Offseason Discussion-2013 Edition

[calsnowskier]

KNBR (Larry and Gary) are saying that Vogey should have left that in the locker room. They know he didn't mean any harm by it and that he's a great guy, but that him saying that could be construed as the Giants team thought violence against women is funny.

I don't have a particular stance one way or the other. I know they just probably all thought that it was crazy and that Vogey doesn't really believe in that stuff.....that said, it probably should have stayed in the clubhouse.

I love the logic...

Video "A" is incredibly popular on the net
Player "1" makes reference to Video "A"
Video "A" contains Act "Z"

therefore...

Player "1" always endorses Act "Z"

 

[filosofy29]

I love the logic...

Video "A" is incredibly popular on the net
Player "1" makes reference to Video "A"
Video "A" contains Act "Z"

therefore...

Player "1" always endorses Act "Z"

The logic by KNBR or myself? I'm sure you know that I know what a syllogism is . However, we live in a society where ignorance, lack of comprehension and overreaction (or PCD's ) are seemingly ubiquitous. Larry wasn't saying that he thought that Vogey was endorsing that video at all (nor was I). He was just saying that people could misconstrue the meaning or intention behind what he said. I haven't heard anybody allude to what you are saying above. If I heard him right, I think all he was saying was that he (Vogey) made a judgement error (in Larry's opinion) and should have left that humor in the locker room.

 

[Epic Voidfield]

Does anyone have a clip of the gesture by any chance?

Edit: Just saw it. Larry Krueger is an idiot.

 

[tzill]

Does anyone have a clip of the gesture by any chance?

Edit: Just saw it. Larry Krueger is an idiot.

I don't disagree that LK is an idiot, but I think he makes a fair point this time. Not Vogey's best moment.

 

[filosofy29]

I don't disagree that LK is an idiot, but I think he makes a fair point this time. Not Vogey's best moment.

This ^. And I'm a huge Vogey fan and still am. I don't think any less of Vogey than I did before his speach. He still seems like an awesome individual. Hell, I laugh at/watch videos that I shouldn't laugh at all the time; I'm not making any judgements at all. In my humble opinion though, Vogey probably should have left that in the locker room for his own benefit. He has the right to free speech and I'm not saying he DID anything wrong. I just think he may have to explain himself now and talk about what is 99% likely to be a non-issue.

 

[calsnowskier]

The logic by KNBR or myself? I'm sure you know that I know what a syllogism is . However, we live in a society where ignorance, lack of comprehension and overreaction (or PCD's ) are seemingly ubiquitous. Larry wasn't saying that he thought that Vogey was endorsing that video at all (nor was I). He was just saying that people could misconstrue the meaning or intention behind what he said. I haven't heard anybody allude to what you are saying above. If I heard him right, I think all he was saying was that he (Vogey) made a judgement error (in Larry's opinion) and should have left that humor in the locker room.

Not directed to YOU at all.

Kinda directed at KNBR for bringing it up.

Definitely directed at anyone who would actually make that leap.

 

[gp956]

Baggs reporting the Giants won't make any qualifying offer to their FA, particularly to Pagan - of course, it would only make sense to do so for him. This means any team can sign Pagan without forfeiting a first round draft choice. Seems like a quiet way for the Giants to thank him for his contributions, i.e. ensures he'll get maximum exposure on the FA market.

 

[filosofy29]

Baggs reporting the Giants won't make any qualifying offer to their FA, particularly to Pagan - of course, it would only make sense to do so for him. This means any team can sign Pagan without forfeiting a first round draft choice. Seems like a quiet way for the Giants to thank him for his contributions, i.e. ensures he'll get maximum exposure on the FA market.

gp, do you think that means there's little to no chance that he is a Giant next season? That's what it sounds like to me, even though the Giants are doing him solid.

 

[gp956]

gp, do you think that means there's little to no chance that he is a Giant next season? That's what it sounds like to me, even though the Giants are doing him solid.

No. I think it's a way for the team to let Pagan know that they aren't going to low ball him by limiting the market for him. It's a goodwill gesture, IMO.

 

[calsnowskier]

Isn't the qualifying bid approx 1/13?

Haven't we been placing his value somewhere between 8-10M per year?

Seems a no-brainer to me.

The main question to me is if Bourne gets a QO from the Braves or not.

 

[gp956]

Isn't the qualifying bid approx 1/13?

Haven't we been placing his value somewhere between 8-10M per year?

Seems a no-brainer to me.

The main question to me is if Bourne gets a QO from the Braves or not.

What's a no-brainer?

 

[calsnowskier]

What's a no-brainer?

Not giving him the Qualifying Offer. If we deem his value at approx 8-10, then why give him a guaranteed 13? It would destroy all of our bargaining power.

Right?

 

[gp956]

Not giving him the Qualifying Offer. If we deem his value at approx 8-10, then why give him a guaranteed 13? It would destroy all of our bargaining power.

Right?

He's looking for three+ years. There's some risk for him to accept a one year offer, even if it's for 13.3M.

 

[calsnowskier]

In a video-game world (no personalities, no hurt feelings for nasty negotiating etc), would you take Pagan on a 1/13? If you offered it to him, would he take it?

Personally, I think a 1/13 is significantly too much, with little/no upside. I think that it is soo far above market for him, that there would be a decent shot at him taking it. At worst, it would be the starting point of any negotiations. Without the QO, negotiations will start at 1/10, 3/24, something around that neighborhood instead.

 

[gp956]

I think that it is soo far above market for him, that there would be a decent shot at him taking it.

Highly unlikely. The downside risk for him is too great. I know someone just threw this out there to see if it sticks, but 5/60 has been mentioned for Pagan.

At worst, it would be the starting point of any negotiations.

There's no necessary reason for the total annual value of a mult-year contract to be connected to a QO. Apple and Oranges, i.e. it won't set the annual value of his next contract.

 

[GiantsPackersChamps2011]

So Bourn wants 100M.
Ummm......best of luck to you Michael


What do you guys think BJ Upton would cost. Would love to see him in a Giants uni

 

[tzill]

Highly unlikely. The downside risk for him is too great. I know someone just threw this out there to see if it sticks, but 5/60 has been mentioned for Pagan.



There's no necessary reason for the total annual value of a mult-year contract to be connected to a QO. Apple and Oranges, i.e. it won't set the annual value of his next contract.

I agree. And I also think that if a team offers Oxy 5/60 he should take it and I wish him good luck. No more albatross contracts. We just got rid of RoRo and Huffer, and Zeets comes off the books next year. The Gs are a model of smart spending and astute signings, no way we give Oxy more than 3 years.

 

[tzill]

From the dog bites man file:

Giants Decline Aubrey Huff's Option: MLB Rumors - MLBTradeRumors.com

 

[SFAnthem]

From the dog bites man file:

Giants Decline Aubrey Huff's Option: MLB Rumors - MLBTradeRumors.com

Agent Ned... Left handed power bat off the bench on line 1

 

[calsnowskier]

If someone wants to pay Pagan 5/60, I agree. Congrats to him. I hope the G's thank him for the ring and move on.