One win teams that aren't dead yet

[Southieinnc]

I'll bet you said the same thing about the Patriots and Tom Brady after the first 4 games last year.

No, he was banned to extremeraven - arguing with himself......

 

[tducey]

KC, Baltimore and Philadelphia

 

[Broncos6482]

QUOTE="cdumler7, post: 7328177, member: 5773"]The reason they lose a percentage point has a lot to do with who won. Because Cincinnati won and owns what is essentially a 4 game lead over the Ravens it lowers their chances of winning the division and making the playoffs. When you throw in there are 5 teams ahead of them in the wild card race with every single team beyond that tied with the Ravens the odds just do not look good. Doesn't mean they are out of it but they better hope about half the teams in the AFC start losing quite a bit. The worst part for the Ravens right now because divisional wins don't mean as much unless you are tied in your division is that they have played all 4 games against AFC opponents and lost 3 of those. IF these were losses to the NFC then not quite as damaging but Conference games play a huge part in playoff seeding.

Yawn.

1/4 of season down and the tuffest part of our season over... we shall see...[/QUOTE]

I'm not sure about that, the Ravens final 4 games are pretty brutal. Seahawks, Chiefs, Steelers, @Bengals. The good news for the Ravens is that 3 of those games are at home, but that still looks like a really tough stretch. And all 4 of those teams are better than the Raiders.

 

[Broncos6482]

You are right to a degree. 4 games in a lot is left to be decided. History shows us though teams like the Ravens who started 0-3 rarely ever make the playoffs. In fact since 1990 (25 years) only 3 teams have accomplished this. Heck since 1981 only 5 teams have made it and the 1982 Bucs who did did so because so many players were striking at the time and they ended up taking extra teams to the post season. So essentially 4 teams since 1981 have started 0-3 and made the playoffs. Also the last team to do so was the 1998 Bills. Only 1 of these 5 teams that made the playoffs advanced further than the Wild Card round and they lost in the divisional round. So again not a death blow to start 0-3 but it has shown in history that very few teams can recover from such a start.

Bingo. The Ravens are fighting against history. Can they do it? Of course. Is it likely? Nope.

 

[sonnyblack65]

I didn't see you on here when NE beat Pitt by 7 without Pitts #1 weapon in Leveon Bell?

That offense does nothing with Bell off the field.

Junk td with no time left to make it a 7 point game, but Pats also didn't have their RB Blount in. I don't know if you remember but Blount is the guy who had 3 td's in his last game. You predicted that Pitt would put up over 40 on the Pats D, how'd that work out?

 

[sonnyblack65]

They have no chance bc Manning is so limited and teams can shut him down...period. Of the teams with a chance in the post season Denver isnt one.

Baltimore won it in 2000 w/o a QB so of course a great D can win a SB. Denver's D causes up to 5 t/o's a game. That secondary is right there with Seattle's with Harris Jr,Talib and Ward throw in pass rusher Ware and Miller, great recipe for success. Peyton limits his turnovers, they can beat any team in the nFL

 

[Oldschool739]

You are right to a degree. 4 games in a lot is left to be decided. History shows us though teams like the Ravens who started 0-3 rarely ever make the playoffs. In fact since 1990 (25 years) only 3 teams have accomplished this. Heck since 1981 only 5 teams have made it and the 1982 Bucs who did did so because so many players were striking at the time and they ended up taking extra teams to the post season. So essentially 4 teams since 1981 have started 0-3 and made the playoffs. Also the last team to do so was the 1998 Bills. Only 1 of these 5 teams that made the playoffs advanced further than the Wild Card round and they lost in the divisional round. So again not a death blow to start 0-3 but it has shown in history that very few teams can recover from such a start.

I understand your stat theory, but the problem with it is, there is no stat to measure heart, good fortune, bad fortune, any given Sunday etc.....
But you are entitled to your view as well as everyone else....

 

[cdumler7]

I understand your stat theory, but the problem with it is, there is no stat to measure heart, good fortune, bad fortune, any given Sunday etc.....
But you are entitled to your view as well as everyone else....

This is where you have to work on reading. I said "not a death blow to start 0-3." I have given you guys a chance. It has happened in the past. The problem being it rarely happens because it is hard to climb out of that hole. I will say though it does seem that the teams with the biggest heart and drive find a way to win those close ones. Not sure if the Ravens quite have that this year. It is why I said the loss of Suggs would be more than just his play on the field.

 

[Cincyfan78]

This is where you have to work on reading. I said "not a death blow to start 0-3." I have given you guys a chance. It has happened in the past. The problem being it rarely happens because it is hard to climb out of that hole. I will say though it does seem that the teams with the biggest heart and drive find a way to win those close ones. Not sure if the Ravens quite have that this year. It is why I said the loss of Suggs would be more than just his play on the field.

8.4% chance, right now, to make the playoffs. It not only hurts that the Ravens started out slowly, and 0-3, but all of their losses have come to AFC teams which could trump them come seeding/playoff time when it comes down to the final spots.

That last stretch of games is probably tougher than the start of the season. Most likely, those teams are all going to be in a fight for the playoffs. Very tough stretch of games, even at home.

 

[Oldschool739]

Baltimore won it in 2000 w/o a QB so of course a great D can win a SB. Denver's D causes up to 5 t/o's a game. That secondary is right there with Seattle's with Harris Jr,Talib and Ward throw in pass rusher Ware and Miller, great recipe for success. Peyton limits his turnovers, they can beat any team in the nFL

True Sonny but remember we only won once with bum qb's even though the D was a power house...
So even though Denver has a really good D doesn't mean they will automatically advance in the playoffs....
PM is still a good qb, but if the injury bug hits them, it's over....
And teams like your boys with the WCO are their Krytonite, PM knows because he was ours at one time....

 

[cdumler7]

8.4% chance, right now, to make the playoffs. It not only hurts that the Ravens started out slowly, and 0-3, but all of their losses have come to AFC teams which could trump them come seeding/playoff time when it comes down to the final spots.

That last stretch of games is probably tougher than the start of the season. Most likely, those teams are all going to be in a fight for the playoffs. Very tough stretch of games, even at home.

Agree it is not only that they started out 0-3 but that they started out 0-3 against conference opponents. That means head to head and conference ranking both come into play making it very difficult to see Baltimore winning many tie breakers at the end of the year.

 

[sonnyblack65]

True Sonny but remember we only won once with bum qb's even though the D was a power house...
So even though Denver has a really good D doesn't mean they will automatically advance in the playoffs....
PM is still a good qb, but if the injury bug hits them, it's over....
And teams like your boys with the WCO are their Krytonite, PM knows because he was ours at one time....

I hear you OS I'm sure Broncos will get to the playoffs, how far they will go we don't know. They actually might go further if Manning is a little limited and doesnt try to shoulder the game on his own shoulders. The D has actually won I think all 3-4 games this year. He gave up 10 points to Minn on his 2 picks but D stepped up. They were losing to KC but 5 t/o's incl fumble return for a td wins game vs KC. Talib's pick 6 vs your team, please the int at the very end to win that game etc

 

[Cincyfan78]

Agree it is not only that they started out 0-3 but that they started out 0-3 against conference opponents. That means head to head and conference ranking both come into play making it very difficult to see Baltimore winning many tie breakers at the end of the year.

Yes.

Not just when you lose, but who you lose to that can hurt at the end of the year.

Still some tough games in the middle, too. @ Arizona and then home against S.D.

Then the final 4 games stretch against teams that will, most likely, be fighting for playoff spots in Seattle, KC, Pitt, and Cin.

 

[Oldschool739]

I hear you OS I'm sure Broncos will get to the playoffs, how far they will go we don't know. They actually might go further if Manning is a little limited and doesnt try to shoulder the game on his own shoulders. The D has actually won I think all 3-4 games this year. He gave up 10 points to Minn on his 2 picks but D stepped up. They were losing to KC but 5 t/o's incl fumble return for a td wins game vs KC. Talib's pick 6 vs your team, please the int at the very end to win that game etc

Wade Phillips has a tendency to over blitz and good qb's are gonna do to them what PM used to do to us, Burn em.....
He knocked us out of the playoffs a few times but we got him back with the Mile High Joe Bomb on our way to SB47.....Revenge is pretty sweet !!

 

[cdumler7]

Yes.

Not just when you lose, but who you lose to that can hurt at the end of the year.

Still some tough games in the middle, too. @ Arizona and then home against S.D.

Then the final 4 games stretch against teams that will, most likely, be fighting for playoff spots in Seattle, KC, Pitt, and Cin.

Yeah I would much rather have played those first 4 games than those final 4 games. The Broncos have shown they can be beat right now with the offense floundering. Oakland has a lot of young pieces that are up and down. Cincinnati I would agree not a game anybody wants to play right now with how they are playing. Pittsburgh they squeaked by without Roethlisberger. So to me 3 of those first 4 games were catching teams at the right time of the season yet they still went 1-3. Seattle, KC, and Pitt are all struggling right now but I doubt they stay down unless the injury bug keeps hitting Pitt and Seattle and KC don't get their OL's figured out even a little bit.

 

[cdumler7]

Wade Phillips has a tendency to over blitz and good qb's are gonna do to them what PM used to do to us, Burn em.....
He knocked us out of the playoffs a few times but we got him back with the Mile High Joe Bomb on our way to SB47.....Revenge is pretty sweet !!

Other than Brady what other great QB's have shown up in the AFC right now though? There really is a lack of good QB's in the AFC especially with Luck injured and really struggling.

Also while the Broncos have blitzed a decent number of times they have shown great ability with just the Front 4 to get home just as well as that of the blitz. I would also say that Wade Phillips has never had 2 Corners like that of Talib and Harris playing for him. They were both top-7 Corners last year before Phillips got here so even without his system they have played well. Phillips can trust the secondary to hold up even if the blitz doesn't get there right away.

 

[Oldschool739]

This is where you have to work on reading. I said "not a death blow to start 0-3." I have given you guys a chance. It has happened in the past. The problem being it rarely happens because it is hard to climb out of that hole. I will say though it does seem that the teams with the biggest heart and drive find a way to win those close ones. Not sure if the Ravens quite have that this year. It is why I said the loss of Suggs would be more than just his play on the field.

I have no problem reading, it seems you have one with any view other than your own...
I said it clearly, stats are just guessing tools, but you don't get it....
I'll just wait til a picture so clear that Bill Clinton couldn't spin it arises this season and then I'll remind you...
Until then, load up on your stats, mortgage the house and bet the farm on what they say...
We'll see how it all shakes out....

 

[Oldschool739]

Other than Brady what other great QB's have shown up in the AFC right now though? There really is a lack of good QB's in the AFC especially with Luck injured and really struggling.

Also while the Broncos have blitzed a decent number of times they have shown great ability with just the Front 4 to get home just as well as that of the blitz. I would also say that Wade Phillips has never had 2 Corners like that of Talib and Harris playing for him. They were both top-7 Corners last year before Phillips got here so even without his system they have played well. Phillips can trust the secondary to hold up even if the blitz doesn't get there right away.

Well, Dalton is playing at a high level, Rivers is always a threat, you guys barely got past us and every game as a matter of fact.....Dude, you are clearly high on the kool aid right now and you need to step back and get real....
Wade can't change his stripes, he is what he is and there is lots of film on his D's.....
My opinion is that you guys have simply been lucky, you could very well be 0-4 right now and probably should be...The only reason they aren't is the D has been carrying the load....
But you can't expect them to do it every game....
BB will eat them alive, Wade is just another fat journey man DC to the likes him and other detailed coaches....

 

[cdumler7]

Well, Dalton is playing at a high level, Rivers is always a threat, you guys barely got past us and every game as a matter of fact.....Dude, you are clearly high on the kool aid right now and you need to step back and get real....
Wade can't change his stripes, he is what he is and there is lots of film on his D's.....
My opinion is that you guys have simply been lucky, you could very well be 0-4 right now and probably should be...The only reason they aren't is the D has been carrying the load....
But you can't expect them to do it every game....
BB will eat them alive, Wade is just another fat journey man DC to the likes him and other detailed coaches....

As I have told Tgann I have no issue with the idea that my team can and will eventually lose. How they do in the playoffs we shall see. I can see them losing first round heck I can still see them missing the playoffs. How is that for drinking cool aid. You and Tgann though seem so fixated on Manning and only Manning and either A) thinking he will continue to play the way he has up to this point all year (which hey is possible) or B) say he does turn it around he will just blow it in the playoffs when it really matters (again very possible). Both of you have said that you love Manning but honestly your posts just seem to suggest you just hope he fails and the Broncos fail just more to be proven right than anything else. The problem is I agree with you guys that all of these things could cost the Broncos. I can also see though Manning turning it around. I can also see this defense being the real deal and being the most talented group that Wade has ever had to execute his very aggressive style of defense.

As for him being a journeyman. Well usually journeyman types who people figure out don't last from clear back in 1969 to now. There is a reason he keeps finding work because people love what he brings to the table. And if people have figured out his defense then why are they the #1 ranked defense? I mean if it is so easy to beat why does it take an elite QB to do it as you are suggesting? So essentially you are saying about 3-4 teams can actually do well against this defense? And hey guess what maybe you are right that they will tear this defense apart. We will find out in just a few weeks as the Broncos play the Packers in Denver. That should be a huge test to see if this defense is more than just a good group.

 

[Oldschool739]

As I have told Tgann I have no issue with the idea that my team can and will eventually lose. How they do in the playoffs we shall see. I can see them losing first round heck I can still see them missing the playoffs. How is that for drinking cool aid. You and Tgann though seem so fixated on Manning and only Manning and either A) thinking he will continue to play the way he has up to this point all year (which hey is possible) or B) say he does turn it around he will just blow it in the playoffs when it really matters (again very possible). Both of you have said that you love Manning but honestly your posts just seem to suggest you just hope he fails and the Broncos fail just more to be proven right than anything else. The problem is I agree with you guys that all of these things could cost the Broncos. I can also see though Manning turning it around. I can also see this defense being the real deal and being the most talented group that Wade has ever had to execute his very aggressive style of defense.

As for him being a journeyman. Well usually journeyman types who people figure out don't last from clear back in 1969 to now. There is a reason he keeps finding work because people love what he brings to the table. And if people have figured out his defense then why are they the #1 ranked defense? I mean if it is so easy to beat why does it take an elite QB to do it as you are suggesting? So essentially you are saying about 3-4 teams can actually do well against this defense? And hey guess what maybe you are right that they will tear this defense apart. We will find out in just a few weeks as the Broncos play the Packers in Denver. That should be a huge test to see if this defense is more than just a good group.

Back peddling, sweet !!