter LB from Kentucky (who I like but not over Darrisaw)This last year we passed on Jaxon Smith-Njigba at 16 who had no business still being on the boardImagine how diff this team looks with Darrisaw, Hamilton and JSN over Davis, Dotson and Forbes And all 3 of those guys were best on board so it’s not revisionist history looking at players that came out of nowhere that we could have had. They were staring us in the face

We might actually be the last team to roll with a coach centric model.

It simply doesn't work.

 

[Stymietee]

The problem with this staff is they pass on high end talent and always reach, thinking they’re the smartest ppl in the roomHamilton was a phenomenal prospect who fell into our lap at 11 and we traded downThe year before, Christian Darrisaw was on the board at 19, a Virginia born player who played college ball right down the street at Tech. We reached for a 1 year starter LB from Kentucky (who I like but not over Darrisaw)This last year we passed on Jaxon Smith-Njigba at 16 who had no business still being on the boardImagine how diff this team looks with Darrisaw, Hamilton and JSN over Davis, Dotson and Forbes And all 3 of those guys were best on board so it’s not revisionist history looking at players that came out of nowhere that we could have had. They were staring us in the face

Essentially, what I've said about trading down, and giving up the BPA at your draft spot in these situations means your evaluation system is dysfunctional. You're favoring multiple picks of lesser-rated players over a projected more capable one. There's a reason why Washington doesn't have game-changers and is stocked with average NFL players. (Average players = average results)

 

[gkekoa]

Essentially, what I've said about trading down, and giving up the BPA at your draft spot in these situations means your evaluation system is dysfunctional. You're favoring multiple picks of lesser-rated players over a projected more capable one. There's a reason why Washington doesn't have game-changers and is stocked with average NFL players. (Average players = average results)

I typically agree but there are two caveats.

1- Most trade ups in our position are for a QB that is a reach. If you can trade down one or two slots for a desperate team and get their first the following season, it is a good deal, especially if you believe the teams picking before you are going a different route than your guy.

2- If the draft is weak in a given season because there are entire drafts that are complete ass.



I would say option 1 is most likely this season because Harrison is an elite prospect.

 

[Stymietee]

I typically agree but there are two caveats.

1- Most trade ups in our position are for a QB that is a reach. If you can trade down one or two slots for a desperate team and get their first the following season, it is a good deal, especially if you believe the teams picking before you are going a different route than your guy.

2- If the draft is weak in a given season because there are entire drafts that are complete ass.



I would say option 1 is most likely this season because Harrison is an elite prospect.

OK, good points but option #1 assumes that your front office is both competent and has a vision for the targeted players traded down for in the coaching scheme. Assuming any team is more desperate than this one is run-a-way hubris to the 10th power. One other thing, outside of Griffin, when has Washington ever traded up for a QB?

I agree with point #2 but disagree with any regime that we've had recently that's been making that "weak draft" assessment.

 

[skinsdad62]

OK, good points but option #1 assumes that your front office is both competent and has a vision for the targeted players traded down for in the coaching scheme. Assuming any team is more desperate than this one is run-a-way hubris to the 10th power. One other thing, outside of Griffin, when has Washington ever traded up for a QB?

I agree with point #2 but disagree with any regime that we've had recently that's been making that "weak draft" assessment.

Well hopefully the new FO is competent

 

[skinsdad62]

See here is my issue at the time of the Dotson trade , I felt we overdrafted Dotson , I felt we overdrafted BROB , Turner hasn’t produced yet and Sam is now mayfield in some peoples eyes while game changers, were passed on .

Now my issue is in all the yrs as redskins we have developed one game changing qb Sammy Baugh, that’s it

 

[Stymietee]

See here is my issue at the time of the Dotson trade , I felt we overdrafted Dotson , I felt we overdrafted BROB , Turner hasn’t produced yet and Sam is now mayfield in some peoples eyes while game changers, were passed on .

Now my issue is in all the yrs as redskins we have developed one game changing qb Sammy Baugh, that’s it

As you know I have a different perspective when it comes to developing QBs. That said, the recent history of Washington failing to do anything to develop QBs is still a very sore spot for me. As of last Sunday, Ron Rivera has given Sam Howell 9 more games than Dwayne Haskins to "see what they had in him." Now given that factual point, one of two things is true.

1. It doesn't take them very long to determine what they have in a QB. (Haskins = 7 games in their system)

2. It takes them a lot more time to make that determination. (Howell = 16 games in their system)

 

[skinsdad62]

As you know I have a different perspective when it comes to developing QBs. That said, the recent history of Washington failing to do anything to develop QBs is still a very sore spot for me. As of last Sunday, Ron Rivera has given Sam Howell 9 more games than Dwayne Haskins to "see what they had in him." Now given that factual point, one of two things is true.

1. It doesn't take them very long to determine what they have in a QB. (Haskins = 7 games in their system)

2. It takes them a lot more time to make that determination. (Howell = 16 games in their system)

Sams body of work in their 1st 7 games is way. Better then Haskins and Haskins off the field wasn’t great nor was taking selfies while the game was going on .

In fact Sam’s 1st 16 games stacks up as good as the best in our game today and throughout history so maybe it was warranted

 

[Stymietee]

Sams body of work in their 1st 7 games is way. Better then Haskins and Haskins off the field wasn’t great nor was taking selfies while the game was going on .

In fact Sam’s 1st 16 games stacks up as good as the best in our game today and throughout history so maybe it was warranted

Sam has a much better OC, and Howell on the field and especially on the sideline should be regularly checked for a pulse. I understand why Rivera has wrapped himself in Howell, he has no other options that he's aware of and besides considering their collective demeanor, the only thing that Howell hasn't done to mimic his boss's fire is crossing his arms on the sideline.

 

[skinsdad62]

Sam has a much better OC, and Howell on the field and especially on the sideline should be regularly checked for a pulse. I understand why Rivera has wrapped himself in Howell, he has no other options that he's aware of and besides considering their collective demeanor, the only thing that Howell hasn't done to mimic his boss's fire is crossing his arms on the sideline.

Really a better OC ? By what measure ? Certainly not a huge difference

 

[Stymietee]

Really a better OC ? By what measure ? Certainly not a huge difference

Kansas City begs to differ!

EB demands that his players play at a high level, despite their limitations, I'm certain that they are doing the best that they can, but EB didn't put this group together and their best just isn't good by any measure. Huge difference between the Laissez-faire approach of his predecessor!

 

[skinsdad62]

Kansas City begs to differ!

EB demands that his players play at a high level, despite their limitations, I'm certain that they are doing the best that they can, but EB didn't put this group together and their best just isn't good by any measure. Huge difference between the Laissez-faire approach of his predecessor!

Too bad EB didn’t call plays. And EB has virtually the same players as Turner did

 

[skinsdad62]

Sty . Good debate buddy but I will have to take these up tomorrow

 

[Stymietee]

Too bad EB didn’t call plays. And EB has virtually the same players as Turner did

EB calls plays, the problem is that he has virtually the same players that Turner did!

 

[countryroads316]

A lot of issues on offense the Oline sucks badly Robinson is just a average running back then Dotson regressing and Logan Thomas is getting washed up

 

[Stymietee]

A lot of issues on offense the Oline sucks badly Robinson is just a average running back then Dotson regressing and Logan Thomas is getting washed up

Do me a favor... list the elite or game-changing players on this offense, Thanks! Oh and anyone can participate!

 

[Sportster 72]

Sam put in a much greater effort than Haskins did. Haskins was let go because he wasn't putting in the work. Haskins never made it past 3rd QB on a team with a very good HC in Tomlin. It is sad the his life ended the way it did but not completely shocking.

Even more funny is you have decided Howell is average at best but thought Haskins was robbed of good coaching and could be better.

I just can't help your opinions are based on complexion.

 

[Sportster 72]

Here's the good news .... no matter what the new staff decides it is all over in a week and a half and I hope everyone here can have some hope going forward.

 

[j_y19]

Kansas City begs to differ!

EB demands that his players play at a high level, despite their limitations, I'm certain that they are doing the best that they can, but EB didn't put this group together and their best just isn't good by any measure. Huge difference between the Laissez-faire approach of his predecessor!

Well, apparently he doesn’t demand they play at a high level. Results speak for themselves. And, speaking of results, he hasn’t really done anything to speak of here. Near as I can tell, we are as bad as last year on offense. EB is part of the Problem, probably not part of the solution.

 

[Stymietee]

Well, apparently he doesn’t demand they play at a high level. Results speak for themselves. And, speaking of results, he hasn’t really done anything to speak of here. Near as I can tell, we are as bad as last year on offense. EB is part of the Problem, probably not part of the solution.

C'mon man, the tone and tenor are set by the head coach. When you have one-third of the team being held to account and they complain to the head coach who subsequently punts away his obligation to set that tone uniformly, it creates division in the ranks. Further, if the head coach isn't willing to back his OC by demanding the same team-wide, the players will largely follow the head coach and ignore the OC.