OT: Racist Math questions for 3rd graders in Georgia

[Smart]

Ha ha. Everything you post is based off of YOUR assumptions... yet you come in here and say we're assuming this and that.

You're just ridiculous. Your ENTIRE argument in this is based on what YOU THINK was taught away from the math class.

So, it is totally coincidence that the teacher decided to name the slave Frederick? Really, that is your argument? If there was a Jewish girl named Anne Frank, would you pretend that a coincidential decision by a antisemetic teacher, or would you assume that maybe the kids were learning about Anne Frank?

Also, I am not accusing anybody of being racist. When you make an accusation about a math question (and in turn, a teacher) being racist, you should probably know the context.

 

[sayheykid1]

the shit is everywhere,and yes they sleep with anyone the can most have no boundries and you know it as for them being racist hell there are just as many blacks that are racist as there are whites,,get off your fucking horse,I'm tired of your shit

I know that anyone can be racist but you are an idiot for believing that sleeping with someone outside your race makes yo a racist. Or is it only back dudes that sleep with white women that are racist?

 

[Arete Tzu]

So you have no idea about the context. That's a problem. What if slavery is the topic for social studies at the same time? With the same teacher?

Do you know what was being taught in social studies at the time? You are playing devils advocate, without all the information so how is your stance any more solid?

 

[imac_21]

Ok and this case is coming from the American South, Georgia is as south as it gets. So when you consider what you are saying about this conditioning, and their long history with racism and slavery, what form of slavery do you think is most likely to have inspired this question? Do you honestly expect Georgians to come to any other conclusion? Their families are only a few generations removed from slavery. it's not over sensitivity, it's the condition they are still dealing with. That's where their consciousness is.

Ancient slaves where men with debts, prisoners of war, war criminals etc... it didn't come with a systematic eradication of their people's identity, and other racial implications of our slavery. Thanks to that eradication many blacks still identify with slavery as the start of their history. Their family history goes back to the day they landed on the plantation, and had their name changed to Fredrick, and where forced to pick cotton. Of course racial connections will be made in this case.




I don't have a problem with most of what you are saying here. The only problem I have is the idea that a math class is the place to teach it, as well as the manner the teacher chose to do it.

An issue like slavery especially in the south, needs more context given to it than "how many times was the slave beaten?" Social studies class where the main focus will cover it, is a better place for it. How far does that question really go to inform kids? The teacher couldn't come up with any other way of counting to 7 than involving slave beatings? In my school we had "jim put _ oranges in a basket" type of questions, and our minds stayed on math, it didn't venture off into slavery and shift our focus in anyway, we discussed slavery in depth, and did it in the proper setting.

I disagree with the idea that slavery and racism should work their way into EVERY field. The interjection of it into everything kids think about, creates what social psychologists describe as "Sterotype threat" when people hear about how they where slaves over and over in every field they study, it creates a complex. The kids who are most likely to be effected by this type of interjection are the black descendants of slaves, who have had their true historic identity eradicated. There is no reason to force it into everything, it should be taught as a specific focus, with more respect given to it, than counting slave beatings.

I take offense to the idea that the teacher is teaching slavery in math. This is not teaching slavery. This is using slavery to teach math. Unless you are somehow aware of everything else this class is learning, in all other subject areas, accusing the teacher of teaching slavery in this way is irresponsible.

You even say it needs more context. My question is how do you know more context hasn't been provided? Are we to believe that 3 questions on a math worksheet is the extent of discussion about slavery in this class?

I think you are approaching this from an incredibly myopic perspective. Multiple times you imply that the only discussion this class had of slavery was these 3 questions. If you can't acknowledge there was likely a lot more discussion on slavery than this worksheet, I can't see how you can discuss and debate the educational system.

Does that seem likely?

 

[Arete Tzu]

Racism is a crime?

No it's not a crime, just held in contempt by decent people. Crimes are committed in the name of racism all the time. Remember the black guy who was tied to the back of the truck, and drug through Texas?

To me racists are as despicable as some of the other things I named.

 

[sayheykid1]

Do you really think it is coincidence that they chose the name of the single most famous ex-slave in history? I certainly doubt it, considering Frederick is not your stereotypical name of a slave.

They probably are just building context to talk about the obstacles he overcame in his life. You just assume that this is the entire lesson, when in all liklihood, it wasn't. The rush to judgment by you all is appalling and sort of disgusting.

What leads you to that conclusion?

 

[imac_21]

Do you know what was being taught in social studies at the time? You are playing devils advocate, without all the information so how is your stance any more solid?

I'm not making any accusations. I have no idea what they were discussing in social studies.

Assuming this teacher went through university and received a degree which qualifies him or her to teach, I think it's safe to assume the topic of slavery came up in places other than math.

I think it's incredibly ignorant to accuse someone of racism without having all the facts. Particularly when some of the facts you don't have are things like "context."

It sure would be something if you had a 6 or 7 hour discussion with your boss and someone took 3 sentences of that discussion to judge you.

 

[Smart]

Since apparently you guys missed the memo the first ten times I said this:

THE SLAVE WAS NAMED FREDERICK

Are you guys seriously going to pretend with a straight face that this was not associated with some sort of history lesson? If that were the case, the slave would be named Bubba or Antoine or Rodney or about a thousand other more racist names that don't happen to be shared with the most famous and admired ex-slave in American history.

 

[sayheykid1]

So, it is totally coincidence that the teacher decided to name the slave Frederick? Really, that is your argument? If there was a Jewish girl named Anne Frank, would you pretend that a coincidential decision by a antisemetic teacher, or would you assume that maybe the kids were learning about Anne Frank?

Also, I am not accusing anybody of being racist. When you make an accusation about a math question (and in turn, a teacher) being racist, you should probably know the context.

I saw nothing in the story that mentions a last name (like Douglass or Frank) and I saw nothing to indicate that they were talking about a slave that went on to great things as a free man.

 

[threelittleturds]

So, it is totally coincidence that the teacher decided to name the slave Frederick? Really, that is your argument? If there was a Jewish girl named Anne Frank, would you pretend that a coincidential decision by a antisemetic teacher, or would you assume that maybe the kids were learning about Anne Frank?

Also, I am not accusing anybody of being racist. When you make an accusation about a math question (and in turn, a teacher) being racist, you should probably know the context.

Super, where did it say Frederick Douglass?? Oh yeah, it didn't. Just an assumption you made... why aren't your own assumptions disgusting and appalling??

Weird

 

[Smart]

What leads you to that conclusion?

I hope you aren't planning on ever taking the LSAT, because you would completely bomb logical reasoning.

What is more likely: this is some racist lesson where they just happened to use the rare name "Frederick" or that they used Frederick because it was part of a lesson on noted abolitionist Frederick Douglass?

This should be a question that eight year olds should be able to answer, so I don't know why a grown person is struggling with it.

 

[Epic Voidfield]

Sorry. I should have been more specific. What was this 3rd grade class discussing in social studies when these math questions came up?

If it was history, there's a chance it was 18th century America. If that were the case, how do you suggest they discuss that without discussing slavery. Particularly in the south.

According to the article, they were incorporating "cross-curricular" activities, which from the time period (slavery), implies late 18th century to probably the beginning of the civil war (which is later discussed in 5th grade in most U.S grammar schools).

They can discuss slavery all they want. My contention isn't about slavery or racism per se, but more on how inaccurate it is to teach math application with "slave activities" like beatings per weeks, equal orange picking by slaves. None of that crap sounds "accurate" in the first place. Masters beat their slaves at random. Slave work was never "equally distributed" like how the math problem suggests. Some slaves were worked to death. It is not only disservice to the history subject, but also a mockery on how to learn math and its application. Do you now get it?

So again, I go back to my original question: Do you believe these activities (teaching slavery and teaching multiplication/division application) are mutually exclusive from one another? The answer to that question is yes. These teachers found it otherwise, and when you do that, they have a responsibility to it's credibility.

You can teach mathematics properly with real applications that relate to the real world and not some pseudo-historical bullshit like what these teachers are doing with Fredrick and his beatings. These teachers failed miserably.

 

[threelittleturds]

Since apparently you guys missed the memo the first ten times I said this:

THE SLAVE WAS NAMED FREDERICK

Are you guys seriously going to pretend with a straight face that this was not associated with some sort of history lesson? If that were the case, the slave would be named Bubba or Antoine or Rodney or about a thousand other more racist names that don't happen to be shared with the most famous and admired ex-slave in American history.

Roach said the teachers were attempting to incorporate social studies into math problems.

Who is pretending it wasn't?? The article clearly stated that it was.

Although, I am really enjoying your stance that YOUR assumptions have to be correct. Clearly it is about Frederick Douglass, and clearly the other lesson was about his positive achievements. Which is why the question was about how many times Frederick was beaten, instead of how many fellow freed slaves he taught how to read...

Clearly... the point of this test was to teach the positive things about slavery...

You must have completely bombed the logic part of that test, because yours is horrific...

 

[Smart]

Super, where did it say Frederick Douglass?? Oh yeah, it didn't. Just an assumption you made... why aren't your own assumptions disgusting and appalling??

Weird

I'm done getting trolled, dude. If you think all assumptions are equally valid, I pity you. Seriously, I do. My hunch is that you don't. If this is true, and you think that somehow the usage of the name Frederick is coincidence, I feel sorry and will say a prayer tonight that you not reproduce and that you have a job of minimal importance. In all seriousness, though, I think you know that I am right and are just trolling. Hopefully, a mod will see this and ban you. We come to SportsHoopla precisely to avoid crap like this.

 

[imac_21]

According to the article, they were incorporating "cross-curricular" activities, which from the time period (slavery), implies late 18th century to probably the beginning of the civil war (which is later discussed in 5th grade in most U.S grammar schools).

They can discuss slavery all they want. My contention isn't about slavery or racism per se, but more on how inaccurate it is to teach math application with "slave activities" like beatings per weeks, equal orange picking by slaves. None of that crap sounds "accurate" in the first place. Masters beat their slaves at random. Slave work was never "equally distributed" like how the math problem suggests. Some slaves were worked to death. It is not only disservice to the history subject, but also a mockery on how to learn math and its application. Do you now get it?

So again, I go back to my original question: Do you believe these activities (teaching slavery and teaching multiplication/division application) are mutually exclusive from one another? The answer to that question is yes. These teachers found it otherwise, and when you do that, they have a responsibility to it's credibility.

You can teach mathematics properly with real applications that relate to the real world and not some pseudo-historical bullshit like what these teachers are doing with Fredrick and his beatings. These teachers failed miserably.

I believe that using cross-curricular activities is a great way to teach children. It can promote discussion and allow students to understand concepts in more ways.

Are slavery and multiplication mutually exclusive? No more so than many word problems are mutually exclusive from multiplication or math.

Would you complain if, instead of the question about oranges, the question was

"If 4 men paint a house, how much of the house will each person paint?" to teach fractions?

And again, without the context of the entire topic of slavery (or human rights) in this class, you cannot accurately evaluate the appropriateness of the question.

I've said already that the questions were inappropriate. They are NOT racist.

How inappropriate they are cannot be concluded based on the miniscule bit of information we have.

 

[threelittleturds]

I'm done getting trolled, dude. If you think all assumptions are equally valid, I pity you. Seriously, I do. My hunch is that you don't. If this is true, and you think that somehow the usage of the name Frederick is coincidence, I feel sorry and will say a prayer tonight that you not reproduce and that you have a job of minimal importance. In all seriousness, though, I think you know that I am right and are just trolling. Hopefully, a mod will see this and ban you. We come to SportsHoopla precisely to avoid crap like this.

Dude, the only one trolling is you. You come in here saying that we've assumed this and that, and that you find that appalling and disgusting.... when the ONLY thing you are doing is assuming and arguing based on that assumption.

Oh, but it isn't an assumption in your case, is it?? It is logical reasoning. So, because the slave was named Frederick, you've assumed it was Frederick Douglass and you've assumed that the other lesson was something positive about Douglass, focused on his triumph of overcoming slavery was it??

Which as I pointed out, is why the test asked how many freed slaves Douglass taught how to read.... oh wait... it asked how many times he was beaten.

Yeah, hopefully one of the mods bans me for responding to a guy who comes to the 49ers board and jumps into a topic that I started, you got me, this was all an elaborate trap to get you to come here so I could troll you....

Guilty as charged... and you fell for it... sucker.

 

[NinerSickness]

I've said already that the questions were inappropriate. They are NOT racist.

That just about says it all, and it didn't take 3 pages of posts.

 

[Mozart'sGhost]

I know that anyone can be racist but you are an idiot for believing that sleeping with someone outside your race makes yo a racist. Or is it only back dudes that sleep with white women that are racist?[/QUOTE]

Can you blame them? White women are awesome!

 

[TheNinerMind]

That just about says it all, and it didn't take 3 pages of posts.

Agreed.

 

[Crimsoncrew]

Wow people like this piss me off she shouldn't have a job. I am a strict supporter that teachers should be at the same level as doctors. We need the best and brightest teaching our kids. But unions make it impossible to get rid of bad teachers.

And teachers aren't paid nearly as much as doctors.