Royals > your shitty dogshit excuse for a team

[Rock Strongo]

In innings 7, 8 & 9, the Royals bullpen ERA ranked 7th in the majors, and one of you said WHIP is more important, so I looked that up too, they ranked 12th.

So, now that we've found that the Royals bullpen didn't have the best ERA, WHIP, ERA from 7in on, or WHIP from 7in on in either MLB or the AL, can we quit all the masturbatory "best bullpen in the majors" shit, or should I expect a "well, you have to think about only the 7,8,&9 innings where they had a lead and were able to protect it" post?

They had a great bullpen, but "the best in the majors" is at least debatable, if not just incorrect.

 

[Fountain City Blues]

In innings 7, 8 & 9, the Royals bullpen ERA ranked 7th in the majors, and one of you said WHIP is more important, so I looked that up too, they ranked 12th.

So, now that we've found that the Royals bullpen didn't have the best ERA, WHIP, ERA from 7in on, or WHIP from 7in on in either MLB or the AL, can we quit all the masturbatory "best bullpen in the majors" shit, or should I expect a "well, you have to think about only the 7,8,&9 innings where they had a lead and were able to protect it" post?

They had a great bullpen, but "the best in the majors" is at least debatable, if not just incorrect.

Debatable, but it's not at all debatable they were dominant in high leverage. If they're not the best they weren't far away.

65-5 when leading after 6th

72-1 when leading after 7th

79-1 when leading after 8th

Again what you find is in high leverage, they dominated. You can tiptoe around the issue with raw rate stats, but when push comes to shove, the high leverage relievers were quite dominant. Those ERAs I posted for Herrera, Davis, and Holland definitely did happen, which is why I didn't take the time to look up the overall ERA for innings 7-8-9 from the BP. Low leverage farmhands giving up 7+ runs with a huge lead in the 9th (looking at you Donnie Joseph) means nearly nothing to me, especially when they had no staying power on the roster. If anyone can post a legitimate match for Frasor (6h) Herrera (7th) Davis (8th) and Holland as a closer, I'll concede here. Can those guys pitch every night? No. It's pretty evident in the raw ERA stats you list. Were they legitimately dominant in high leverage, yes. A matter of interpretation of what is "best," but when you have 3 guys with ERA's below 1.5 that pitch 7-8-9, and another with an ERA in the 2's, it's pretty difficult to argue that they aren't the best in my book.


Herrera, Davis, Holland combined for 6.4 fWAR. The "best" BP by raw WAR, the Yankees, 5.5.

 

[Fountain City Blues]

I sense we'll just have to agree to disagree here.

 

[black francis]

Did the Royals lose their perfect season?

Yes

 

[black francis]

Another perfect .1 IP for the Royals bullpen last night

19 IP
0 runs
3 bb
21 k
0.52 WHIP

Thats pretty good

 

[SlinkyRedfoot]

I sense we'll just have to agree to disagree here.

For sure.

You said they had the best bullpen. When their bullpen ERA didn't bear that out, we needed look at WHIP, which also didn't bear that out, so it was much more important to look at innings 7-9, and when their ERA and WHIP in innings 7-9 didn't bear that out, it became more important to look at specific situations in the 7-9 innings and that really, when comparing bullpens, you should only consider the three best guys from each bullpen, despite the fact that there are a lot of relief innings over the course of a season that three guys don't pitch. This has grown tiresome.

They may have had the best back-end bullpen, and they certainly had one of the top bullpens in the majors. Apparently, you need them to have had the best bullpen in the majors, and will refine the definition of "best" and/or "bullpen" to ensure that they fit it.

 

[Rock Strongo]

Another perfect .1 IP for the Royals bullpen last night

19 IP
0 runs
3 bb
21 k
0.52 WHIP

Thats pretty good

 

[black francis]

"we dont have any gay guys on our teams."
-boston

 

[SlinkyRedfoot]

Another perfect .1 IP for the Royals bullpen last night

19 IP
0 runs
3 bb
21 k
0.52 WHIP

Thats pretty good

That's ridiculously good. They've also pitched the 2nd fewest innings, which says a lot about what their starters have been doing. Pretty much every facet of their game has been ridiculously good so far.

Yesterday, I thought I should take the Twins in the pick 'em because obviously they had to lose sometime, but I looked at the starters and went with the Royals. Go figure.

 

[SlinkyRedfoot]

Did you guys know that if you only look at the Indians best hitters, and only consider certain times that they were hitting, the Indians had the best lineup in baseball last year?

 

[SlinkyRedfoot]

Is that Wesley Snipes?

 

[black francis]

That's ridiculously good. They've also pitched the 2nd fewest innings, which says a lot about what their starters have been doing. Pretty much every facet of their game has been ridiculously good so far.

Yesterday, I thought I should take the Twins in the pick 'em because obviously they had to lose sometime, but I looked at the starters and went with the Royals. Go figure.

Gibson has been really good against the Royals
4-0; 1.38 ERA; 1.15 WHIP
26 IP in 4 starts
18 k
3 bb

 

[SlinkyRedfoot]

Gibson has been really good against the Royals
4-0; 1.38 ERA; 1.15 WHIP
26 IP in 4 starts
18 k
3 bb

Now you tell me.

Maybe I should look at that more often. Because pitcher vs team stats tend to be such small sample sizes and that, from year to year, lineups can change so much I've never put much stock in those splits.

It's possible that some guys know when they dominate certain opponents and it gets in their head. After all, 90% of baseball is mental and the other half is physical.

 

[black francis]

Gibson has been really good against the Royals
4-0; 1.38 ERA; 1.15 WHIP
26 IP in 4 starts
18 k
3 bb

6 bb, not 3

 

[Fountain City Blues]

For sure.

You said they had the best bullpen. When their bullpen ERA didn't bear that out, we needed look at WHIP, which also didn't bear that out, so it was much more important to look at innings 7-9, and when their ERA and WHIP in innings 7-9 didn't bear that out, it became more important to look at specific situations in the 7-9 innings and that really, when comparing bullpens, you should only consider the three best guys from each bullpen, despite the fact that there are a lot of relief innings over the course of a season that three guys don't pitch. This has grown tiresome.

They may have had the best back-end bullpen, and they certainly had one of the top bullpens in the majors. Apparently, you need them to have had the best bullpen in the majors, and will refine the definition of "best" and/or "bullpen" to ensure that they fit it.

Well, I think we were working from different definitions of high leverage- and admittedly I probably shouldn't have been so lazy in articulating it; if it comes off as a moving target then it's on me for laziness. The last line with the blackend's fWAR out producing the WAR of every other bullpen, in its entirety, allows me to break a lot of rules I usually apply to bullpens. I do not expect anything quite like that again in my lifetime. It's moreso the exception, not the rule. 3 guys being so dominant so as to be worthy of neglecting the other RP's is preposterously rare.

 

[black francis]

Now you tell me.

Maybe I should look at that more often. Because pitcher vs team stats tend to be such small sample sizes and that, from year to year, lineups can change so much I've never put much stock in those splits.

It's possible that some guys know when they dominate certain opponents and it gets in their head. After all, 90% of baseball is mental and the other half is physical.

I usually don't either until after the fact.

He's not a very good pitcher, but he is just one of the guys who seems to have KC's number

 

[SlinkyRedfoot]

You guys know your shit.

Nice to have some baseball guys to chat with. Haven't really seen it since FN dissolved and it had been deteriorating for a while there prior to that.

I also like to call dougplayer a talking meatball. A Swedish one to be specific, that sounds like the chef from The Muppets. Hoody-who, and all that.

 

[GenJac]

Love the Twins chances today with Milone. Probably their best starter now that Santana is suspended. The Twins can hit. They just have yet to get untracked.

I have a lot of respect for KC, but Rios is a punk. Let me guess, it must be a contract year if he's trying.

 

[black francis]

You guys know your shit.

Nice to have some baseball guys to chat with. Haven't really seen it since FN dissolved and it had been deteriorating for a while there prior to that.

I also like to call dougplayer a talking meatball. A Swedish one to be specific, that sounds like the chef from The Muppets. Hoody-who, and all that.

Love the Twins chances today with Milone. Probably their best starter now that Santana is suspended. The Twins can hit. They just have yet to get untracked.

I have a lot of respect for KC, but Rios is a punk. Let me guess, it must be a contract year if he's trying.

Why is Rios a punk? Because he got hit on his hand?

 

[packerzrule]

Why is Rios a punk? Because he got hit on his hand?

If he were a man, he would have leaned into that pitch with his head