Reds thread

[cincygrad]

This.

We have to many good relief pitchers to not have any kind of offense

Who are you getting for those guys and what positions are you replacing?

You're not replacing 1b, 2B, 3B, RF, or CF. There isn't a team in the league that's giving you a player that can hit and play the field at SS. Our left-fielder (if not seriously injured) is much better than you will get for either reliever and I can't think of a a catcher that would help.

It's all well and good to say we need to upgrade, but where and how would it happen. Where would you start?

 

[cincygrad]

Point being... The team has been constructed - We are what we are. Can't change it much now.

 

[ckhokie]

You're obviously going to have to package some position players.

I agree that the team is set until the trade deadline, but I do worry that we don't have the Astros to beat up on this year, and we were quite lucky with none of our starters going down last year. Worried we wont be as lucky this year

 

[cincygrad]

You're obviously going to have to package some position players.

I agree that the team is set until the trade deadline, but I do worry that we don't have the Astros to beat up on this year, and we were quite lucky with none of our starters going down last year. Worried we wont be as lucky this year

That is a legitimate concern. There is probably zero chance that our rotation pitches every game like last season. Then again, with our bullpen, I think we only need good seasons from about three of them to get by.

 

[bengaldoug]

It was one game, in cold weather.....the bats will warm up when the weather does.....the Angels are a very good team, and the schedule is particularly tough in April....if we can be around .500 the first month we'll be fine.....the Ludwick injury is a definite concern, because Heisey every day isn't a good idea.....

 

[cincygrad]

It was one game, in cold weather.....the bats will warm up when the weather does.....the Angels are a very good team, and the schedule is particularly tough in April....if we can be around .500 the first month we'll be fine.....the Ludwick injury is a definite concern, because Heisey every day isn't a good idea.....

Yeah, I just checked that schedule. Not very kind in April. I think we'll hit, but I think, like last year, we'll go through periods of time where we really struggle to get runs in.

 

[bengaldoug]

Yeah, I just checked that schedule. Not very kind in April. I think we'll hit, but I think, like last year, we'll go through periods of time where we really struggle to get runs in.

I agree, because Bruce, Frazier, and Ludwick, and to a lesser extent Phillips, are very streaky players who blow hot and cold. It's who we are, as you said in an earlier post. We're built on pitching, and my only concern is Leake as the fifth starter. I believe we'll get very good production from the other four, barring injury. Other teams are in the same boat, except few teams have the pitching depth we have.

 

[kramer1]

The domino effect of losing Ludwick is going to be devastating. I was genuinely excited about our chances this season. IMO the season is basically over already barring some miracle trade.

Chris Heisey stinks. He's a bum.

Jay Bruce is a hacker. He's an overpaid bum.

BP will hit 4th now. Cozart will bat 2nd now. God help us. Same shit as last season.

 

[Tubbs1518]

You're obviously going to have to package some position players.

I agree that the team is set until the trade deadline, but I do worry that we don't have the Astros to beat up on this year, and we were quite lucky with none of our starters going down last year. Worried we wont be as lucky this year

This.

You package Arrendondo with Messoraco and a prospect and you go out and get a catcher who has some pop in his bat. Hannigan would be a great #2 catcher. Dude has no chance at the plate. He is a bum.

 

[CrashDavisSports]

This.

You package Arrendondo with Messoraco and a prospect and you go out and get a catcher who has some pop in his bat. Hannigan would be a great #2 catcher. Dude has no chance at the plate. He is a bum.

What in the hell are you talking about? Hanigan is a great catcher and decent offensively. He is not any Brian McCann, but he is a high on base guy, gives a professional at bat, walks more than strikesout and that is saying a lot batting in the 8 hole in front of a pitcher. Now add in the fact he is one of the top defensive catchers in all of baseball, both fielding percent, throwing out runners, managing a pitching staff while being bilingual to help with the latin pitchers on the team, and you are not going to find a better cacther for this team, especially with a young promising catcher like Mesoraco backing him up. Mesoraco has some work to do to become good enough to be a regular ML catcher, but until that time, Hanigan is way more than adquate, bordering on excellent, especially with his 1 million dollar a year contract, which helps us afford guys like Votto, Choo, Bruce, Phillips, Cueto, etc.

If you are replacing anyone in the lineup, you should look at SS, LF and possibly even RF. Although, not many SS in the league can play outstanding SS defensively and hit 15+ homers a year. His average and OBP is somethign to be desired, but he is also only a second year player.

Ludwick was just given a 2 year contract for 15 million, and while Ludwick is a decent #4 hitter and LF'er, I would much rather see Choo in LF long term when Hamilton is ready to man CF on a regular basis, hopefully by next year.

Bruce, he has his issues and is actually a decent contract for his stats, but he has holes in his swing that makes him a liability in the lineup most of the time when he is not on a hot streak.

There is just no where to go out and package anything that would help this team at this point without sacrificing too much.

CF Choo
2B Phillips
1B Votto
LF Frasier
RF Bruce
3B Hannahan
SS Cozart
C Hanigan

Call up Henry Rodriguez for INF depth who is also a switch hitter. Then your bench has: Mesoraco (R), Izturis (S), Rodriguez (S), Heisey (R), Paul (L).

Or, you call up Donald Lutz who is on the 40 man, and platoon Lutz, Heisey and Paul in LF and bat them 6th behind Bruce, and move Fraiser to 4th for now until Ludwick is ready to come back.

With our pitching staff, we should be able to weather the loss of Ludwick as long as they can stay healthy for now, like we did Votto last year. Ludwick will only be gone a couple months at the most. It wasn't his throwing shoulder.

 

[Tubbs1518]

What in the hell are you talking about? Hanigan is a great catcher and decent offensively. He is not any Brian McCann, but he is a high on base guy, gives a professional at bat, walks more than strikesout and that is saying a lot batting in the 8 hole in front of a pitcher. Now add in the fact he is one of the top defensive catchers in all of baseball, both fielding percent, throwing out runners, managing a pitching staff while being bilingual to help with the latin pitchers on the team, and you are not going to find a better cacther for this team, especially with a young promising catcher like Mesoraco backing him up. Mesoraco has some work to do to become good enough to be a regular ML catcher, but until that time, Hanigan is way more than adquate, bordering on excellent, especially with his 1 million dollar a year contract, which helps us afford guys like Votto, Choo, Bruce, Phillips, Cueto, etc.

If you are replacing anyone in the lineup, you should look at SS, LF and possibly even RF. Although, not many SS in the league can play outstanding SS defensively and hit 15+ homers a year. His average and OBP is somethign to be desired, but he is also only a second year player.

Ludwick was just given a 2 year contract for 15 million, and while Ludwick is a decent #4 hitter and LF'er, I would much rather see Choo in LF long term when Hamilton is ready to man CF on a regular basis, hopefully by next year.

Bruce, he has his issues and is actually a decent contract for his stats, but he has holes in his swing that makes him a liability in the lineup most of the time when he is not on a hot streak.

There is just no where to go out and package anything that would help this team at this point without sacrificing too much.

CF Choo
2B Phillips
1B Votto
LF Frasier
RF Bruce
3B Hannahan
SS Cozart
C Hanigan

Call up Henry Rodriguez for INF depth who is also a switch hitter. Then your bench has: Mesoraco (R), Izturis (S), Rodriguez (S), Heisey (R), Paul (L).

Or, you call up Donald Lutz who is on the 40 man, and platoon Lutz, Heisey and Paul in LF and bat them 6th behind Bruce, and move Fraiser to 4th for now until Ludwick is ready to come back.

With our pitching staff, we should be able to weather the loss of Ludwick as long as they can stay healthy for now, like we did Votto last year. Ludwick will only be gone a couple months at the most. It wasn't his throwing shoulder.

Hannigan has to be the most overrated player in baseball. He is a bum. Woo is above average defensively. Like I said, a great backup catcher, should not be a starter. We need to upgrade the offense or this team will not win a world series. Too many players are to inconsistent. Frazier, Bruce, Phillips I'm looking at you. Hell with LUdwick getting older we have no idea how long he will take to come back and Heisey is horrible as well. If Latos doesn't grow up and become a dominant #2 and Bailey doesn't keep playing as well as he was at the end of last year, this is going to be a LONG 1st half of the season.

 

[cincygrad]

The problem is that every team would love a catcher and shortstop that could hit. Unfortunately there just aren't that many in existence.

 

[Tubbs1518]

52 catchers had more HR than Hannigan last year. 52. Hannigan is a perennial .260-.270 hitter with 3-5 HR a 1to1 K-BB ratio. Teams don't respect him in the batting order and for good reason.

 

[CrashDavisSports]

Hannigan has to be the most overrated player in baseball. He is a bum. Woo is above average defensively. Like I said, a great backup catcher, should not be a starter. We need to upgrade the offense or this team will not win a world series. Too many players are to inconsistent. Frazier, Bruce, Phillips I'm looking at you. Hell with LUdwick getting older we have no idea how long he will take to come back and Heisey is horrible as well. If Latos doesn't grow up and become a dominant #2 and Bailey doesn't keep playing as well as he was at the end of last year, this is going to be a LONG 1st half of the season.

You are so out of touch with baseball.

Tampa Bay has been trying to trade for Hanigan for the last two years because they see what kind of catcher he is. Plus, you can't even spell his name right, as it is 1 N, not 2.

Upgrading the offense is in the works, but unfortunately it is going to take a year or so to get it completely right, and by then we are losing Choo anyways, so the offense will take a hit.

The best case scenerio for next year:

CF Hamilton (S)
LF Choo (L)
1B Votto (L)
2B Phillips (R)
RF Bruce (L)
3B Frasier (R)
SS Cozart (R)
C Hanigan / Mesoraco (R)

If I had my druthers, I would sign Choo to a 5 year 60 million dollar extension, and try to trade Bruce for a RH power hitting LF who can hit for around .280 while also hitting 25+ homers. However, that is goign to be hard, because who wants a guy that hits 30 homers but bats .250 when you have a guy that hits 25 homers and bats .280?

3B, Miguel Sano of the Twins would be an ideal target. He is in AA, and is a 3B, but you can move Frasier to LF. Sano has ridiculous power and may very well be a 40+ home run type of guy, especially in a park like GABP. He is a very good hitter, a decent fielder, not great. But bats RH.

Imagine a guy like Sano sandwiched between Votto and Choo in the lineup at #4? He could be domainting, especially with Billy Hamilton and Phillips at the top of the order. Bruce may be able to bring someone like Sano over, but you are taking a huge risk that he keeps progressing. #12 prospect in BA right now.

 

[CrashDavisSports]

52 catchers had more HR than Hannigan last year. 52. Hannigan is a perennial .260-.270 hitter with 3-5 HR a 1to1 K-BB ratio. Teams don't respect him in the batting order and for good reason.

They do too respect him, because he has more walks than strikeouts, which is the first sign they respect him, or they would just pipe the ball to him, instead of nibbling around the corners.

Plus, his OBP is over .360 which is huge in front of a pitcher, because that gives the pitcher more opportunity to bunt Hanigan over to 2nd, instead of the 8 hole guy getting out all the time and the pitcher having to swing away, a much bigger weakness with most pitchers than bunting is.

You have no idea what the hell you are talking about. Hanigan gets nothing to hit, which expalins why he hits so few home runs as well. Stick to football man.

 

[vancelot23]

Now who's getting defensive?

 

[Tubbs1518]

They do too respect him, because he has more walks than strikeouts, which is the first sign they respect him, or they would just pipe the ball to him, instead of nibbling around the corners.

Plus, his OBP is over .360 which is huge in front of a pitcher, because that gives the pitcher more opportunity to bunt Hanigan over to 2nd, instead of the 8 hole guy getting out all the time and the pitcher having to swing away, a much bigger weakness with most pitchers than bunting is.

You have no idea what the hell you are talking about. Hanigan gets nothing to hit, which expalins why he hits so few home runs as well. Stick to football man.

Lol, first off quit being a dick head. 2nd of all, I know plenty about baseball. Not spelling someones name right doesn't mean anything. He BARELY has more walks than strikeouts. Lets not act like he has some 2:1 walk to strikeout ratio. 44:37 35:32. He is also scoring an average of 25 runs a year. WOW, he is dominating in that 8 hole. His defense is not enough to keep him in this lineup. Catchers need to show some semblance of power. Even Mesoraco had more HR than him last year and that is sad because Mesoraco sucked. Give me probably 15-20 other catchers over Hanigan at least.

 

[bengaldoug]

More walks than strikeouts is not a common trait. He didn't score more runs mostly because of guys like Drew Stubbs leaving him on second after the pitcher's sacrifice. Choo should produce much better in those situations. I also don't think you have enough respect for the importance of defense and handling pitchers as a catcher, two area where Hanigan excels. No, he'll never be an all-star because he isn't a power hitter, but imo he's a very valuable player.

 

[Tubbs1518]

More walks than strikeouts is not a common trait. He didn't score more runs mostly because of guys like Drew Stubbs leaving him on second after the pitcher's sacrifice. Choo should produce much better in those situations. I also don't think you have enough respect for the importance of defense and handling pitchers as a catcher, two area where Hanigan excels. No, he'll never be an all-star because he isn't a power hitter, but imo he's a very valuable player.

He would be a very valuable backup. Our pitching and defense are already great, our offense isn't. We need offense and we aren't getting rid of Bruce or Frazier to get it.

 

[kramer1]

Now who's getting defensive?

Tubbs is completely wrong, though. He honestly doesn't know what he's talking about regarding this particular subject.