politics thread

[skinsdad62]

Yo wat.

So that was all over the place but a couple of comments...

Support the guy in office...uhh you expect me to believe thats what you were doing the last 8 years??

Oh speaking of the last 8 years...for somebody who didnt know shit about jobs Obama certainly did a good job overseeing a huge economic turnaround and large decrease in unemployment.

not one year of 3% or more growth no wage increases for the masses , highest % of people out of work since the 40 's

On NK...i hope he can bring peace! That would be awesome! But unfortunately thats unlikely thanks to NK. That said... your apparently flawless president is giving out a lot of praise to a ruthless dictator and saluting his generals. At least he didnt wear a tan suit like obama did. THAT wouldve been bad.

NOKO still have work to do but we sure as hell got him to the table without paying billions like obama did to iran for an agreement the didnt even sign . and my did we forget the castros so freaking fast ? the world has dictators and we have to work with them . its a stupid MSM talking point

And on trump specifically...there are plenty of things he has done to hurt this country both in the short and long run. He has not "done nothing but make life better for all americans". I have 0 confidence he knows what hes doing on any policy really. As far as i can tell hes a bumbling idiot. And he's a terrible person to boot. But hey...he said hed make america great again so lets all just go along for the ride!

 

[gkekoa]

I dont think we should be concerned with if other countries are catching up. Hopefully all countries can thrive. Lets just focus on us. If other countries do well too - great.

Why would people be animals without religion? Most humans have basic moral codes. People who arent religious are no worse than those who are. I think most people generally want to make the world a better place and look out for their fellow humans.

Sure there are plenty of selfish people too but a lot of those people are religious anyways.

If other countries are catching up because we are faltering or we are pulling them up, there is a problem.

Without religion, there is no moral code. Morality would be completely subjective. The basic moral codes people have come from religion.

People without religion are completely selfish. There is no reason for them to good when people aren’t watching.

Of course there are some religious individuals who are selfish. They are human and imperfect. At least they have a code that discourages it.

 

[ehb5]

Slowest economic recovery in US history.

4%economic growth. Lowest unemployment in 44 years and lowest black unemployment in history I think.

Also the 2nd worst economic collapse in US history i believe. It took some time but the economy turned around in a big way.

And FWIW im not actually arguing that Obama did all that. I think he helped in some ways and hurt in some probably. Ultimately the president has a limited amount of inpact on the economy.

I just think when people throw out look at how great the economy is under trump!! Theyre setting themselves up to look like an idiot because you could make the same argument about obama. Reality is both did some good and some bad and both arent fully to blame or thank for the economy.

So basically...view that comment as a response to the stupidity of him essentially saying "the economys good so you cant criticize trump"

Although i will say its pretty unfair to blame the troughs of unemployment on him when things were spiraling out of control.

 

[ehb5]

If other countries are catching up because we are faltering or we are pulling them up, there is a problem.

Without religion, there is no moral code. Morality would be completely subjective. The basic moral codes people have come from religion.

People without religion are completely selfish. There is no reason for them to good when people aren’t watching.

Of course there are some religious individuals who are selfish. They are human and imperfect. At least they have a code that discourages it.

Sure. Like i said. Worry about ourselves. If other countries improve too, cool.

I...dont think thats true...

What? How do you know that? You dont think people who arent religious cant be good when others arent watching? You realize some people just believe in being a good person and looking out for their fellow humans right?

Don't think i'm making some anti religion argument. Im just not making a pro religion argument. There are good and bad religous people and good and bad non religious people.

 

[Rowdy]

Yo wat.

So that was all over the place but a couple of comments...

Support the guy in office...uhh you expect me to believe thats what you were doing the last 8 years??

Oh speaking of the last 8 years...for somebody who didnt know shit about jobs Obama certainly did a good job overseeing a huge economic turnaround and large decrease in unemployment.

On NK...i hope he can bring peace! That would be awesome! But unfortunately thats unlikely thanks to NK. That said... your apparently flawless president is giving out a lot of praise to a ruthless dictator and saluting his generals. At least he didnt wear a tan suit like obama did. THAT wouldve been bad.

And on trump specifically...there are plenty of things he has done to hurt this country both in the short and long run. He has not "done nothing but make life better for all americans". I have 0 confidence he knows what hes doing on any policy really. As far as i can tell hes a bumbling idiot. And he's a terrible person to boot. But hey...he said hed make america great again so lets all just go along for the ride!

This is how I know you’re just listening to college professors. That’s the biggest bunch of bullshit I’ve heard in awhile

 

[ehb5]

This is how I know you’re just listening to college professors. That’s the biggest bunch of bullshit I’ve heard in awhile

1. If its bullshit refute it. But i doubt you can or will. You seem to only be interested in insults and bullshit ratings. You're welcome to try and actually explain why im wrong instead.

2. None of that comes from professors. You and that dum dum from before seem to think professors don't teach material but instead justs spew left wing propaganda.

So let me be clear...in my 4 years my professors told us how to vote, how they voted, or what to think on a given political issue a grand total of 0 times. It simply didnt happen. If you think that is whats happening at universities across the country you have been lied to. Plain and simple.

 

[gkekoa]

1. Serious question...what IS he far left on? He seems slightly left on most issues but certainly nothing crazyfrom what i can tell. Wasnt the most in depth dig though.

2. Sure. Answering honestly isnt harmful. Being an immigrant isn't something people need to hide when responding.

3. Only kinda true. Theres more than one unemployment rate. But regardless... your response didnt answer what i asked..

5. I believe its saying that illegal immigrants are less likely to respond not that legal immigrants are. But yes they do have a risk of under reporting (which i acknowledged) but...theyre aware of that! Thats why the adjust their estimates up. Do they know exactly how much to? Of course not. But they could be over or underestimating a bit. Reality is this is the bext estimate we have and theres no good reason to assume the number is much lower than it should be.

Thats an interesting link but i'm not sure what you're arguing with it. It didn't show anything that made me think immigrants weren't assimilating or that they were a problem.

If i get the chance (though i wont this week) i can give it another look but on my initial look the data looked pretty suspect or at least to be interpreted and used in ill will. And it after all research done by an organization expressly anti immigration and founded by a man with at best ties to white supremacy and fears of america becoming less white.

6. Yea estimates seem to range from like 7 billion to 24 billion in taxes paid by illegal immigrants. You say that they pay a smaller proportion than the of the population but that doesn't seem strange to me. There aren't many illegal immigrants making millions of dollars a year. And again... no problem stopping the inflow of illegal immigration here. The problem is with the handling of those already here, with the damage anti illegal immigration politicians and ideas do to legal immigration, and the rhetoric and way people view illegal immigrants. Also the original point here was about immigrants paying taxes not illegal immigrants. Sooo those numbers aren't really indicative of the issue after all.

7. Im pretty sure they're more entrepreneurial than native born citizens. Wage growth evidence is mixed. It at least isn't cause for much concern. Economic growth is a good thing. And as immigrants stay and have children they bring even more benefits. Im also not sure why you're assuming they bring hardly any innovation or that they dont increase demand for things.

Im not really sure what you're saying here on diversity.

As for education the numbers in your post are not accurate. Those numbers referred to first generation immigrants not their children (and also showed that aside from 2016 theyre more likely to be college educated than native born citizens).

And the tax revenue number you cite again only applies to illegal immigrants which was not the original point here.

10. Sure, but my argument isnt that we should be taking these people in out of pity or a moral obligation so i dont see how the UN has to do with it.

Not that you cant make that argument but its not really what i'm arguing here.

11. Because punishing the businesses hurts the businesses and the families of people living in this country. That seems bad, no?

Also theres uhh a slight difference between illegal immigration and murder...

12. Ok? If i have this down right...i said "i wish we had more candidates who understand immigration" and your response was... "no! The left doesnt understand immigration theyre just using it to their advantage"...

Huh?

13. Hes generally anti free trade and pro trade wars. That's... kinda bad. Is this gonna drag us off topic? Lol

16. No. None of those things are. Theyre not evidence of assimilation but theyre certainly not evidence of a lack of assimilation.

1- Abortion is a fundamental human right. No death penalty. Anti-second amendment to include suing gun manufacturers. Wants universal healthcare and wants to take away the choice of people by controlling their portion size (soda ban and trans fat ban). Legalize illegals. Wants to cut entitlements, not welfare programs. Tax the rich, except him.

2- Sorry my friend. That isn’t believable. Only a fool admits openly to committing a crime and you are not a fool. Neither are most illegals.

3- Actually, completely true. The unemployment rate only includes those actively seeking. The labor participation rate is different. The response did ask why the labor participation rate is better. The unemployment rate does not include those not looking for work.

5- “The foreign-born, unauthorized immigrants and nonimmigrants in particular, are less likely than native-born Americans to respond to or to be included in responses to gov- ernment surveys.” This was the direct quote. It says nothing about estimating up.

If enough people are immigrating, eventually the culture will shift towards them. Something as simple as press 2 for Spanish shows a lack of assimilation. From there, immigrants usually live in immigrant communities. They are not assimilating with the native population.

6- So an illegal who entered yesterday is OK with you but not one entering today? At what point are you OK with them, one year, ten years? What is wrong with an anti-illegal immigration politician? That is like having a problem with an anti-********* politician...just a different law. How does an anti-illegal immigration politician hurt legal immigration? As for how illegals are viewed, most see it like this. These are people who are doing what we would do, but that doesn’t make it right for them to do it. That is why there needs to be a greater deterrent. I thought we have been using a combination of both legal and illegal immigrants throughout the conversation.

7- What could possibly lead you to the conclusion that immigrants are more entrepreneurial than the native population, or vice versa? You can’t actually compare wage growth with immigrants to wage growth without because one hasn’t happened. Basic economics would say wage growth would be greater without, at least in occupations where immigrants frequent. Is economic growth a good thing if it isn’t in deficit spending, both sides to blame? Of course the US economy will grow if we have 20 trillion in spending that was never allocated. I will continue to call bullshit on immigrant children. I say they don’t bring as much innovation because their education level is much lower on average. I said they bring less demand than the Native American because they tend to send more money back to their home country which aids the US demand for goods nada.

10- How do you believe we should take these people in?

11- Arent businesses who hire illegals in violation of the law? It is like PEDs in sports. We all want an equal footing. These businesses do not have to hire illegals. They choose to for lower labor costs. There is also a similarity in crossing the border illegally and murder...both are illegal.

12- I was going by your intended meaning of understanding immigration. We all have different beliefs on the effects of immigration and what would happen without the mass immigration we allow. You want us to understand it like a liberal does...but all the liberal truly understands is it increases their voting block.

13- Is he anti-free trade? He is anti the current system which sees the US getting fucked. Is he pro-trade war or is this a negotiating tactic? Do me a favor and google economist says Trump knows tariffs can’t hurt US economy. I would post the link but MSN is blocked right now.

 

[gkekoa]

Also the 2nd worst economic collapse in US history i believe. It took some time but the economy turned around in a big way.

And FWIW im not actually arguing that Obama did all that. I think he helped in some ways and hurt in some probably. Ultimately the president has a limited amount of inpact on the economy.

I just think when people throw out look at how great the economy is under trump!! Theyre setting themselves up to look like an idiot because you could make the same argument about obama. Reality is both did some good and some bad and both arent fully to blame or thank for the economy.

So basically...view that comment as a response to the stupidity of him essentially saying "the economys good so you cant criticize trump"

Although i will say its pretty unfair to blame the troughs of unemployment on him when things were spiraling out of control.

It makes the recovery easier. That is why it is so disturbing that he had the slowest recovery ever. I actually agree with you regarding a president having a limited economic role and they should. The policies should be limited and consistent allowing the market forces to equalize. I will disagree that Trump has done anything bad for the economy though.

Unless I can point at specific issues regarding his policies on unemployment. Extending unemployment benefits had a severely negative impact because it decreased the incentive for people to look for jobs, this increasing the time to get back to work. Take a look at the impact of long term unemployment on future employment.

 

[Rowdy]

1. If its bullshit refute it. But i doubt you can or will. You seem to only be interested in insults and bullshit ratings. You're welcome to try and actually explain why im wrong instead.

2. None of that comes from professors. You and that dum dum from before seem to think professors don't teach material but instead justs spew left wing propaganda.

So let me be clear...in my 4 years my professors told us how to vote, how they voted, or what to think on a given political issue a grand total of 0 times. It simply didnt happen. If you think that is whats happening at universities across the country you have been lied to. Plain and simple.

1. I didn’t insult you.
2. Skinsdad and gk refuted the bullshit well enough

 

[gkekoa]

Sure. Like i said. Worry about ourselves. If other countries improve too, cool.

I...dont think thats true...

What? How do you know that? You dont think people who arent religious cant be good when others arent watching? You realize some people just believe in being a good person and looking out for their fellow humans right?

Don't think i'm making some anti religion argument. Im just not making a pro religion argument. There are good and bad religous people and good and bad non religious people.

So you believe we should stop all foreign aid too?

There is no incentive for them to do so. I believe people are generally selfish and self-serving because that is the nature of all animals. No, I do not believe people believe in just being good. I believe there is a limit to the goodness of all atheists.

I never said there were not good and bad of each. I was speaking in general terms and don’t believe in absolutes when it comes to people.

 

[ehb5]

1- Abortion is a fundamental human right. No death penalty. Anti-second amendment to include suing gun manufacturers. Wants universal healthcare and wants to take away the choice of people by controlling their portion size (soda ban and trans fat ban). Legalize illegals. Wants to cut entitlements, not welfare programs. Tax the rich, except him.

2- Sorry my friend. That isn’t believable. Only a fool admits openly to committing a crime and you are not a fool. Neither are most illegals.

3- Actually, completely true. The unemployment rate only includes those actively seeking. The labor participation rate is different. The response did ask why the labor participation rate is better. The unemployment rate does not include those not looking for work.

5- “The foreign-born, unauthorized immigrants and nonimmigrants in particular, are less likely than native-born Americans to respond to or to be included in responses to gov- ernment surveys.” This was the direct quote. It says nothing about estimating up.

If enough people are immigrating, eventually the culture will shift towards them. Something as simple as press 2 for Spanish shows a lack of assimilation. From there, immigrants usually live in immigrant communities. They are not assimilating with the native population.

6- So an illegal who entered yesterday is OK with you but not one entering today? At what point are you OK with them, one year, ten years? What is wrong with an anti-illegal immigration politician? That is like having a problem with an anti-********* politician...just a different law. How does an anti-illegal immigration politician hurt legal immigration? As for how illegals are viewed, most see it like this. These are people who are doing what we would do, but that doesn’t make it right for them to do it. That is why there needs to be a greater deterrent. I thought we have been using a combination of both legal and illegal immigrants throughout the conversation.

7- What could possibly lead you to the conclusion that immigrants are more entrepreneurial than the native population, or vice versa? You can’t actually compare wage growth with immigrants to wage growth without because one hasn’t happened. Basic economics would say wage growth would be greater without, at least in occupations where immigrants frequent. Is economic growth a good thing if it isn’t in deficit spending, both sides to blame? Of course the US economy will grow if we have 20 trillion in spending that was never allocated. I will continue to call bullshit on immigrant children. I say they don’t bring as much innovation because their education level is much lower on average. I said they bring less demand than the Native American because they tend to send more money back to their home country which aids the US demand for goods nada.

10- How do you believe we should take these people in?

11- Arent businesses who hire illegals in violation of the law? It is like PEDs in sports. We all want an equal footing. These businesses do not have to hire illegals. They choose to for lower labor costs. There is also a similarity in crossing the border illegally and murder...both are illegal.

12- I was going by your intended meaning of understanding immigration. We all have different beliefs on the effects of immigration and what would happen without the mass immigration we allow. You want us to understand it like a liberal does...but all the liberal truly understands is it increases their voting block.

13- Is he anti-free trade? He is anti the current system which sees the US getting fucked. Is he pro-trade war or is this a negotiating tactic? Do me a favor and google economist says Trump knows tariffs can’t hurt US economy. I would post the link but MSN is blocked right now.

1. Id say 1 naybe 2 of those things listed are far left but that's about it.

2. It's not admitting to committing a crime.

3. No that is not true. There are multiple unemployment rates. U3 does not include those who have given up on the job search. U6 does.

The labor force participation rate does not tell you why people arent participating in the labor force. A decrease in the rate wouldnt inherently mean theres something wrong with the economy.

5. Look again it does talk about estimating it up. I believe they estimate upwards about 10-15%.

6. Sure we pick up things from their cultures like we always have. America is a mixing pot culture. Immigrants continue to add to that. They also pick up on what americans are like. It all comes together.

Is pressing 2 for spanish bad? For 1 we dont even have a national language. Some people have just arrived. Some are learning english but arent good at it yet. Some are just more comfortable with spanish. Is helping people communicate a bad thing? There's simply no evidencethat doing so is preventing assimilation or keeping people from learning English.

Immigrants have always lived in immigrant communities. You dont walk into a new country and immediately fit in. Over time you do. Weve seen this story a milion times.

6. Basically. I think the focus should be on stopping the illegal entry not on tearing apart families already here. Thats pretty reasonable.

You're putting words in my mouth. I didn't say there's something inherently wrong with anti illegal immigration politicians. But they are generally anti immigration as a whole. Their policies tend to be harmful to all immigration and to families already living in the US and i think they enable or even promote some harmful ideas about what immigrants are actually like. When all that happens, yea i do think thats a problem.

Idk about most but MANY people view illegal immigrants as dangerous people or bad people. That simply isnt accurate. Theres a lot of anger and lack of empathy towards these people thanks to frankly dishonest media and political rhetoric.

And we can (and have) discussed both but they arent interchangeable terms.

7. The data mostly Immigrants aren't taking your jobs, they're making their own

No economically speaking it doesn't suggest worse wage growth. You can't just say supply and demand because the labor supply increased. Labor markets are more complex than that and you have to account for labor demand increasing.

Yes economic growth is a good thing.

You can call bulsshit on immigrant children if you want but the data bears out what im saying.

Is there a source that significant amounts of money are being sent back home?

10. Who? Not sure i understand the question.

11. I think that assumes illegal immigrants aren't employable unless they cheat the system which i don't think is true.

Yea i think you still know there's a difference between those things.

12. *shrug* im not a liberal. And clearly my views on immigration don't come from me wanting to increase a voting block. So theres a disconnect there somewhere between what im saying and what you think im saying.

Im sure there are plenty of dem politicians who don't know jack shit about immigration. Im asking for informed politicians. I don't see how that's partisan?

13. Yea i think so. Although i doubt a bit that he understands trade so who really knows. Considering he said trade wars are good and easy to win im gonna say yes he is pro trade wars.

I'll look it up in a bit.

 

[ehb5]

It makes the recovery easier. That is why it is so disturbing that he had the slowest recovery ever. I actually agree with you regarding a president having a limited economic role and they should. The policies should be limited and consistent allowing the market forces to equalize. I will disagree that Trump has done anything bad for the economy though.

Unless I can point at specific issues regarding his policies on unemployment. Extending unemployment benefits had a severely negative impact because it decreased the incentive for people to look for jobs, this increasing the time to get back to work. Take a look at the impact of long term unemployment on future employment.

Does it?

*shrug* agree to disagree. Im not diving into another whole convo rn lol.

I could see that negatively impacting the speed of the recovery (though im not sure it definitely did either) but i dont see how that would make the plummet any worse.

 

[ehb5]

1. I didn’t insult you.
2. Skinsdad and gk refuted the bullshit well enough

1. *shrug* fair enough but you did seem to be saying my thoughts are nothing but an extension of former professors ive had which...is completely wrong considering they didnt tell jack all about politics and i jist happen to enjoy being at least decently informed on my own.

2. No they didnt. We have been debating a seperate issue from the post you were referring to. Im starting to think you just cant actually tell me why im wrong.

 

[Rowdy]

1. *shrug* fair enough but you did seem to be saying my thoughts are nothing but an extension of former professors ive had which...is completely wrong considering they didnt tell jack all about politics and i jist happen to enjoy being at least decently informed on my own.

2. No they didnt. We have been debating a seperate issue from the post you were referring to. Im starting to think you just cant actually tell me why im wrong.

This one in particular and there are others. I use an iPad when on this site, so no I don’t do much typing. Obama ruined the economy with Obamacare, too many regulations on businesses, letting illegal immigrants in, the list goes on and on brother.

my issue with obama is this

fast and furious happened under his watch , holder held in contempt of congress nothing happened

IRS scandal , lois lerner and obama's IRS targeted conservative groups holding up conservative groups tax free status . LERNER pleads the 5th and nothing happens

bengazi , the ambassador over and over again asked for more security and nothing happens . he gets killed , incident is blamed on a video , which was a lie from the get go and they were left to die because of an election

email server , obama lied knowing about it as the IG report released thursday clearly shows , HRC deletes 30 thousand emails and destroys evidence and nothing happens . comey writes exoneration letter BEFORE he interviews her . foriegn agents got secret information from her server and THAT is a crime and nothing happen , the investigation was a fraud and the same people who did that are /were on the russian collusion BS scandal

Obamas FBI and DOJ lied to a FISA judge to get a warrant to "investigate Trump " based on a dossier HRC bought and paid for . Then obama puts a spy in an opposition candidates campaign and people are ok with that

HRC , Debbie wauserman shultz and Danna Brazil rigged the democratic primary to favor HRC over BERNIE

hell donna brazile gave HRC debate questions before the CNN debate with Trump

on all the debates TRUMP had to debate HRC AND the freaking moderators

over and over again trump supporters are labeled as dumb stupid , trailer park trash , racist angry middle aged white men who control their wives and are deplorable and the media and ate up leftist think that is how trump won

and over and over again leftist dont get why he was elected . they think its all of the above . well it isnt . its because we dont want socialist govt . we dont want to be told how to think and what to do and get guilt shoved up our ass every 5 minutes for shit that happened centuries ago . we want our govt to work , take care of us and defend us . we want LEGAL immigration . we want promises carried out and we are tired of assholes who think they are RULERS and not public servants

nobody rioted when obama was elected ,

there is either a 5-1 to 12-1 (depending on whose data ) of college professor's being liberal to conservative

we see the saul alynski playbook playing out before our eyes and we get called conspiracy theorist by jerks who have never read "rules for radical " know the philosophy of the author or simply WANT the BS he does but are too fake to say it

people arent stupid , we see this BS going on and the american public is catching on to the crap that our elitist jackasses think we are too stupid to know

 

[ehb5]

This one in particular and there are others. I use an iPad when on this site, so no I don’t do much typing. Obama ruined the economy with Obamacare, too many regulations on businesses, letting illegal immigrants in, the list goes on and on brother.

His post doesnt refute anything i said though. Its not even about the same things i talked about.

That having been said...

You can say obama ruined the economy but the reality is we were in the middle of the second worst economic collapse in US history when he took over and by the time he left office the economy was thriving.

Also net illegal immigration has been significantly less frequent than before obama. Idk why he would be the one to blame for that.

 

[Sharkinva]

So you believe we should stop all foreign aid too?

There is no incentive for them to do so. I believe people are generally selfish and self-serving because that is the nature of all animals. No, I do not believe people believe in just being good. I believe there is a limit to the goodness of all atheists.

I never said there were not good and bad of each. I was speaking in general terms and don’t believe in absolutes when it comes to people.

Dude.. you act as if the US is providing aid out of the Christian Kindness of our hearts. The reality is, the aid is provided to gain influence, nothing more nothing less. And it has dick to do with how giving Americans are.

I have seen that there is a limit to the goodness of Christians especially since most Christian aid missions I know of come with the cost of being willing to actually convert.

 

[Sharkinva]

Also net illegal immigration has been significantly less frequent than before obama. Idk why he would be the one to blame for that.

Well obviously because he didnt want to build a wall, put armed guards on said wall and set up drone strikes against illegals trying to invade our country and destroy our way of life. Havent you been listening??

 

[ehb5]

Well obviously because he didnt want to build a wall, put armed guards on said wall and set up drone strikes against illegals trying to invade our country and destroy our way of life. Havent you been listening??

U right my b

 

[gkekoa]

1. Id say 1 naybe 2 of those things listed are far left but that's about it.

2. It's not admitting to committing a crime.

3. No that is not true. There are multiple unemployment rates. U3 does not include those who have given up on the job search. U6 does.

The labor force participation rate does not tell you why people arent participating in the labor force. A decrease in the rate wouldnt inherently mean theres something wrong with the economy.

5. Look again it does talk about estimating it up. I believe they estimate upwards about 10-15%.

6. Sure we pick up things from their cultures like we always have. America is a mixing pot culture. Immigrants continue to add to that. They also pick up on what americans are like. It all comes together.

Is pressing 2 for spanish bad? For 1 we dont even have a national language. Some people have just arrived. Some are learning english but arent good at it yet. Some are just more comfortable with spanish. Is helping people communicate a bad thing? There's simply no evidencethat doing so is preventing assimilation or keeping people from learning English.

Immigrants have always lived in immigrant communities. You dont walk into a new country and immediately fit in. Over time you do. Weve seen this story a milion times.

6. Basically. I think the focus should be on stopping the illegal entry not on tearing apart families already here. Thats pretty reasonable.

You're putting words in my mouth. I didn't say there's something inherently wrong with anti illegal immigration politicians. But they are generally anti immigration as a whole. Their policies tend to be harmful to all immigration and to families already living in the US and i think they enable or even promote some harmful ideas about what immigrants are actually like. When all that happens, yea i do think thats a problem.

Idk about most but MANY people view illegal immigrants as dangerous people or bad people. That simply isnt accurate. Theres a lot of anger and lack of empathy towards these people thanks to frankly dishonest media and political rhetoric.

And we can (and have) discussed both but they arent interchangeable terms.

7. The data mostly Immigrants aren't taking your jobs, they're making their own

No economically speaking it doesn't suggest worse wage growth. You can't just say supply and demand because the labor supply increased. Labor markets are more complex than that and you have to account for labor demand increasing.

Yes economic growth is a good thing.

You can call bulsshit on immigrant children if you want but the data bears out what im saying.

Is there a source that significant amounts of money are being sent back home?

10. Who? Not sure i understand the question.

11. I think that assumes illegal immigrants aren't employable unless they cheat the system which i don't think is true.

Yea i think you still know there's a difference between those things.

12. *shrug* im not a liberal. And clearly my views on immigration don't come from me wanting to increase a voting block. So theres a disconnect there somewhere between what im saying and what you think im saying.

Im sure there are plenty of dem politicians who don't know jack shit about immigration. Im asking for informed politicians. I don't see how that's partisan?

13. Yea i think so. Although i doubt a bit that he understands trade so who really knows. Considering he said trade wars are good and easy to win im gonna say yes he is pro trade wars.

I'll look it up in a bit.

1- There are only so many issues. 1 or 2 makes him far left. Hell what is left?

2- If you admit to being in the country illegally, it is a crime. Crossing the border without authorization is illegal.

3- The unemployment rate...THE...the one people always quote is U3. I never said the labor participation rate explains why people are not working. I said it is better than the unemployment rate.

5- OK. I did see a 10% correction for both legal and illegal immigrants but they openly admit illegals will be less likely to answer. From there, what percentage of natural born citizens fill out a census. Honestly a 10% correction seems to severely undershoot illegals participation in the census because that isn’t human nature. I would say fewer than half participate.

6- When does it stop? Let’s say an illegal family comes in tomorrow. Should we tear them apart? Why is that different from a family who entered yesterday?

Again, the claims you make about immigration as a whole being helpful aren’t aligned with everybody else’s thoughts. It doesn’t make any set of people more knowledgeable with regards to immigration than another...it is just another belief. Go up to an anti-immigrant person and ask them an exact question. Ask them what percentage of immigrants are criminals. I think you will be very surprised by the answer.

7- I couldn’t get the site to come up but I did see it was VOX...ultra liberal garbage.

Like I said, labor demand won’t increase to the level you are suggesting. At best, labor demand and supply would offset assuming they spent all their money here and were as consumer driven as Americans, which they aren’t.

Economic growth by using deficit spending, which we have done for years, is foolish. Eventually, debt catches up with you.

The data you claim represents it.

More than 54 billion annually. Remittances play huge role in immigrant economy

10- People immigrate to improve their lives. One purpose of he UN is to assist countries that would produce refugees or help refugees themselves. So if the UN were doing its job, wouldn’t it be improving the conditions in these people’s home countries?

11- Illegal immigrants are not legally employable in the US. By definition they have to cheat the system.

Yeah...I think you know there is a similarity in those things. Is it unlawful to enter the country illegally? Isn’t the job of the POTUS to enforce the law?

12- Informed on your way of thinking. I will guarantee almost all of these politicians are informed. They may not believe some of the things your liberal teachers have taught you.

13- We will see when this works. He doesn’t like trade wars unless he is winning which we will.

Economist: Trump knows China tariffs retaliation can’t hurt US economy

 

[gkekoa]

Dude.. you act as if the US is providing aid out of the Christian Kindness of our hearts. The reality is, the aid is provided to gain influence, nothing more nothing less. And it has dick to do with how giving Americans are.

I have seen that there is a limit to the goodness of Christians especially since most Christian aid missions I know of come with the cost of being willing to actually convert.

We gave aid to 184 countries economically. We gave aid militarily to 142 countries. That was 33.2 billion dollars and 96% of the countries on the face of the Earth. Do you believe that is all for influence? Do you really believe we need to influence Israel or England?

Funny...I have participated in some of those missions with no expectation of conversion.